Why can't everyone understand the Bible?

[2timothy316]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

[2timothy316]

...Take your pick from: the trinity, ...

The word Trinity is not in the Bible, so it is not a Biblical problem.

Yet people continue to pick out pet scriptures to convince themselves and others that there is a triune god. Why didn't God see this issue coming and write something plainly so that there would be no confusion?

I think Bible speaks plainly for example by saying:

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

[1213]

...Take your pick from: the trinity, ...

The word Trinity is not in the Bible, so it is not a Biblical problem.

Yet people continue to pick out pet scriptures to convince themselves and others that there is a triune god. Why didn't God see this issue coming and write something plainly so that there would be no confusion?

I think Bible speaks plainly for example by saying:

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

I think that could not be clearer, so, I don't think it is because of the message, but because of something else. What that something else is, I don't know.

[Tcg]

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

God didn't write the Bible, men did. If there is a God, it isn't responsible for what men wrote. Odd that women weren't involved huh?

Tcg

[2timothy316]

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

God didn't write the Bible, men did. If there is a God, it isn't responsible for what men wrote. Odd that women weren't involved huh?

Tcg

That would still make it God's fault for choosing men. If angels wrote it instead do you think all people would then understand the Bible?

[bjs1]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

I disagree with this premise. I have found that most people agree on what it is that the Bible says the majority of the time. There are a variety of tertiary issue – such as the role of women specifically in church leadership – that are murky in the scriptures. People often exaggerate the importance of some texts while suppressing the importance of others in order to come to a disagreement. However, in most areas most people agree on what the Bible teaches.

Agreement doesn't mean understanding. During the middle ages it was agreed by many that spontaneous generation was how new animals were made. Leaves in water turned into fish and meat turned into maggots. Just because many agree on something doesn't mean it is understood.

You started this thread by saying, “Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is.” So your opening argument was that agreement is a sign of understanding.

If agreement doesn’t mean understanding then I don’t know how we determine if people do or do not understand the Bible.

If there is strong agreement about what a passage means then that would be evidence that if someone disagrees then that person is probably incorrect. Obviously there will always be someone out there who will disagree with anything. However, if 100 people study a document and 98 of them come to the same conclusion, then the most likely explanation is that the 2 people who came to a different conclusion did not understand the document. That won’t be true every time, but as a rule when 98% of people agree on the meaning of a Bible passage then that 98% correctly understands the passage and it is the 2% who do not understand the passage.

Yet this is not what we see in the world is it. There is not a 98% agreement on many things. Also, as I said, does the number people or percentage of a group that agree make something understood correctly? There are more people that think there is life after death, does that make all atheist wrong just because more people agree then disagree? Same goes for the Bible or even a single passage. Why does more in agreement make the other 2 of 100 wrong? What make you so sure that both the 98% and the 2% aren't both wrong? I don't see how numbers make something understood when throughout history there are many examples where this formula doesn't work.

But we are getting off topic. Lets take your %2 that don't understand, remember the OP question, why can't everyone understand the Bible? Why is it 98% and not 100%?

Again, you were the one who stated in your open post that agreement is a sign of understanding. You wrote, “Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is.” So clearly you think that agreement is a sign that people have understood the passage.

As for why it is not 100%, I would attribute that to human nature. There will always be people who disagree about anything. Consider the number of people alive today who think that the earth is flat. I cannot think of anything that has been universally agreed upon throughout history.

In this case we are talking about understanding what text means. No matter how straightforward a text is there will always be people who insist that it does not mean what virtually everyone else agrees that it does mean. Human nature will always be like that. However, when the vast majority of people from a wide variety of backgrounds agree on what something means then it is very likely that this is the correct understanding.

[2timothy316]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

I disagree with this premise. I have found that most people agree on what it is that the Bible says the majority of the time. There are a variety of tertiary issue – such as the role of women specifically in church leadership – that are murky in the scriptures. People often exaggerate the importance of some texts while suppressing the importance of others in order to come to a disagreement. However, in most areas most people agree on what the Bible teaches.

Agreement doesn't mean understanding. During the middle ages it was agreed by many that spontaneous generation was how new animals were made. Leaves in water turned into fish and meat turned into maggots. Just because many agree on something doesn't mean it is understood.

You started this thread by saying, “Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is.” So your opening argument was that agreement is a sign of understanding.

If agreement doesn’t mean understanding then I don’t know how we determine if people do or do not understand the Bible.

If there is strong agreement about what a passage means then that would be evidence that if someone disagrees then that person is probably incorrect. Obviously there will always be someone out there who will disagree with anything. However, if 100 people study a document and 98 of them come to the same conclusion, then the most likely explanation is that the 2 people who came to a different conclusion did not understand the document. That won’t be true every time, but as a rule when 98% of people agree on the meaning of a Bible passage then that 98% correctly understands the passage and it is the 2% who do not understand the passage.

Yet this is not what we see in the world is it. There is not a 98% agreement on many things. Also, as I said, does the number people or percentage of a group that agree make something understood correctly? There are more people that think there is life after death, does that make all atheist wrong just because more people agree then disagree? Same goes for the Bible or even a single passage. Why does more in agreement make the other 2 of 100 wrong? What make you so sure that both the 98% and the 2% aren't both wrong? I don't see how numbers make something understood when throughout history there are many examples where this formula doesn't work.

But we are getting off topic. Lets take your %2 that don't understand, remember the OP question, why can't everyone understand the Bible? Why is it 98% and not 100%?

Again, you were the one who stated in your open post that agreement is a sign of understanding. You wrote, “Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is.” So clearly you think that agreement is a sign that people have understood the passage.

Understanding the Bible appears to be subjective. I can read a passage and what I understand the passage to say doesn't always match another person's understanding. Take John 17:23 for example. Many read this and think of the trinity. I do not and never have.

As for why it is not 100%, I would attribute that to human nature. There will always be people who disagree about anything. Consider the number of people alive today who think that the earth is flat. I cannot think of anything that has been universally agreed upon throughout history.

In this case we are talking about understanding what text means. No matter how straightforward a text is there will always be people who insist that it does not mean what virtually everyone else agrees that it does mean. Human nature will always be like that. However, when the vast majority of people from a wide variety of backgrounds agree on what something means then it is very likely that this is the correct understanding.

Do you think people are born with this or is it a learned behavior?

[bjs1]

Understanding the Bible appears to be subjective. I can read a passage and what I understand the passage to say doesn't always match another person's understanding. Take John 17:23 for example. Many read this and think of the trinity. I do not and never have.

Personally, this would worry me a great deal.

If I were to read a passage of scripture and I saw something that almost everyone disagreed with, then I would be deeply concerned that I was mistaken.

Image that I read something (a verse from the Bible, or anything else). I thought it meant “X.” I met 99 other people who read the same words and one of them said, “Yes, it means X.” The other 98 people all said, “No, it means Y.” That would worry me.

It is possible that me and the one other guy got it right and the 98 other people were mistaken/fools/indoctrinated/etc., but that would be very unlikely. I would think it far more likely that I made a mistake.

I suppose that there is a part of me that would enjoy the fantasy of “I’m smart and everyone else is wrong,” but I am in reality too smart to indulge that fantasy for long. At minimum I would have to know how everyone else concluded that the text means “Y.” The idea 98% of people who study something agree on its meaning, and that meaning just isn’t in the text is not a reasonable possibility. At minimum the idea must be present, and odds are the text really does say “Y” and I just missed it.

So if almost everyone who reads John 17:23 thinks of the trinity, then some aspect of the trinity is almost certainly there. Some nuance might have been falsely applied, but that idea that no aspect of the trinity is there does not seem plausible.

[2timothy316]

Understanding the Bible appears to be subjective. I can read a passage and what I understand the passage to say doesn't always match another person's understanding. Take John 17:23 for example. Many read this and think of the trinity. I do not and never have.

Personally, this would worry me a great deal.

If I were to read a passage of scripture and I saw something that almost everyone disagreed with, then I would be deeply concerned that I was mistaken.

Image that I read something (a verse from the Bible, or anything else). I thought it meant “X.” I met 99 other people who read the same words and one of them said, “Yes, it means X.” The other 98 people all said, “No, it means Y.” That would worry me.

I am more scared that I accepted something a majority agreed with just because a majority agreed, only to find out that the majority was wrong. It's happened before, it happens now and it will happen in the future. Therefore I don't based what is right by what the majority agrees to. There are at least a billion that read support for the trinity in John 17:23 but those that don't are maybe in the hundreds of millions. Does just agreement my a majority make something right? Is that the standard we should be using so that we all understand the Bible the same way? Just following the majority?

It is possible that me and the one other guy got it right and the 98 other people were mistaken/fools/indoctrinated/etc., but that would be very unlikely. I would think it far more likely that I made a mistake.

How can we tell which is right when it comes to the Bible though?

I suppose that there is a part of me that would enjoy the fantasy of “I’m smart and everyone else is wrong,” but I am in reality too smart to indulge that fantasy for long. At minimum I would have to know how everyone else concluded that the text means “Y.” The idea 98% of people who study something agree on its meaning, and that meaning just isn’t in the text is not a reasonable possibility. At minimum the idea must be present, and odds are the text really does say “Y” and I just missed it.

So if almost everyone who reads John 17:23 thinks of the trinity, then some aspect of the trinity is almost certainly there. Some nuance might have been falsely applied, but that idea that no aspect of the trinity is there does not seem plausible.

But not impossible?

[onewithhim]

...Take your pick from: the trinity, ...

The word Trinity is not in the Bible, so it is not a Biblical problem.

Yet people continue to pick out pet scriptures to convince themselves and others that there is a triune god. Why didn't God see this issue coming and write something plainly so that there would be no confusion?

I think Bible speaks plainly for example by saying:

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

It's entirely men's fault for messing up translations. If we go back to the original languages we can get the meanings that are intended. Imagine....leaving the Author's name out of his own book! Most translations do that, even though God's name is in the Hebrew Scriptures 7,000 times. It is replaced with "LORD." That's just an example of the sloppy rendering by many translators.

[2timothy316]

...Take your pick from: the trinity, ...

The word Trinity is not in the Bible, so it is not a Biblical problem.

Yet people continue to pick out pet scriptures to convince themselves and others that there is a triune god. Why didn't God see this issue coming and write something plainly so that there would be no confusion?

I think Bible speaks plainly for example by saying:

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

It's entirely men's fault for messing up translations. If we go back to the original languages we can get the meanings that are intended. Imagine....leaving the Author's name out of his own book! Most translations do that, even though God's name is in the Hebrew Scriptures 7,000 times. It is replaced with "LORD." That's just an example of the sloppy rendering by many translators.

"They intend to make my people forget my name by the dreams they relate to one another, just as their fathers forgot my name because of Baʹal." - Jer 23:27
Interestingly, Ba'al just means master. Today's 'lord' is yesterday's Ba'al.

Which leads to another question. Could Satan be behind why the Bible is not universally understood?