My, God, my God, why?

[placebofactor]

The following will likely open a can of worms. But it’s a subject that must be fully understood, not through the eyes of commentators or religious organizations, but understood by the authority of the Holy Spirit. Before you answer, consider all the details that led up to this moment.

It concerns Matthew 27:46. We find Jesus hanging from the cross, looking down at a mob of Jews, Gentiles, and religious leaders who hated him. These were people he taught, healed, and fed. Before he died, he made two statements. The first,

“My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” The word forsaken means to abandon completely, to turn one’s back on someone, and walk away.

His last words are found in Luke 23:46, “Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.” Then his spirit left him.

There appear to be two strikingly different statements coming from a dying man, a man who had just suffered the excruciating pain of the cross. Here’s the question: When Jesus said, “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” was he speaking to his Father, or to those who were spitting on him, and mocking him? These were the same people he walked with for 3 ½ years, fed, healed, and showed many signs and wonders to.
Your thoughts.

[onewithhim]

So you believe Jesus is a true God?

Yes...

So you have no problem calling Jesus --> A < ----God ?





JW

How many TRUE GODs are there ? [Only True God explained]
viewtopic.php?p=1114357#p1114357

True Godship of Jesus is my main concern not the "a".
I know you worship Jesus, but Jesus said, "worship the Lord your God and serve Him only."
Why you would not answer the question;
Whose words you only obey? Jesus or the Father?

For mankind, there is one true God, he's called in the O.T. Jehovah, in the new, he is called Jesus. And whatever he does, or speaks, his blessings and judgments are all done to glorify his Father who is also known as Jehovah.

I don't know if you remember George Forman, he was the heavyweight boxing champion for three different decades. He has a family and has four sons. Their names are, George, George, George and George. My Father's name was Phillip, and my name is Phillip. If my mother wanted me, and my father and I were in the same room, she said, "Hay you" then I knew she wanted me. I cannot, for the life of me understand why it's so difficult for anyone to understand that the Son of God, who is the express image and likeness of his Father carries the same name as his father. It's a common practice worldwide and has been in all generations.

Do you mean that the Father in the OT is Jesus in the NT?

Isaiah 9:6, Unto the Jews, a son is given: "And the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, the mighty God, the everlasting FATHER, the Prince of Peace."

Look at that verse and give it a lot of consideration. First of all, Isaiah was a Jew living under the law. If Isaiah had been lying about the Son of God being called God and Father, and the religious leaders thought he was worshipping another God or a god, or wrongly calling the Son Father, they would have stoned him to death. That was the law.

Isaiah was a prophet of God, the prophecy in Isaiah 9:6 came to him from the LORD. Verse 10, The increase of (Jesus) government and peace there shall be no end," Compare with,

Titus 2:13, "Looking for the blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great (mighty) God and our Savior Jesus Christ;" Verse 14, "Who gave himself for us," If you don't read anything into it, you will understand.

Paul in 1 Corinthians 1:7 tells us who to look for, "waiting for the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ:"

One more time: Jesus is our God, Father, Saviour, Hope, Redeemer, Judge, and future Husband, ALL TO THE GLORY OF HIS FATHER. The bride of Christ will one day stand before Jesus' Father, who will welcome his Son and his bride with open arms.

Yes, if we also understand who Jesus is in the NT as "and God was the word" in John 1:1.
And the Word was made flesh, and dwell among us.

If you noticed two is being mentioned on verses below. The "word of the Lord" and Abram and Samuel addressed as the "LORD".
And in 1 Sam 3:21, the LORD appeared again in Shiloh and revealed Himself by "the word of the Lord".
It appears that there are two beings/person, the "LORD" the Tetragrammaton" and the "word of the Lord" as to me the one when the Father said, "let us make man in our image."

Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came unto Abram in a vision, saying, Fear not, Abram: I am thy shield, and thy exceeding great reward.
Gen 15:2 And Abram said, Lord GOD, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?
Gen 15:3 And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir.

Gen 15:4 And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.
Gen 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
Gen 15:6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness

1Sa 3:1 And the child Samuel ministered unto the LORD before Eli. And the word of the LORD was precious in those days; there was no open vision.
1Sa 3:10 And the LORD came, and stood, and called as at other times, Samuel, Samuel. Then Samuel answered, Speak; for thy servant heareth.
1Sa 3:11 And the LORD said to Samuel, Behold, I will do a thing in Israel, at which both the ears of every one that heareth it shall tingle

1Sa 3:21 And the LORD appeared again in Shiloh: for the LORD revealed himself to Samuel in Shiloh by the word of the LORD

Yes...

So you have no problem calling Jesus --> A < ----God ?





JW

How many TRUE GODs are there ? [Only True God explained]
viewtopic.php?p=1114357#p1114357

True Godship of Jesus is my main concern not the "a".
I know you worship Jesus, but Jesus said, "worship the Lord your God and serve Him only."
Why you would not answer the question;
Whose words you only obey? Jesus or the Father?

For mankind, there is one true God, he's called in the O.T. Jehovah, in the new, he is called Jesus. And whatever he does, or speaks, his blessings and judgments are all done to glorify his Father who is also known as Jehovah.

I don't know if you remember George Forman, he was the heavyweight boxing champion for three different decades. He has a family and has four sons. Their names are, George, George, George and George. My Father's name was Phillip, and my name is Phillip. If my mother wanted me, and my father and I were in the same room, she said, "Hay you" then I knew she wanted me. I cannot, for the life of me understand why it's so difficult for anyone to understand that the Son of God, who is the express image and likeness of his Father carries the same name as his father. It's a common practice worldwide and has been in all generations.

Do you mean that the Father in the OT is Jesus in the NT?

Isaiah 9:6, Unto the Jews, a son is given: "And the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, the mighty God, the everlasting FATHER, the Prince of Peace."

Look at that verse and give it a lot of consideration. First of all, Isaiah was a Jew living under the law. If Isaiah had been lying about the Son of God being called God and Father, and the religious leaders thought he was worshipping another God or a god, or wrongly calling the Son Father, they would have stoned him to death. That was the law.

Isaiah was a prophet of God, the prophecy in Isaiah 9:6 came to him from the LORD. Verse 10, The increase of (Jesus) government and peace there shall be no end," Compare with,

Titus 2:13, "Looking for the blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great (mighty) God and our Savior Jesus Christ;" Verse 14, "Who gave himself for us," If you don't read anything into it, you will understand.

Titus 2:13 refers to two individuals, "the great God AND our savior Jesus Christ." That is not "reading anything into it."

The Messiah was called "mighty god" not because he was THE Almighty God, but a revered and powerful individual, which would be commonly called a "god" in the Greek and Hebrew understanding. "Mighty God" is "El Gibbohr." Jesus was El Gibbohr but never "El Shaddai," which means God Almighty.

"Everlasting father" would mean that Jesus is a life-giver, which a father is. He is the supreme life-giver for mankind, so he could be referred to as a father to us.

I just wonder who does the "I" referred to on the verses below.
The context does not mention of two persons saying "I".

Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star

onewithhim says; There are two "I"s featured there. The Father has a say, and the Son also does. The Alpha and Omega verses refer to the Father (who sent this Revelation to Jesus). He has more to say than Jesus does in this book of Revelation.



Yes, the Father gave Jesus to reveal concerning things before unknown.
And I cannot see in context that though revelation was already given to Jesus, the Father also revealed about Himself to apostle John.
One of the "I", mentioned Jesus and no one other in the two verses.

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
Rev 1:2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw

You apparently aren't really familiar with the book of Revelation. The Father revealed much about Himself, if you would take the time to read it. Rev.1:2---John did "bear record of the word of God" throughout the book, as well as the testimony of Christ.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to Capbook in post #47]

Issues to consider when making a determination as to whether Jesus was speaking to those standing before him, or to his Father.

Its ludicrous to suggest Jesus referred to the people around him as his God even more that he was speaking to us (why would Jesus call his modern day followers and /or unbelievers his "God"!?) . Jesus obviously was not calling on himself his God , so the only reasonable conclusion is that Jesus was calling on his Father Jehovah.

According to Witnesses { snip} ....

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

JOHN 13:13 KJV:

Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.

How can you reconcile the above with Jesus under any circumstance calling humans his God?

[placebofactor]

[Replying to Capbook in post #47]

Issues to consider when making a determination as to whether Jesus was speaking to those standing before him, or to his Father.

Its ludicrous to suggest Jesus referred to the people around him as his God

I have no idea what you're talking about.


even more that he was speaking to us (why would Jesus call his modern day followers and /or unbelievers his "God"!?) . Jesus obviously was not calling on himself his God , so the only reasonable conclusion is that Jesus was calling on his Father Jehovah.

Again, do you make these things up?


According to Witnesses { snip} ....

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

He never did, whoever said he did, it wasn't me.

JOHN 13:13 KJV:

Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.

First thing you said right.

How can you reconcile the above with Jesus under any circumstance calling humans his God?

Who called humans God. What post did you read? You cannot be that confused, at least I hope not.

[JehovahsWitness]

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

He never did, whoever said he did, it wasn't me.

Okay sorry my apologies must have misread. So who was Jesus speaking to at his death when he said "my God" ?

[placebofactor]

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

He never did, whoever said he did, it wasn't me.

Okay sorry my apologies must have misread. So who was Jesus speaking to at his death when he said "my God" ?

Apology accepted. Picture this, several days before his death, Jesus sent his disciples, "Go into the village, ---- and straightway ye shall find an ass tied, and a colt with her: ----- loose them and bring them to me. This was done. Jesus then rode it through the streets of Jerusalem, the people spread their garments in the way; others cut down branches from the trees and spread them in the street as he rode through. He was their Messiah, their Savior. Matthew 21:8-9, "A multitude went before, and that followed, cried saying Ho-sa-na (an exclamation of adoration, "save now), to the son of David: Blessed is he that comes in the name of the LORD; Ho-san-na in the highest. They were giving Jesus the highest of praises.

Several days later the same people were saying to him, "Crucify him," "Let his blood be on us, and our children." They mocked him, spit on him, smote him on the head, then crucified him."

Now picture this: After what Jesus had done for the people for 3 1/2 years, healed them, fed them, showed them many miracles, then said to him, "Hosanna in the highest." Days later they were nailing him to a cross. While suspended between heaven and hell, he looks down on the mob and says to them, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

The Father loved his Son so much he would never forsake him, and Jesus loved his Father so much, that he would never accuse him of forsaking him. Common sense!

[JehovahsWitness]

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

He never did, whoever said he did, it wasn't me.

Okay sorry my apologies must have misread. So who was Jesus speaking to at his death when he said "my God" ?

Apology accepted. Picture this, several days before his death, Jesus sent his disciples, "Go into the village, ---- and straightway ye shall find an ass tied, and a colt with her: ----- loose them and bring them to me. This was done. Jesus then rode it through the streets of Jerusalem, the people spread their garments in the way; others cut down branches from the trees and spread them in the street as he rode through. He was their Messiah, their Savior. Matthew 21:8-9, "A multitude went before, and that followed, cried saying Ho-sa-na (an exclamation of adoration, "save now), to the son of David: Blessed is he that comes in the name of the LORD; Ho-san-na in the highest. They were giving Jesus the highest of praises.

Several days later the same people were saying to him, "Crucify him," "Let his blood be on us, and our children." They mocked him, spit on him, smote him on the head, then crucified him."

Now picture this: After what Jesus had done for the people for 3 1/2 years, healed them, fed them, showed them many miracles, then said to him, "Hosanna in the highest." Days later they were nailing him to a cross. While suspended between heaven and hell, he looks down on the mob and says to them, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

The Father loved his Son so much he would never forsake him, and Jesus loved his Father so much, that he would never accuse him of forsaking him. Common sense!

Sorry but it's still not clear to me who you believe he was speaking to. May I for clarity give you some options

(a) the crowd
(b) his disciples
(c) present day Christians
(d) himself
(e) his Father

(f) OTHER (please put one or two words here)

[placebofactor]

Accordjng to logic : why would Jesus refer to any human(s) at any time as HIS God ?

He never did, whoever said he did, it wasn't me.

Okay sorry my apologies must have misread. So who was Jesus speaking to at his death when he said "my God" ?

Apology accepted. Picture this, several days before his death, Jesus sent his disciples, "Go into the village, ---- and straightway ye shall find an ass tied, and a colt with her: ----- loose them and bring them to me. This was done. Jesus then rode it through the streets of Jerusalem, the people spread their garments in the way; others cut down branches from the trees and spread them in the street as he rode through. He was their Messiah, their Savior. Matthew 21:8-9, "A multitude went before, and that followed, cried saying Ho-sa-na (an exclamation of adoration, "save now), to the son of David: Blessed is he that comes in the name of the LORD; Ho-san-na in the highest. They were giving Jesus the highest of praises.

Several days later the same people were saying to him, "Crucify him," "Let his blood be on us, and our children." They mocked him, spit on him, smote him on the head, then crucified him."

Now picture this: After what Jesus had done for the people for 3 1/2 years, healed them, fed them, showed them many miracles, then said to him, "Hosanna in the highest." Days later they were nailing him to a cross. While suspended between heaven and hell, he looks down on the mob and says to them, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

The Father loved his Son so much he would never forsake him, and Jesus loved his Father so much, that he would never accuse him of forsaking him. Common sense!

Sorry but it's still not clear to me who you believe he was speaking to. May I for clarity give you some options

(a) the crowd
(b) his disciples
(c) present day Christians
(d) himself
(e) his Father

(f) OTHER (please put one or two words here)

The mob of Jews, his disciples, the Pharisees, and Sadducees. They had all forsaken him.

[JehovahsWitness]

The mob of Jews, his disciples, the Pharisees, and Sadducees. They had all forsaken him.

Why would Jesus call these humans his GOD (especially the the Pharisees, and Sadducees that had blasphemed his Messiahship?

JOHN 13:13 KJV:

Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.

[marke]

The following will likely open a can of worms. But it’s a subject that must be fully understood, not through the eyes of commentators or religious organizations, but understood by the authority of the Holy Spirit. Before you answer, consider all the details that led up to this moment.

It concerns Matthew 27:46. We find Jesus hanging from the cross, looking down at a mob of Jews, Gentiles, and religious leaders who hated him. These were people he taught, healed, and fed. Before he died, he made two statements. The first,

“My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” The word forsaken means to abandon completely, to turn one’s back on someone, and walk away.

His last words are found in Luke 23:46, “Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit.” Then his spirit left him.

There appear to be two strikingly different statements coming from a dying man, a man who had just suffered the excruciating pain of the cross. Here’s the question: When Jesus said, “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” was he speaking to his Father, or to those who were spitting on him, and mocking him? These were the same people he walked with for 3 ½ years, fed, healed, and showed many signs and wonders to.
Your thoughts.

Marke: God the Son came to earth to take upon Himself the form of man and to do what was necessary to secure man's redemption from sin. That involved Jesus becoming sin for us and enduring God's rejection of sin in Him so that we could be forgiven by God of our sins.

[placebofactor]

The mob of Jews, his disciples, the Pharisees, and Sadducees. They had all forsaken him.

Why would Jesus call these humans his GOD (especially the the Pharisees, and Sadducees that had blasphemed his Messiahship?

JOHN 13:13 KJV:

Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.

Jesus did not call humans God. I don't know who you are or where you're from, but here in America you will hear the expression "My God, I don't believe it!" Or "My God, why did you do that?" Or "My God, did you see that?" or, in disbelief people will say, My God, no!? and a thousand expressions like that.