Did Moses Exist?

[POI]

I created the 'Exodus' thread here (viewtopic.php?t=40622), after being inspired to do so when Otseng made the (paraphrased) statement -- "if the Exodus did not happen, then we must question Biblical veracity".

From there, the topic of "Moses" ultimately came up; which is what I believe eventually prompted the follow-up topic, created here (viewtopic.php?t=42501).

However, since it seems to be imperative and crucial for Moses to be a real character, let us examine....?

For Debate:

1) As compared to other claimed figures from ancient antiquity, such as Alexander the Great, Pontius Pilate, and-the-like, how exactly does the claim(s) of "Moses" stack up as a real character? Meaning, if the (confidence-level) for Alexander and Pilate are fairly high, due to 'evidence(s)', how exactly does 'Moses' compare on the "confidence-meter"? (i.e.) Low, medium, high, or other?

2) If we have low-level confidence that a "Moses" really existed, as compared to other said characters from antiquity, does this jeopardize Biblical veracity claims in any way(s)?

3) Can one even logically remain a believer without accepting "Moses" as being a real dude from history?

4) Outside the Bible's say-so, what evidence suggests a "Moses" actually existed?

[1213]

[Replying to 1213 in post #59]

Though I appreciate the response, you keep dodging a very key point. Please plant your flag...

Sorry, because I don't know all, I will keep the right to correct my thoughts, if I get information that show my previous ideas were wrong. At the moment, by the current knowledge, Senenmut seems to be Moses, because of the many similarities. However, it may be that there is even better option that I just don't yet know.

[POI]

[Replying to 1213 in post #59]

Though I appreciate the response, you keep dodging a very key point. Please plant your flag...

Sorry, because I don't know all, I will keep the right to correct my thoughts, if I get information that show my previous ideas were wrong.

I've been exchanging with you for years now. Your responses, which start with the word 'sorry', so far, only means one of two things (paraphrased):

1) Sorry, followed by a move of the goalpost. Which is demonstrated above.
2) Sorry, followed by an unsubstantiated hand-wave.

Thus, until you tell me how much wiggle room you will allow between what you interpret in the Bible, verses other sources, I'm not going to waste my time. Let's start simply. According to the Bible:

1. What year was Moses born? And how much wiggle room is allotted here?
2. What year did Moses leave Egypt? And how much wiggle room is allotted here?
3. What year did Moses die? And how much wiggle room is allotted here?

At the moment, by the current knowledge, Senenmut seems to be Moses, because of the many similarities. However, it may be that there is even better option that I just don't yet know.

Meaning, if I were to debunk the notion that Senenmut is Moses, then you will still retain your belief that Moses existed regardless. Right?

Unanswered from post 10: Is it possible the Bible is guilty of verisimilitude?

[1213]

...if I were to debunk the notion that Senenmut is Moses, then you will still retain your belief that Moses existed regardless. Right?...

Why would it mean that Moses didn't exist?

[POI]

...if I were to debunk the notion that Senenmut is Moses, then you will still retain your belief that Moses existed regardless. Right?...

Why would it mean that Moses didn't exist?

Your avoidance is noted.

[POI]

Not much action in this topic either. Bumping it back to the top.

Christians, would it even matter if a Moses character never actually existed?

How possible is it that the Bible is guilty of verisimilitude?

[SiNcE_1985]

For Debate:

1) As compared to other claimed figures from ancient antiquity, such as Alexander the Great, Pontius Pilate, and-the-like, how exactly does the claim(s) of "Moses" stack up as a real character? Meaning, if the (confidence-level) for Alexander and Pilate are fairly high, due to 'evidence(s)', how exactly does 'Moses' compare on the "confidence-meter"? (i.e.) Low, medium, high, or other?

High.

2) If we have low-level confidence that a "Moses" really existed, as compared to other said characters from antiquity, does this jeopardize Biblical veracity claims in any way(s)?

Sure.

Just like "if" we had high-level confidence that Moses existed, it jeopardize skeptics skepticism about whether he existed.

3) Can one even logically remain a believer without accepting "Moses" as being a real dude from history?

Probably not.

4) Outside the Bible's say-so, what evidence suggests a "Moses" actually existed?

I reject your insinuation/premise that the Bible needs external corroborating evidence of anything, much less Moses' existence.

[POI]

Venom, I'm going to 'put a pin in it' until our other exchange is properly vetted. Thanx...

[POI]

High.

Why?

Probably not.

Noted.

I reject your insinuation/premise that the Bible needs external corroborating evidence of anything, much less Moses' existence.

Why?

[SiNcE_1985]

High.

Why?

Because of evidence that was presented; of which I find persuasive.

I reject your insinuation/premise that the Bible needs external corroborating evidence of anything, much less Moses' existence.

Why?

Because it does not logically follow that, in order for X to be true, X needs to be corroborated by external evidence Y.

This is a text book example of a non sequitur, and you are running wild with this illogic, as if it is the thang to do.

I know the subject of Jesus makes you uncomfortable and you're going to spend every second of your natural life trying to prove it wrong...but you don't have to use illogical argumentation to do so.

[POI]

Because of evidence that was presented; of which I find persuasive.

Such as?

Because it does not logically follow that, in order for X to be true, X needs to be corroborated by external evidence Y.

I get what you are saying, but the Bible is sketch. I'm asking is there any evidence outside the claim(s) from the Bible? If so, what? If not, why should anyone believe the claim, being that some other claims from the Bible are likely false?

This is a text book example of a non sequitur, and you are running wild with this illogic, as if it is the thang to do.

This is just another prime example of your mislabeling. Soon, you will bring up more classic science denial, followed by some actual illogical thinking to also follow.

I know the subject of Jesus makes you uncomfortable and you're going to spend every second of your natural life trying to prove it wrong...but you don't have to use illogical argumentation to do so.

TBH, I wish it were true. This way, I would not have wasted decades believing in fairy tales. Now, it's just interesting, as well as also entertaining to explore the thinking of others. In your case, you are a prime example of someone who was indoctrinated early into some wildly incorrect teaching. And since I already know you will eventually bring it up, because you bring it up in every topic, I'll just beat you to the punch. The obsession with the topic of evolution alone is mind-boggling. That's really all. It's an interesting case-study, at this point.