The Christian Rationale for Retaining Belief

[POI]

For debate:

1) Aside from the claims for a Jesus resurrection, what otherwise falsifiable (events/claims) from the Bible must also be demonstrated accurate and correct to retain faith?
2) If any of the above stated/given (events/claims) were to instead be falsified, (to your own personal satisfaction), would you then logically denounce your Christian faith, or, would you instead pivot/adject and remain in faith?
3) Are you willing to have any of these expressed/given (claims/events), from the Bible, challenged?

[bjs1]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #2]

There is God who exists in three persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

How did you come up with this notion of the Trinity about God? Have you talked to the Almighty God?

I made no claim about talking to God. The question was about what belief must be accurate to retain the Christian faith. I included the deity of Christ in that list. If Jesus is not God, then the Christian faith is false.

[Carnivalfaces]

Thanks for the 'lecture' and the gaslighting. However, interlocutors, including the owner of this forum website, has stated that if the Exodus was proven to be false, it would present as a problem. But hey,.. you do you boh

“A problem…” for what? Having been in debates with this forum’s owner I would be surprised if he said that the entire Christian hangs on the Exodus.

You may call it “gaslighting” if you wish. As I have said before on this site, when non-Christians say that they know what Christians believe better than Christians do, then no amount of evidence or reason will ever change their minds.

What are you calling "evidence" or "reason"? Seems you're claiming to know those concepts better than atheists, which would be gaslighting.

[bjs1]

Thanks for the 'lecture' and the gaslighting. However, interlocutors, including the owner of this forum website, has stated that if the Exodus was proven to be false, it would present as a problem. But hey,.. you do you boh

“A problem…” for what? Having been in debates with this forum’s owner I would be surprised if he said that the entire Christian hangs on the Exodus.

You may call it “gaslighting” if you wish. As I have said before on this site, when non-Christians say that they know what Christians believe better than Christians do, then no amount of evidence or reason will ever change their minds.

What are you calling "evidence" or "reason"? Seems you're claiming to know those concepts better than atheists, which would be gaslighting.

I, a Christian, tell you what I believe. A non-Christian says, “No, that’s not really what you believe,” and you accuse me of gaslighting?

I cite the two most influential creeds in the history of the church; creeds which are still used by more than 80% of Christians as foundational statements of faith. A non-Christian says, “No, just because Christians say that’s what they believe, it’s still not what they really believe,” and you accuse me of gaslighting?

Do you genuinely not see the problem here?

[POI]

Thanks for the 'lecture' and the gaslighting. However, interlocutors, including the owner of this forum website, has stated that if the Exodus was proven to be false, it would present as a problem. But hey,.. you do you boh

“A problem…” for what?

The "Exodus" is said to be a necessary event. Remember, without the Old Testament, you cannot have the New Testament. Hence, you do not get to just ignore pivotal storylines, which later turn out to likely be tales from fiction.

[OneJack]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #2]

There is God who exists in three persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

How did you come up with this notion of the Trinity about God? Have you talked to the Almighty God?

I made no claim about talking to God. The question was about what belief must be accurate to retain the Christian faith. I included the deity of Christ in that list. If Jesus is not God, then the Christian faith is false.

How then do you say the Christian faith would be false if Jesus were not God, knowing you’ve not talked to and heard from God yet?

[bjs1]

Thanks for the 'lecture' and the gaslighting. However, interlocutors, including the owner of this forum website, has stated that if the Exodus was proven to be false, it would present as a problem. But hey,.. you do you boh

“A problem…” for what?

The "Exodus" is said to be a necessary event.

Who says it is necessary, and what do they say it is necessary for?

Remember, without the Old Testament, you cannot have the New Testament. Hence, you do not get to just ignore pivotal storylines, which later turn out to likely be tales from fiction.

The OT is valuable for Christians. It tells us more about who our God is and how He has interacted with His people throughout the ages. However:

1. If a person never had any access to the OT, that would not diminish the truth of Christ or the essence of the Christian message.

2. If the Exodus, in part or in whole, did not happen exactly as recorded in the second book of the OT, that would not diminish the truth of Christ or the essence of the Christian message.

[bjs1]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #2]

There is God who exists in three persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

How did you come up with this notion of the Trinity about God? Have you talked to the Almighty God?

I made no claim about talking to God. The question was about what belief must be accurate to retain the Christian faith. I included the deity of Christ in that list. If Jesus is not God, then the Christian faith is false.

How then do you say the Christian faith would be false if Jesus were not God, knowing you’ve not talked to and heard from God yet?

I have no idea what your point is here. I have stated what Christains believe. There is no need for a unique revelation from God for anyone to know what the Christian faith is


I understand that there will always be the 2% of people who say, "I am a Christain, and I believe something different!" That tiny group will always exist for every topic. I don't feel the need to bring them up in every conversation. It's like how I don't feel the need to recognize that flat earthers exist every time I look at a globe. The vocal but tiny minority doesn’t always get to derail the conversation.

[JehovahsWitness]

I don't believe (think) that FAITH in the Christian theology involves proving in the literal sense something to be true but rather having enough information to be personally convinved that something is true.

The degree and nature of said information may vary from person to person , but faith involves a personal conviction that that which we have learnt reflects reality.

[POI]

Who says it is necessary, and what do they say it is necessary for?

Otseng is THE reason I created the long-running "Exodus" thread in the first place. If the Exodus was a fictional tale, then the rest of the storyline, there-after, is in deep doo doo.

The OT is valuable for Christians. It tells us more about who our God is and how He has interacted with His people throughout the ages.

Yes, and some expressed events must be literally true for the rest of it to make any sense. "The Exodus" is one of them.

1. If a person never had any access to the OT, that would not diminish the truth of Christ or the essence of the Christian message.

My point is that the Exodus has to be an actual event in history. If it is not, then believers are in trouble.

2. If the Exodus, in part or in whole, did not happen exactly as recorded in the second book of the OT, that would not diminish the truth of Christ or the essence of the Christian message.

I'm not quibbling over minor details of the claim. I'm instead stating that if the event was fiction in reality, then you are in deep doo doo.

[OneJack]

[Replying to bjs1 in post #2]

There is God who exists in three persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

How did you come up with this notion of the Trinity about God? Have you talked to the Almighty God?

I made no claim about talking to God. The question was about what belief must be accurate to retain the Christian faith. I included the deity of Christ in that list. If Jesus is not God, then the Christian faith is false.

How then do you say the Christian faith would be false if Jesus were not God, knowing you’ve not talked to and heard from God yet?

I have no idea what your point is here. I have stated what Christains believe. There is no need for a unique revelation from God for anyone to know what the Christian faith is


I understand that there will always be the 2% of people who say, "I am a Christain, and I believe something different!" That tiny group will always exist for every topic. I don't feel the need to bring them up in every conversation. It's like how I don't feel the need to recognize that flat earthers exist every time I look at a globe. The vocal but tiny minority doesn’t always get to derail the conversation.

FYI, you’ll not have the Christian Faith if you do not come and listen to the real and forever living Christ Jesus, who is beside you all the time, though you don’t see Him yet. No one gets the right faith in God by just reading and studying the bible day and night.