Hi Jason,
Would this be accurate re your belief about sin?
View of Sin, Hell, and Separation
• Hell is not a punishment added by God: It is the name for the state of being separated from God — a state humans are already in.
• Not a place of physical fire (necessarily): Medieval imagery is not binding. Heaven and hell are spiritual states present on earth that extend beyond the grave.
• Separation is self-caused: God does not reject humans; humans reject God. Disobedience is a symptom of broken relationship, not the root cause.
• God does not "burn" non-believers: Asks critics to provide verses for hell-as-torture; suggests many Christians (including himself) reject that view.
Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
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William
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Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #1
The question has never been whether God is speaking. The question has always been whether there is anyone listening - anyone who has stopped hiding long enough to hear.
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The Tanager
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Re: Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #21[Replying to William in post #20]
You may have not meant this, but, to be sure, I don't think God could have chosen to create a world where love exists and free will doesn't. I think the logic of the concept of love requires free will to exist. I do think God could have created a different world though.
I think people before Jesus existed on earth (and even after this) can be saved if they trust in God rather than relying on something of their own making, even without knowing the mechanism.
And I agree with the bit on repentance.
You may have not meant this, but, to be sure, I don't think God could have chosen to create a world where love exists and free will doesn't. I think the logic of the concept of love requires free will to exist. I do think God could have created a different world though.
I think people before Jesus existed on earth (and even after this) can be saved if they trust in God rather than relying on something of their own making, even without knowing the mechanism.
And I agree with the bit on repentance.
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William
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Re: Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #22[Replying to The Tanager in post #21]
Just to be clear, Jason - do you agree with all three salvation bullet points as written, or would you like me to revise point #1 to reflect your clarification about free will and love?
If so I can move on to the next batch...
Just to be clear, Jason - do you agree with all three salvation bullet points as written, or would you like me to revise point #1 to reflect your clarification about free will and love?
If so I can move on to the next batch...
The question has never been whether God is speaking. The question has always been whether there is anyone listening - anyone who has stopped hiding long enough to hear.
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The Tanager
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Re: Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #24Thanks, Jason. Would you mind providing the wording you'd prefer for point #1? Then I'll update the map.The Tanager wrote: ↑Tue May 05, 2026 6:42 pm [Replying to William in post #22]
It would probably be clearer to rewrite it.
The question has never been whether God is speaking. The question has always been whether there is anyone listening - anyone who has stopped hiding long enough to hear.
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The Tanager
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Re: Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #25[Replying to William in post #24]
5. Salvation
God could have created differently, but chose to create a world with free will, so that love could be a possibility.
People before Jesus can be saved if they trusted in God, even without knowing the mechanism.
Repentance is not just saying "sorry" but unlearning self-will; it requires sharing in Christ's perfect surrender.
I’m not sure what you meant by “the only path given this creation (free will + physical beings),” so I’m not sure how to add that in or if it should be here. If you mean that I think Jesus is the only path, then I would agree and perhaps you could write it as:
5. Salvation
God could have created differently, but chose to create a world with free will, so that love could be a possibility.
Humans have rebelled and followed their own wills. The only path to rescue from this situation is through Jesus.
People before Jesus can be saved if they trusted in God, even without knowing the mechanism.
Repentance is not just saying "sorry" but unlearning self-will; it requires sharing in Christ's perfect surrender.
5. Salvation
God could have created differently, but chose to create a world with free will, so that love could be a possibility.
People before Jesus can be saved if they trusted in God, even without knowing the mechanism.
Repentance is not just saying "sorry" but unlearning self-will; it requires sharing in Christ's perfect surrender.
I’m not sure what you meant by “the only path given this creation (free will + physical beings),” so I’m not sure how to add that in or if it should be here. If you mean that I think Jesus is the only path, then I would agree and perhaps you could write it as:
5. Salvation
God could have created differently, but chose to create a world with free will, so that love could be a possibility.
Humans have rebelled and followed their own wills. The only path to rescue from this situation is through Jesus.
People before Jesus can be saved if they trusted in God, even without knowing the mechanism.
Repentance is not just saying "sorry" but unlearning self-will; it requires sharing in Christ's perfect surrender.
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William
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Re: Questions about The Tanagers Belief.
Post #26[Replying to The Tanager in post #25]
Thanks, Jason. I will update the mapping with your wording and add it to the rest before continuing
Thanks, Jason. I will update the mapping with your wording and add it to the rest before continuing
The question has never been whether God is speaking. The question has always been whether there is anyone listening - anyone who has stopped hiding long enough to hear.
