witchcraft

[Telora]

Is there any middle ground between the actions that can be considered supernatural witchcraft and the faiths that directly forbid it, what exactly is forbidden and why?

[Divine Insight]

Burninglight wrote:

If what I say doesn't speak to your heart ignore it. The Lord does, sometimes, speak through people. If someone says a verse from the Bible or makes a comment about what I believe and it doesn't fit me, I don't wear it. Many people get offended and react if the shoe fits them. Are you one of them? How am I chastening you? I am not the Lord.

Burninglight condemns other people and then attempts to avoid responsibility by claiming he is "only the messenger."

Well, two can play that game. Psychology was not my major in school, but I have read enough to know that "psychologists say" that people with a very low sense of self-worth often persuade themselves that some superior being has recognized their great value and worth and has specially chosen them, revealed unto them the "true light" and raised them up among their fellows by delegating to them the awesome responsibility to carry the true Word unto their unfortunate fellows still wallowing in darkness, and to save them from their error. Of course, this humble person is only a messenger. It is up to us to recognize his vast superiority and worth as the chosen bearer of the word of God unto us.

Of course, this is not my judgment. I am not a psychologist. I am only the messenger.

You're not only a messenger John Paul, but you're a proverbial genius as well.

[Suluby]

Divine insight my comments about other religions or forgiving you for you insults to me is not judging you personally or any individual personally. Your comments like "He just keeps on preaching like a deaf dumb and blind energizer bunny; Your spreading of hatred (i.e. condemnation) in Jesus' name is truly disgusting." These are judgments.

You need to learn to not take my comments about witchcraft personally. Everyone does a certain amount of promoting their faith;' it is not always avoidable. You can say what you like about my faith. I don't take it personally. God doesn't need me to fight His battles for him. Maybe it is because Islam and witchcraft have no security from God that people take personally anything said against it. I haven't judged or condemned anyone that is not my job.

Oh

So if I say something about Christianity that you perceive to be insulting &/or wrong ..... you should not take it personally.

That is correct! I wouldn't be offended.

Then you should not speak up in defense of your beliefs. After all, you advise others not to when you are the one who's saying things!! Why are you giving people advice that you wouldn't follow?

That doesn't mean I won't share my opinion about any given comment or verses pertaining to it!

And others will share their opinions about your comments. After all ..... if you pay any attention to that "do unto others ...." thingy, you cannot object to others passing judgement on your beliefs since you pass judgement on ours.

According to my beliefs, Christianity offers no guarantees from G-d. No religion does.

That is incorrect. Romans 10 that if thou shall confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in thy heart that God raised Him from the dead, thou shall be saved

NO! That is what YOUR belief teaches.

You cannot speak to what *I* believe because you don't know. You have never ASKED ..... all you have done is tell me what you think I should believe.

My religion has nothing to do with Jesus ..... and anything Jesus had to say is irrelevant to what my beliefs are. Please remember that when you attempt to "correct" beliefs that are not wrong - just different from what you believe.

Judging and condemnation aren't your job, I agree. But that hasn't stopped you from saying judgmental and condemnatory things to anyone who disagrees with your version of Christianity.

You are intitled to your opinion. I don't believe I have judged anyone. Can you prove that?

LOL

So when you tell me that what I believe is wrong, that is not you judging my beliefs and finding them wanting in your HUMBLE opinion?


.

[Burninglight]

Burninglight wrote:

If what I say doesn't speak to your heart ignore it. The Lord does, sometimes, speak through people. If someone says a verse from the Bible or makes a comment about what I believe and it doesn't fit me, I don't wear it. Many people get offended and react if the shoe fits them. Are you one of them? How am I chastening you? I am not the Lord.

Burninglight condemns other people and then attempts to avoid responsibility by claiming he is "only the messenger."

Well, two can play that game. Psychology was not my major in school, but I have read enough to know that "psychologists say" that people with a very low sense of self-worth often persuade themselves that some superior being has recognized their great value and worth and has specially chosen them, revealed unto them the "true light" and raised them up among their fellows by delegating to them the awesome responsibility to carry the true Word unto their unfortunate fellows still wallowing in darkness, and to save them from their error. Of course, this humble person is only a messenger. It is up to us to recognize his vast superiority and worth as the chosen bearer of the word of God unto us.

Of course, this is not my judgment. I am not a psychologist. I am only the messenger.

There is some truth to what you say. It brings to mind what is written: But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;1Corn. 46-4:10 We are fools for Christ’s sake, but ye are wise in Christ; we are weak, but ye are strong; ye are honorable, but we are despised.

This is who Christ is to me:

I wonder what Jesus meant by Mat. 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you?

[Burninglight]

Divine insight my comments about other religions or forgiving you for you insults to me is not judging you personally or any individual personally. Your comments like "He just keeps on preaching like a deaf dumb and blind energizer bunny; Your spreading of hatred (i.e. condemnation) in Jesus' name is truly disgusting." These are judgments.

You need to learn to not take my comments about witchcraft personally. Everyone does a certain amount of promoting their faith;' it is not always avoidable. You can say what you like about my faith. I don't take it personally. God doesn't need me to fight His battles for him. Maybe it is because Islam and witchcraft have no security from God that people take personally anything said against it. I haven't judged or condemned anyone that is not my job.

Oh

So if I say something about Christianity that you perceive to be insulting &/or wrong ..... you should not take it personally.

That is correct! I wouldn't be offended.

Then you should not speak up in defense of your beliefs. After all, you advise others not to when you are the one who's saying things!! Why are you giving people advice that you wouldn't follow?

That doesn't mean I won't share my opinion about any given comment or verses pertaining to it!

And others will share their opinions about your comments. After all ..... if you pay any attention to that "do unto others ...." thingy, you cannot object to others passing judgement on your beliefs since you pass judgement on ours.

According to my beliefs, Christianity offers no guarantees from G-d. No religion does.

That is incorrect. Romans 10 that if thou shall confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in thy heart that God raised Him from the dead, thou shall be saved

NO! That is what YOUR belief teaches.

You cannot speak to what *I* believe because you don't know. You have never ASKED ..... all you have done is tell me what you think I should believe.

My religion has nothing to do with Jesus ..... and anything Jesus had to say is irrelevant to what my beliefs are. Please remember that when you attempt to "correct" beliefs that are not wrong - just different from what you believe.

Judging and condemnation aren't your job, I agree. But that hasn't stopped you from saying judgmental and condemnatory things to anyone who disagrees with your version of Christianity.

You are intitled to your opinion. I don't believe I have judged anyone. Can you prove that?

LOL

So when you tell me that what I believe is wrong, that is not you judging my beliefs and finding them wanting in your HUMBLE opinion?


.

I can judge your belief without judging you. I only speak of that which I know. I am done with this witchcraft thread. There is one thing in the Quran I agree with: "To you be your religion and to me be mine!" I have told you the truth the rest is on you!

[Divine Insight]

I wonder what Jesus meant by Mat. 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you?

Well, one way you could interpret that is to take it to mean that you aren't supposed to try to sell "holiness" to what you see as "unholy people".

Are you ever planning on actually following Jesus' advice about anything?

Or do you just enjoy using the hateful Hebrew scriptures as a feeble attempt to try to insult people by trying to insinuate that if they don't bow down and worship your preaching they are swine?

When preachers resort to such underhanded verses as this it's clear that they are scraping the bottom of the desperation barrel.

If you truly believe that you are casting pearls before swine then take Jesus' advice and stop doing it. Otherwise you're just demonstrating that you couldn't care less what Jesus taught.

[Divine Insight]

I am done with this witchcraft thread.

Thank you.

[Suluby]

Divine insight my comments about other religions or forgiving you for you insults to me is not judging you personally or any individual personally. Your comments like "He just keeps on preaching like a deaf dumb and blind energizer bunny; Your spreading of hatred (i.e. condemnation) in Jesus' name is truly disgusting." These are judgments.

You need to learn to not take my comments about witchcraft personally. Everyone does a certain amount of promoting their faith;' it is not always avoidable. You can say what you like about my faith. I don't take it personally. God doesn't need me to fight His battles for him. Maybe it is because Islam and witchcraft have no security from God that people take personally anything said against it. I haven't judged or condemned anyone that is not my job.

Oh

So if I say something about Christianity that you perceive to be insulting &/or wrong ..... you should not take it personally.

That is correct! I wouldn't be offended.

Then you should not speak up in defense of your beliefs. After all, you advise others not to when you are the one who's saying things!! Why are you giving people advice that you wouldn't follow?

That doesn't mean I won't share my opinion about any given comment or verses pertaining to it!

And others will share their opinions about your comments. After all ..... if you pay any attention to that "do unto others ...." thingy, you cannot object to others passing judgement on your beliefs since you pass judgement on ours.

According to my beliefs, Christianity offers no guarantees from G-d. No religion does.

That is incorrect. Romans 10 that if thou shall confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in thy heart that God raised Him from the dead, thou shall be saved

NO! That is what YOUR belief teaches.

You cannot speak to what *I* believe because you don't know. You have never ASKED ..... all you have done is tell me what you think I should believe.

My religion has nothing to do with Jesus ..... and anything Jesus had to say is irrelevant to what my beliefs are. Please remember that when you attempt to "correct" beliefs that are not wrong - just different from what you believe.

Judging and condemnation aren't your job, I agree. But that hasn't stopped you from saying judgmental and condemnatory things to anyone who disagrees with your version of Christianity.

You are intitled to your opinion. I don't believe I have judged anyone. Can you prove that?

LOL

So when you tell me that what I believe is wrong, that is not you judging my beliefs and finding them wanting in your HUMBLE opinion?


.

I can judge your belief without judging you. I only speak of that which I know. I am done with this witchcraft thread. There is one thing in the Quran I agree with: "To you be your religion and to me be mine!" I have told you the truth the rest is on you!

It always seems that as soon as you get close to learning about the teachings of other belief systems, you drop the discussion like a hot potato.

Why is it you have no problem strenuously teaching others about what you believe ..... but just as strenuously resist learning about what they believe?

Why do you unto others what you will not tolerate when it is done to you? Does Jesus' teaching of the "Golden Rule" not apply to you?

.

[Serpent Oracle]

I'm in harmony with the creator of reality.

Are you a deist?

Just curiousity.

[Serpent Oracle]

I wonder what Jesus meant by Mat. 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you?

Temper temper...keep your knickers on sweetheart.

[Divine Insight]

I'm in harmony with the creator of reality.

Are you a deist?

Just curiousity.

Technically I'd have to give a resounding "No".

I base that on the following definition for Deist from Wikipedia:

"Deism is a religious philosophy which holds that reason and observation of the natural world, without the need for organized religion, can determine that the universe is the product of a creator."

The reason being that people often take this definition to mean that things like human beings were "intelligently designed" on purpose to be precisely as they are, etc. And thus they assume that there must exist a creator who did the designing.

I definitely do not see that as a worthy philosophy. There is nothing "intelligently designed" about the human body or condition. I could sit here and type in a myriad of reason why humans are stupidly designed, but I'll spare you that rant.

I totally believe in semi-random evolution and I could also go into explaining concepts associate with that too, but I'll pass on that one as well. Other than I would like to say that we are, at least in part, responsible for our own evolution as we evolve. And of course this is true for everything that evolves.

When I say "Creator" I don't mean "intelligent designer". I simply mean the ultimate source of anything that comes to be. I also believe that we are ultimately a facet of that source. It seems to me that this should be blatantly obvious as there is simply nothing else for us to be.

So when I say that I'm in "harmony with the creator", I simply mean that I recognize that there is no separation between the creator and the created. And so how could I not be in harmony with myself?

Of course, as strange as this may sound there actually is a way to be out of harmony with the true self, and the way that this can be done is to simply identify with an illusion that is not the true self. That philosophy is covered very well by Buddhism so rather than attempting to explain it, I'll just point to Buddhism as the answer to that dilemma and leave it at that.

Since I consider myself to be in harmony with my true self, then I must necessarily also be in harmony with the creator because I and the creator are one. As is true for you as well, assuming that your *I* has also recognized its true self.

So in that sense you could abstractly say that I'm a "deist", however that would no doubt be extremely misleading label since most people would consider a "deist" to be someone who thinks that humans are superbly designed and therefore they must have been designed on a divine drawing board by an "intelligent designer".

I definitely don't support that kind of thinking.

So technically, no, I'm not a 'deist' by the conventional meaning of the term.