Bad Theology and Salvation

[liamconnor]

this thread was provoked by Elijah JOhn's stimulating question on why the Trinity was not a focus of Jesus' (and I add, any of the N.T. authors) if it is so important.

I commented there that the N.T. authors did not think salvation came through belief in the Trinity.

But this raises a question which deserves its own thread.


Suppose a person believes that Jesus' death atones for sins; that Jesus is God's chosen King/Messiah/Christ of the world. But...

This person does NOT believe that he is God (i.e. denies Trinity) though Jesus actually IS God (reality has it that God is Triune)

(or)

The person DOES believe God is Triune; but God in fact is NOT triune (Jesus is not God).


Can either person be "saved"?

[Elijah John]

In other words, is Christianity a religion that offers salvation due to "belief"? Or is it a religion that offers salvation to the righteous as Jesus taught?

Wrong belief is a sin because it is based upon hating GOD. No one with a wrong belief is righteous no matter how they may act...Exodus 20:5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me...

Do you suppose then Moses had Jesus in mind when he channeled YHVH making those statements that we have in Exodus? Do you think Moses "accepted Jesus Christ as his personal Lord and Savior"? If not, do you include Moses among the damned for "wrong belief"?

And speaking of right belief, do you consider those who do not believe your unique PCE theology damned as well?

[Elijah John]

However, your question assumes an acceptance of Jesus as God's atonement.

What if we don't accept that and reject the whole principle of atonement and Jesus as our ransom?

Good question...even it we reject the principle of blood atonement, there is still provision for YHVH's mercy, the Father's mercy. Consider:

6With what shall I come before the Lord
and bow down before the exalted God?
Shall I come before him with burnt offerings,
with calves a year old?
7
Will the Lord be pleased with thousands of rams,
with ten thousand rivers of olive oil?
Shall I offer my firstborn for my transgression,
the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?
8
He has shown you, O mortal, what is good.
And what does the Lord require of you?
To act justly and to love mercy
and to walk humbly[a] with your God

Micah 6.6-8

And there are many other verses which indicate that YHVH accepts things other than blood, (human or animal) in order to forgive. Including some passages by Jesus himself. (The LORD's prayer, the Beattitudes, the Parables)

And let's not forget Proverbs 16.6:

6 Through love and faithfulness sin is atoned for;
through the fear of the Lord evil is avoided.

[Tcg]

Good question...even it we reject the principle of blood atonement, there is still provision for YHVH's mercy, the Father's mercy. Consider:

6With what shall I come before the Lord
and bow down before the exalted God?
Shall I come before him with burnt offerings,
with calves a year old?
7
Will the Lord be pleased with thousands of rams,
with ten thousand rivers of olive oil?
Shall I offer my firstborn for my transgression,
the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul?
8
He has shown you, O mortal, what is good.
And what does the Lord require of you?
To act justly and to love mercy
and to walk humbly[a] with your God

Micah 6.6-8

Actually, this documents not the Father's mercy, but God's requirement that mortals love mercy. We find anything but mercy from God in the verses that follow.

• 9
  Listen! The Lord is calling to the city—
  and to fear your name is wisdom—
  “Heed the rod and the One who appointed it.
  10
  Am I still to forget your ill-gotten treasures, you wicked house,
  and the short ephah,[c] which is accursed?
  11
  Shall I acquit someone with dishonest scales,
  with a bag of false weights?
  12
  Your rich people are violent;
  your inhabitants are liars
  and their tongues speak deceitfully.
  13
  Therefore, I have begun to destroy you,
  to ruin[d] you because of your sins.
  
  Micah 6:9-13

Tcg