Will the Parousia occur during our lifetime?

[polonius]

Jesus prophecized that the second coming would occur while some of his generation were still alive, but it didn't.

There is some claim that really occurred in 1914. But it didn't. So, what's the claim now?

www.britannica.com/topic/Jehovahs-Witnesses

The Adventist movement emerged in the 1830s around the predictions of William Miller, who proclaimed that Jesus Christ would return in 1843 or 1844.

When Christ did not return as Miller prophecied, Adventists divided into a number of factions.

During the 1870s, Charles Taze Russell established himself as an independent and controversial Adventist teacher.

He rejected belief in hell as a place of eternal torment and adopted a non-Trinitarian theology that denied the divinity of Jesus. He also interpreted the Second Coming in accordance with the literal translation of the original Greek term, parousia (“presence�), suggesting that Christ would come as an invisible presence and that the Parousia, or “Millennial Dawn,� already had occurred, in 1874.

The coming of Christ’s invisible presence signaled the end of the current order of society and would be followed by his visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth in 1914.

Although the kingdom did not come, Russell’s teachings motivated a number of volunteers to circulate his many books and pamphlets and a periodical, The Watchtower, and to recalculate the time of the Parousia.

So when will Christ's visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth occur?

[myth-one.com]

Jesus prophecized that the second coming would occur while some of his generation were still alive, but it didn't.

There is some claim that really occurred in 1914. But it didn't. So, what's the claim now?

www.britannica.com/topic/Jehovahs-Witnesses

The Adventist movement emerged in the 1830s around the predictions of William Miller, who proclaimed that Jesus Christ would return in 1843 or 1844.

When Christ did not return as Miller prophecied, Adventists divided into a number of factions.

During the 1870s, Charles Taze Russell established himself as an independent and controversial Adventist teacher.

He rejected belief in hell as a place of eternal torment and adopted a non-Trinitarian theology that denied the divinity of Jesus. He also interpreted the Second Coming in accordance with the literal translation of the original Greek term, parousia (“presence�), suggesting that Christ would come as an invisible presence and that the Parousia, or “Millennial Dawn,� already had occurred, in 1874.

The coming of Christ’s invisible presence signaled the end of the current order of society and would be followed by his visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth in 1914.

Although the kingdom did not come, Russell’s teachings motivated a number of volunteers to circulate his many books and pamphlets and a periodical, The Watchtower, and to recalculate the time of the Parousia.

So when will Christ's visible presence and the establishment of the millennial kingdom on earth occur?

By my calculations performed in the year 2004, 5962 years with a possible error of plus or minus 10.5 years have passed since the Genesis recreation. My approach was to start from the first man Adam and go forward to some significant event which is documented in history books as well as in the Bible. That event was the destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar during the period 586-588 BC.

If the Sabbath is truly a sign pointing to the millennium, indicating that we have six one thousand year periods or God days before the millennium or end times occur, and 5962 years have passed since man was created, then we are truly near the end times. If 5962 is a good calculation the millennium will begin approximately (6000 - 5962) years from the year 2004. This would be in 38 years, or in the year 2042. However, my calculations contained a plus or minus error of 10.5 years. Taking that into account, the millennium should occur within the period of years 2032 to 2052, with the likely date being the year 2042.

Does this period make sense with other signs of the end times? One sign is that when Israel forms a nation for the second time, some of those alive will live to see the second coming of Christ. Israel became a nation the second time in 1948. Remember that God placed an upper limit of one hundred and twenty years on the life of man in Genesis 6:3. Therefore, the longest any Israeli baby born in 1948 could live would be to 1948 + 120, or the year 2068. The year 2042 is well within this maximum life period of those born in 1948. People born in 1948 will be ninety-four years of age in the year 2042. This life expectancy is not uncommon today.

[brianbbs67]

Mark 9:1

And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power."

Paul, 1 Thes 4 15-17 " For this we declare to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will by no means precede those who have died.[j] 16 For the Lord himself, with a cry of command, with the archangel’s call and with the sound of God’s trumpet, will descend from heaven, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up in the clouds together with them to meet the Lord in the air; and so we will be with the Lord forever."

So evidently Jesus expected to return by the end of the first century.

And Paul too. And the author of Hebrews: "in these last days", and other NT writers as well. They were wrong. The NT was wrong, the Bible was wrong. At the very least we can conclude that the either Jesus and his first century disciples were not infallible, and/or that the Bible is not infallible.

Last days are everyday till it ends. The bible can be neither right or wrong. Its an inanimate object. Like an SUV which the news media keeps telling me has hit someone.

Men are wrong though, many times. Men collected and wrote the bible, not God. Sure some seems direct from the Creator. The NT seems to be the most monkeyed with collection. I view it skeptically. But, there seems to be truth there, too. The OT seems to have stayed the same over time. The thing that bugs me the most about the NT, is many verses were added(which begs what was subtracted), its pseudo biographical and most was written much later, except Paul's and Mark's words.

God is infallible. Books written about God are not. Unless the entire bible is in agreement with itself, we should disregard it. I believe it is congruent once you eliminate preconceived notions and look for where harmony leads you. The front of the book must match the back of the book.

[onewithhim]

Jesus prophecized that the second coming would occur while some of his generation were still alive, but it didn't.

There is some claim that really occurred in 1914. But it didn't. So, what's the claim now?

No, Jesus did not prophesy that the second coming would occur in his generation. (See my post near the end of the thread "This generation will by no means pass away.")

His parousia will definitely occur during our lifetime.

In fact, we are living within it now. If a person wants to be on Jesus' good side , that person really should pay attention to what his Witnesses are saying.

1914 was, according to Bible chronology, the end of the Times of the Gentiles. JWs thought that that meant the time for the anointed to go to heaven, but that was just a hopeful GUESS. They never said it was written in stone. Since 1975, they have stopped trying to figure it out.

WE don't know when the Great Tribulation will start, but we can see that it is close. Check out the huge image of Daniel chapter 2. This vision shows us that we are VERY close to the destruction of all of men's governments and the rule of God's Kingdom.

[2timothy316]

And while Jesus claimed that no one could know the "day and hour" of his return, according to the gospel writers it would be during the lifetime of Jesus' generation.

He was not talking about the 'day and hour' of the birth of the Kingdom of God. The Kingdom was born and Jesus was made king during the reign of the world's governments with no striking observableness. (Luke 17:20, 21)

The 'coming' of Jesus you're referring to has not happened yet. The 'coming' is referring to Armageddon. That is the day no one knows.

[Sojournerofthearth]

[Replying to post 1 by polonius]

1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power. 2 And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them. 3 And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them. 4 And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.

They, right here, saw the Kingdom of God in power. They saw Christ, Moses & Elijah resurrected.

Soj

[polonius]

Jesus prophecized that the second coming would occur while some of his generation were still alive, but it didn't.

There is some claim that really occurred in 1914. But it didn't. So, what's the claim now?

No, Jesus did not prophesy that the second coming would occur in his generation. (See my post near the end of the thread "This generation will by no means pass away.")

His parousia will definitely occur during our lifetime.

In fact, we are living within it now. If a person wants to be on Jesus' good side , that

RESPONSE: This is not what Matthew and Luke state. See also Paul's Thessalonians I. The plain meaning of words.

God said THIS generation.(This generation is clearly the present generation unless specifically stated otherwise). Use a good English dictionary.

It's the plain meaning of words. The JW's claim that Jesus has returned but is now invisible.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 5 by JehovahsWitness]

Russell was wrong about some things and correct about others. Jehovah's Witnesses have no problem pointing out where Russell was wrong.

All Christian groups or groupings are right about some things and wrong about some things.

What we do here is point out what we think is right and what we think is wrong.

I like what Paul wrote: "Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up".(1 Corinthians 8:1)

Grace and peace be to you.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 5 by JehovahsWitness]

Russell was wrong about some things and correct about others. Jehovah's Witnesses have no problem pointing out where Russell was wrong.

All Christian groups or groupings are right about some things and wrong about some things.

What we do here is point out what we think is right and what we think is wrong.

I like what Paul wrote: "Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up".(1 Corinthians 8:1)

Grace and peace be to you.

Yes, that is correct. What I was doing was pointing out what we think is right and what we think is wrong. We believe Russell was wrong about some things and correct about others. Jehovah's Witnesses have no problem pointing out where Russell was wrong.



JW

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 1 by polonius]

1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power. 2 And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them. 3 And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them. 4 And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.

They, right here, saw the Kingdom of God in power. They saw Christ, Moses & Elijah resurrected.

Soj

Yes, they did "see the kingdom of God come with power">

However, they did not see Christ, Moses & Elijah resurrected.

It was a vision.

Matthew 17:9

As they were coming down the mountain, Jesus instructed them, "Do not tell anyone about this vision until the Son of Man has been raised from the dead."

Grace and peace.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 5 by JehovahsWitness]

Russell was wrong about some things and correct about others. Jehovah's Witnesses have no problem pointing out where Russell was wrong.

All Christian groups or groupings are right about some things and wrong about some things.

What we do here is point out what we think is right and what we think is wrong.

I like what Paul wrote: "Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up".(1 Corinthians 8:1)

Grace and peace be to you.

Yes, that is correct. What I was doing was pointing out what we think is right and what we think is wrong. We believe Russell was wrong about some things and correct about others. Jehovah's Witnesses have no problem pointing out where Russell was wrong.

JW

Does that include Rutherford as well?

How about since Rutherford?

Currently too?

Grace and peace to you.