Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[onewithhim]

Dear Onewithhim,

Without the "fall" There would be no need for. the forordained pan of God for a redeemer, ne atonement, no resurrection. The plan of God would have been frustrated.

You believe that God planned on Adam falling? That's not true. God foreordained people to rule with Christ in heaven only AFTER Adam fell. Jehovah certainly did not plan on Adam falling. He gave Adam a real choice. Obey or die.

Did God know before He commanded Adam not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil,
that Adam would disobey Him?

A. Yes
B. No

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

[Capbook]

Dear Onewithhim,

Without the "fall" There would be no need for. the forordained pan of God for a redeemer, ne atonement, no resurrection. The plan of God would have been frustrated.

You believe that God planned on Adam falling? That's not true. God foreordained people to rule with Christ in heaven only AFTER Adam fell. Jehovah certainly did not plan on Adam falling. He gave Adam a real choice. Obey or die.

Did God know before He commanded Adam not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil,
that Adam would disobey Him?

A. Yes
B. No

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

Yes, God said, "let us make man", that does not mean that He chose not to know the consequences of creating Adam and Eve.
Yes, God even grieved the wickedness of man, that also does not mean that He chose not to know it. (Gen 6:6)
Even us, we know that we will die and when the time comes, we grieved.

[onewithhim]

Dear Onewithhim,

Without the "fall" There would be no need for. the forordained pan of God for a redeemer, ne atonement, no resurrection. The plan of God would have been frustrated.

You believe that God planned on Adam falling? That's not true. God foreordained people to rule with Christ in heaven only AFTER Adam fell. Jehovah certainly did not plan on Adam falling. He gave Adam a real choice. Obey or die.

Did God know before He commanded Adam not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil,
that Adam would disobey Him?

A. Yes
B. No

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

Yes, God said, "let us make man", that does not mean that He chose not to know the consequences of creating Adam and Eve.
Yes, God even grieved the wickedness of man, that also does not mean that He chose not to know it. (Gen 6:6)
Even us, we know that we will die and when the time comes, we grieved.

What about the first part of my post, before "Let us make man"? It explains why God would not choose to know everything that would happen. What about that?

[tam]

Peace again to you,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #3219]

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that?

I think you may be overlooking something.

God would also have seen all the GOOD to come. Every time a person chose the right and rejected the wrong. Every time a person chose life; or each act of repentance, of faith, of love; each person who overcame the Adversary, who refused to 'curse God and die'. God would have seen His children; each time they acted in love (for Him, for His Son, for one another, even for their enemies - revealing themselves to be children of God.) He would also have seen His Son (Christ Jaheshua) and the choice that Son made out of love, and the love this would inspire in turn.

And He would have seen how everything turns out - the blessing, the paradise, the life, the comfort, the joy, the peace.

If He decided not to proceed - "Let us make man" - then He would have been preventing all of the above as well.

What Father would do that?


Peace again to you and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[onewithhim]

Peace again to you,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #3219]

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that?

I think you may be overlooking something.

God would also have seen all the GOOD to come. Every time a person chose the right and rejected the wrong. Every time a person chose life; or each act of repentance, of faith, of love; each person who overcame the Adversary, who refused to 'curse God and die'. God would have seen His children; each time they acted in love (for Him, for His Son, for one another, even for their enemies - revealing themselves to be children of God.) He would also have seen His Son (Christ Jaheshua) and the choice that Son made out of love, and the love this would inspire in turn.

And He would have seen how everything turns out - the blessing, the paradise, the life, the comfort, the joy, the peace.

If He decided not to proceed - "Let us make man" - then He would have been preventing all of the above as well.

What Father would do that?


Peace again to you and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

The loving Father would not consciously release into the world all the evil that has existed. He would not let the wickedness of men ---the molesting and killing of innocent children, the abuse that so many people suffer in excruciating ways, the horror of wars---be unleashed on the world.

[tam]

Peace to you,

Peace again to you,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #3219]

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that?

I think you may be overlooking something.

God would also have seen all the GOOD to come. Every time a person chose the right and rejected the wrong. Every time a person chose life; or each act of repentance, of faith, of love; each person who overcame the Adversary, who refused to 'curse God and die'. God would have seen His children; each time they acted in love (for Him, for His Son, for one another, even for their enemies - revealing themselves to be children of God.) He would also have seen His Son (Christ Jaheshua) and the choice that Son made out of love, and the love this would inspire in turn.

And He would have seen how everything turns out - the blessing, the paradise, the life, the comfort, the joy, the peace.

If He decided not to proceed - "Let us make man" - then He would have been preventing all of the above as well.

What Father would do that?


Peace again to you and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

The loving Father would not consciously release into the world all the evil that has existed. He would not let the wickedness of men ---the molesting and killing of innocent children, the abuse that so many people suffer in excruciating ways, the horror of wars---be unleashed on the world.

So you think that to prevent wickedness from coming into the world, He would also prevent the good, even His own children? And then what? Just scrap the entire idea of creation altogether?


Peace again.

[Capbook]

You believe that God planned on Adam falling? That's not true. God foreordained people to rule with Christ in heaven only AFTER Adam fell. Jehovah certainly did not plan on Adam falling. He gave Adam a real choice. Obey or die.

Did God know before He commanded Adam not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil,
that Adam would disobey Him?

A. Yes
B. No

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

Yes, God said, "let us make man", that does not mean that He chose not to know the consequences of creating Adam and Eve.
Yes, God even grieved the wickedness of man, that also does not mean that He chose not to know it. (Gen 6:6)
Even us, we know that we will die and when the time comes, we grieved.

What about the first part of my post, before "Let us make man"? It explains why God would not choose to know everything that would happen. What about that?

You have not provided even one text that proves that God chose not to know certain things.
Texts below proves that God was well informed of the great wickedness of man that He had made the decision to punish all to death, except the family of Noah. Imagine all to death and that was the result of God's decision of, "let us make man".
God foreknow everything what we will do in the future, good or bad, as He has given us the power to choose.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

[tam]

[Replying to tam in post #3226]

Peace again,

To add to the previous post, and as the spirit has reminded me, doesn't Matthew 13 - parable of the weeds - show that God would not uproot the weeds if it meant possibly harming the wheat?

Matt 13:29-30

[onewithhim]

Did God know before He commanded Adam not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil,
that Adam would disobey Him?

A. Yes
B. No

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

Yes, God said, "let us make man", that does not mean that He chose not to know the consequences of creating Adam and Eve.
Yes, God even grieved the wickedness of man, that also does not mean that He chose not to know it. (Gen 6:6)
Even us, we know that we will die and when the time comes, we grieved.

What about the first part of my post, before "Let us make man"? It explains why God would not choose to know everything that would happen. What about that?

You have not provided even one text that proves that God chose not to know certain things.
Texts below proves that God was well informed of the great wickedness of man that He had made the decision to punish all to death, except the family of Noah. Imagine all to death and that was the result of God's decision of, "let us make man".
God foreknow everything what we will do in the future, good or bad, as He has given us the power to choose.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

That was AFTER Adam and Eve were created. I'm talking about what he did or did not know before He created the earth and everything on it.

[Capbook]

No. He chose not to know. That is another thing God can do---choose not to know. Just because you can whistle, do you do it all the time? God can know all things, but He chooses not to know some things.

May I know what verse that says God chose not to know?

You missed again my question above onewithhim

I did answer, on another thread possibly. If He would know everything, that would mean that, prior to creating angels or humans, God exercised His powers of foreknowledge and foresaw all that would result from such creation, including the rebellion of Satan and Adam and Eve, and all the consequenses of such rebellion down to this day (and even beyond). This would mean that all the wickedness that history has recorded once existed , before creation's beginning, only in the mind of God. If God had indeed exercised His power to foreknow, then the full weight of all the wickedness resulting after that was deliberately set in motion by God when He spoke the words: "Let us make man." (Gen.1:26)

Why would He do that? He wouldn't, unless He was taking advantage of His ability to NOT foresee if He so wished.

If you believe that God is all knowing, then chose not to know certain things. The logic would be He does not know all things as there are certain things He does not know. As according to most theological interpretations, God, being omniscient (all-knowing), does not "choose" not to know things; however, some argue that God may choose to withhold certain knowledge from humans, even though He knows it, for reasons like allowing free will or protecting us from overwhelming information.

Will you please comment on what I wrote in the post and tell me why it is not worthy of consideration?

Yes, God said, "let us make man", that does not mean that He chose not to know the consequences of creating Adam and Eve.
Yes, God even grieved the wickedness of man, that also does not mean that He chose not to know it. (Gen 6:6)
Even us, we know that we will die and when the time comes, we grieved.

What about the first part of my post, before "Let us make man"? It explains why God would not choose to know everything that would happen. What about that?

You have not provided even one text that proves that God chose not to know certain things.
Texts below proves that God was well informed of the great wickedness of man that He had made the decision to punish all to death, except the family of Noah. Imagine all to death and that was the result of God's decision of, "let us make man".
God foreknow everything what we will do in the future, good or bad, as He has given us the power to choose.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

That was AFTER Adam and Eve were created. I'm talking about what he did or did not know before He created the earth and everything on it.

Ephesians 1:4 teaches that God “chose us in him [Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him.” This shows that God was not taken by surprise by the Fall, and had planned for it even before He created. He had already determined that Jesus would die for our sins and rise again. So this passage sweeps through all of salvation history, from the work of God in eternity past, to the believer’s present salvation and destiny in eternity future.
One of lexicon definition of "world" in Greek "kosmos" is universe, earth etc.

Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

κόσμος kosmos
Thayer Definition:
1) an apt and harmonious arrangement or constitution, order, government
2) ornament, decoration, adornment, i.e. the arrangement of the stars, ‘the heavenly hosts’, as the ornament of the heavens. 1Pe 3:3
3) the world, the universe
4) the circle of the earth, the earth