Questioning God's Chosen Communication

[POI]

(1) Why would an omniscient God reveal to ancient societies the questions that modern scientific communities would be interested in? (2) Why would God care more about making scientific knowledge available in these texts versus addressing how He wanted humans to live?

For debate: Does the provided video below answer the above two questions sufficiently? If not, why not? If so, then I guess God is inept?

[POI]

(Mae) You continue to miss the point that you twist things so as to accuse God of evil. You don’t see this. Now you accuse Him of ordering murder, a clear evil,

POI Negative. I'm not placing God into any moral category. That instead is all you. You think chattel slavery is "evil". Well, God does not. He thinks it is a-okay. You are then at odd with God. All I'm saying is that when God commands an action, it then becomes okay. So, if God orders group A to slaughter group B, and also take the virgins for themselves, it is not 'evil', because it is God who has commanded it.

(Mae) You miss the point that commanding or approving or disapproving DOES NOT STOP man from doing the action. It’s point blank obvious but still you don’t get it.

POI I already addressed your response. I stated we have free will. Neither the government nor God stops all 'bad' acts. However, the government, as well as YOURSELF, has expressed that chattel slavery is "BAD". The government has now also made such actions illegal. Of course, people could still do it, but they know they are breaking the law. Why doesn't God make this action illegal?.?.?.?.?.?.? I've asked you this question many times now, and you keep avoiding a response to this question. Why is that?

(Mae) Those who agreed to rules of war don’t therefore APPROVE of war. Or do you think the nations that regulated war conduct are then OK with war?

POI Your believed upon God thinks it fit to keep virgins as plunder, in war. Do you?

[POI]

And since The Tanager realizes this, his position is that the God of the Bible recognizes that these ancients were stubborn. Committing the practices of chattel slavery was ingrained within them. Hence, The Tanager argues God did not abolish it, because it would instead cause these folks to reject the relationship with God, or something like that...

I personally find this apologetic ludicrous. I would wager that murder is more ingrained in humans then and now. Yet low and behold, God was fine telling people to not murder.

It shouldn't matter how stubborn humans were or are now. You lay down the 'correct' behavior from the beginning. If this god wants to temper the punishments a bit at first until people realize he means business then understandable (maybe). Yet pretending the God of the Bible condones something just because some humans were stubborn is .... well... laughable. We as a species are stubborn about a lot of behaviors, that doesn't mean a god should coddle us if some rules need to be laid down.

It really baffles me when some Christians will tap dance as hard as they can around an issue rather than just admitting the likely truth. Humans came up with and wrote the 'laws' in the Bible. A loving, compassionate god would/should be horrified.

Yes, it's baffling...

[TRANSPONDER]

And since The Tanager realizes this, his position is that the God of the Bible recognizes that these ancients were stubborn. Committing the practices of chattel slavery was ingrained within them. Hence, The Tanager argues God did not abolish it, because it would instead cause these folks to reject the relationship with God, or something like that...

I personally find this apologetic ludicrous. I would wager that murder is more ingrained in humans then and now. Yet low and behold, God was fine telling people to not murder.

It shouldn't matter how stubborn humans were or are now. You lay down the 'correct' behavior from the beginning. If this god wants to temper the punishments a bit at first until people realize he means business then understandable (maybe). Yet pretending the God of the Bible condones something just because some humans were stubborn is .... well... laughable. We as a species are stubborn about a lot of behaviors, that doesn't mean a god should coddle us if some rules need to be laid down.

It really baffles me when some Christians will tap dance as hard as they can around an issue rather than just admitting the likely truth. Humans came up with and wrote the 'laws' in the Bible. A loving, compassionate god would/should be horrified.

Yes, it's baffling...

It isn't baffling. Once one understands three things it becomes understandable.

The basis of the whole mindset is Faith.
That Faith is really Faith that whatever they think in their head is is true.
This mindset is not only perfectly defended by a centuries old tradition of not doubting and questioning what is believed on Faith, but it provides the a priori basis of assuming as a given what is being debated.

This leads to reversed burden of proof and the mindset that all the believer has to do is deny everything, and they win.

But the downside of this protected Faith in the god in head really being 'God' is that it can never be wrong about anything serious.

So in debate and discussion, when tough stuff comes up and the Bible apologist is put on the spot, what do they do? They can't prove true what isn't and one cannot admit having wrong belief and changing their mind as that shatters the Belief they are getting Truth from God. So the name of the gave is evasion.

Tap dancing around the bush
arguing a different Meaning
denying everything even if the Bible clearly says it.
Diversion (links to books or videos to bury us under research work)
changing the subject
going on the attack
crickets or the Deep dive and resurface on a different thread a fortnite later making the same claims.

I think understanding a prori Godfaith is the key to understanding their otherwise baffling methods.

[Mae von H]

That’s called executing judgement and He is the Judge of all the earth.

You can reframe and tap dance all you want. The story has God killing EVERY first born simply because Pharaoh wouldn't relent. I suggest maybe this God character should have simply 'passed judgement' on Pharoah and killed him instead. If that didn't work, then work on down through the Egyptian leadership. That would have been 'righteous judgement'. Blanket killing of EVERY first born is plain old murder.

If you can't see this, then we will have to agree to disagree. I'm hoping you realize there are probably better solutions than mass killing of people not involved in the decision making.

That fact that some Christians are fine with this type of killing is what likely drives some further and further from listening to any other ideas these Christians may have about what might be 'good' or 'right'.

If you don’t want to see, no one can force you to see and understand. Well, you aren’t the first and won’t be the last.

[POI]

It isn't baffling.

I agree. I was being sarcastic.

[benchwarmer]

That’s called executing judgement and He is the Judge of all the earth.

You can reframe and tap dance all you want. The story has God killing EVERY first born simply because Pharaoh wouldn't relent. I suggest maybe this God character should have simply 'passed judgement' on Pharoah and killed him instead. If that didn't work, then work on down through the Egyptian leadership. That would have been 'righteous judgement'. Blanket killing of EVERY first born is plain old murder.

If you can't see this, then we will have to agree to disagree. I'm hoping you realize there are probably better solutions than mass killing of people not involved in the decision making.

That fact that some Christians are fine with this type of killing is what likely drives some further and further from listening to any other ideas these Christians may have about what might be 'good' or 'right'.

If you don’t want to see, no one can force you to see and understand. Well, you aren’t the first and won’t be the last.

The irony here is killing me.

Did the God of the Bible kill EVERY first born (including animals - sheesh what did they do?) according to the story? Yes.

Did this same God bypass anyone who had killed something else (I guess God doesn't really know the hearts of men and wanted a little extra bloodshed to signal his followers) and paint their blood over their doorways? Yes.

Why did God do all this killing (and ask His followers to kill other animals to avoid it)? Because Pharaoh wouldn't let His people leave.

So the logic here is that God wanted to pass judgement on Pharaoh, so orders the killing of lambs by His followers and them kills every single first born human or animal in sight. Got it.

Basically where we are landing here is the usual apologetic when the Bible God is doing something clearly not in line with modern thinking or morals. God is God and can do whatever He pleases and thus it is automatically righteous. Sound familiar?

[Mae von H]

That’s called executing judgement and He is the Judge of all the earth.

You can reframe and tap dance all you want. The story has God killing EVERY first born simply because Pharaoh wouldn't relent. I suggest maybe this God character should have simply 'passed judgement' on Pharoah and killed him instead. If that didn't work, then work on down through the Egyptian leadership. That would have been 'righteous judgement'. Blanket killing of EVERY first born is plain old murder.

If you can't see this, then we will have to agree to disagree. I'm hoping you realize there are probably better solutions than mass killing of people not involved in the decision making.

That fact that some Christians are fine with this type of killing is what likely drives some further and further from listening to any other ideas these Christians may have about what might be 'good' or 'right'.

If you don’t want to see, no one can force you to see and understand. Well, you aren’t the first and won’t be the last.

The irony here is killing me.

Did the God of the Bible kill EVERY first born (including animals - sheesh what did they do?) according to the story? Yes.

Did this same God bypass anyone who had killed something else (I guess God doesn't really know the hearts of men and wanted a little extra bloodshed to signal his followers) and paint their blood over their doorways? Yes.

Why did God do all this killing (and ask His followers to kill other animals to avoid it)? Because Pharaoh wouldn't let His people leave.

So the logic here is that God wanted to pass judgement on Pharaoh, so orders the killing of lambs by His followers and them kills every single first born human or animal in sight. Got it.

Basically where we are landing here is the usual apologetic when the Bible God is doing something clearly not in line with modern thinking or morals. God is God and can do whatever He pleases and thus it is automatically righteous. Sound familiar?

If you do not understand the difference between a common man deciding on his own to execute capital punishment on someone and a judge doing so, but think both are committing murder, then you will not understand how the Judge of all the earth executes judgement. It is that simple.

[1213]

...People follow humanist rules...

Please give one example of a such rule.

[Mae von H]

(1) Why would an omniscient God reveal to ancient societies the questions that modern scientific communities would be interested in? (2) Why would God care more about making scientific knowledge available in these texts versus addressing how He wanted humans to live?

For debate: Does the provided video below answer the above two questions sufficiently? If not, why not? If so, then I guess God is inept?

....

I don't think the video is good for anything. I think God's rules in the Bible in all cases are as clear. The problem seems to come when people read only small part of it and ignore everything that doesn't support their interpretations, not the Bible itself. If your video is inept, it doesn't mean God is also.

Rubbish. Denial. God's rules in the Bible (even before they get revised in the NT because it was written by Christians, not Jews) are bad, reactionary and wrong and half of them people don't do anyway.

People follow humanist rules and just claim they are God's and if they aren't (and demonstrably they are not, just take slavery) then it is excused as 'pointing that way'. in the process of giving the Bible the credit for what humans have done The fact is that it works as well and explains more (and needs to deny less) if we assume humans were doing their best in various cultures and making slow progress and that is still going on.

Bottom line, you may deny everything (with or without watching the video) but it isn't about getting you to admit anything you don't want to.Bible apologists don't. It is about making the best case for others to consider.

Rock bottom line - it is not about how much you can deny but the case you can make which is not to say excuses with pot kettle accusations of cherry picking, taking out of context and being inept. Which is the stock in trade of the Bible apologists.

What are humanistic rules and please give one that people, all people everywhere without fail, follow?

[TRANSPONDER]

That’s called executing judgement and He is the Judge of all the earth.

You can reframe and tap dance all you want. The story has God killing EVERY first born simply because Pharaoh wouldn't relent. I suggest maybe this God character should have simply 'passed judgement' on Pharoah and killed him instead. If that didn't work, then work on down through the Egyptian leadership. That would have been 'righteous judgement'. Blanket killing of EVERY first born is plain old murder.

If you can't see this, then we will have to agree to disagree. I'm hoping you realize there are probably better solutions than mass killing of people not involved in the decision making.

That fact that some Christians are fine with this type of killing is what likely drives some further and further from listening to any other ideas these Christians may have about what might be 'good' or 'right'.

If you don’t want to see, no one can force you to see and understand. Well, you aren’t the first and won’t be the last.

But you are the one dismissing what is demonstrably the case from what the Bible says. You are the one doing pot kettle here. You are the one not only not seeing, not only looking for any reason not to look, but also projecting that denial onto the other side.

It is a fine example (not that we are short of them) of this Faithbased thinking of Bibl;e apologetics - just do a bit of denial and the Bible (or rather ones' faith) wins.

That is not how it works. It is the evidence and the best case, not muttering all through the trial and then going outside the courthouse and denying everything (1). That only works with others in the cult so to speak.Anyone still able to judge can look at the evidence and not be impresses by denial and accusations slung at the other side.

It isn't baffling.

I agree. I was being sarcastic.

Quite. Yet just give me any excuse to peddle my pet theories....

(1) I couldn't resist this, either.