C. S. Lewis -- the heretic.

[McCulloch]

In C.S. Lewis -The Heretic! Mary Van Nattan makes the following claims about Lewis:

1. Lewis believed in the power and use of spells
2. Lewis Says sincere unbelievers may go to Heaven
3. We're saved by works according to Lewis
4. Said descriptions of heaven found in the Bible are all symbolism
5. To be born again is still in the future; it is a continuing process not yet completed
6. Mysticism is a means by which one can leave "this world" before death
7. Says there is a purgatory which we must suffer after death
8. There is no literal hell. It is a state of mind.
9. Man evolved from animals. Theistic evolution.
10. The Bible contains myths.
11. Lewis Accepted that the Genesis account came from pagan myths
12. Job is "unhistorical.
13. There is error in the Bible
14. To be truly human you must participate in the Tao
15. Man does not necessarily have dominion over God's creation
16. Apollo is probably a lower species of Christ, and could probably be prayed to as such

She draws support from Bob Smietana of Christianity Today.

Clive Staples Lewis [...] shared basic Christian beliefs with evangelicals, he didn't subscribe to biblical inerrancy or penal substitution. He believed in purgatory and baptismal regeneration.

That is the heresy of universalism, and many hold to this false doctrine, believing that God will somehow receive unbelievers and followers of false religions into Heaven even though they do not know Jesus Christ in this life.

More links

• NARNIA and Satanism
• Further Into the Depths of Satan ...in C.S. Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia
• C.S. Lewis: The Devil's Wisest Fool
• C.S. LEWIS AND EVANGELICALS TODAY

Question for debate: was C.S. Lewis a christian apologist? Or was he a heretic?

[micatala]

I would have to allow that part of my response stems from having little patience with those who are convinced that everything Roman Catholic is from Satan. Those who claim this, I believe, are profoundly misguided and lacking in good judgment and clear thinking.

I am sorry, I would have to take major offense at this. While I realize you couldn't give a rats patooshi about how you offend some, keep this in mind, the background of catholism usually speaks for itself. If there is a common thought out there that everything satanic is related to the roman catholic church, its a news flash to me. Since you freely admit that your response stems from this belief, I question your good judgement and clear thinking.

I watched and read "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe. I think it represents christianities finest in reality. The sacrificial lion for the freedom of all, the youngest brother being the betrayer. It screams christianity and the fight of good and evil. So is my judgment lacking and my thinking clouded?

I think you are misunderstanding me.

I am not saying I think Roman Catholicism is satanic.

I am, in fact, strongly objecting to those who claim RC is satanic.

I was simply observing that the Van Nattan's seem to buy into this notion that RC is satanic, which is why I was objecting to their analysis.

I have not said anything negative at all about Lewis or the Narnia books.

As far as the prevalence of the notion that "RC is satanic" I think if you search around little you will find that this idea is quite widespread.

I can say that I have heard directly many people in my own location say such things.

I went to a Christian music festival the summer before last and there were a number of art works on display with an anti-Catholic themes, including the idea that the Pope was the anti-Christ. I have seen people insist that Rome/the Vatican is the "Babylon" mentioned in Revelations, etc. Many times I have heard what might be termed somewhat "milder" statements as 'catholics aren't really Christians,' or 'Catholics are deceived'.

Prominent conservative columnist Cal Thomas has stated in public that he doesn't think Catholics are really Christians.

Here are a few examples from the net.

The John Ankerberg Theological Research Institute has ample discussion of Catholics as not really being Christain. See this article for example.

Here is another article from the Ankerberg site likening catholics to Pharisees.

Here is an example of a thread from another forum. One poster writes.

Fatima is Satan' movie theater.

The signs and wonders...

Satan hides behind the Virgin Mary. (not the real one, of course). He is a liar and pretending to be what one is not is lying!

In the meantime, he gets the devotion he craves.
The Catholics call her Madonne. In "Madonne" you have the letters for "Demon",
and Madonne... mad one...

A good way to test the spiritsis to avoid every website that advocates her cult!
The cult of the Virgin Mary is just an updated Babylonian cult, deep, deep into apostasy!

At any rate. This view does unfortunately (IMV ) seem to be quite prevalent in some Christian circles.

I hope this clarifies what my views are, anyway. I certainly intended no offense, but did intend to speak strongly against those who view Catholicism as satanic.

[Zeke]

I have read most of C.S. Lewis' works. I have taught classes on the writings and theology of C.S. Lewis. The novels, like LW&WR, are simply stories. Yes, they contain some allegory and some symbolism, but they are hardly the stuff presented in Van Nattan's paranoid article. She seems to have made most of it up. I am totally unfamiliar with any credible supporting evidence for her claims.

If one bothers to read his other works like, "Mere Christianity", "The Great Divorce", and "The Screwtape Letters" it becomes instantly apparent that Lewis was a devout, convinced Christian, and that he had most of it figured out correctly.

Van Nattan, I think, can be filed away in that dusty drawer in which are stored UFO advocates and those who worry about music played backwards.

[seventil]

I have read most of C.S. Lewis' works. I have taught classes on the writings and theology of C.S. Lewis. The novels, like LW&WR, are simply stories. Yes, they contain some allegory and some symbolism, but they are hardly the stuff presented in Van Nattan's paranoid article. She seems to have made most of it up. I am totally unfamiliar with any credible supporting evidence for her claims.

If one bothers to read his other works like, "Mere Christianity", "The Great Divorce", and "The Screwtape Letters" it becomes instantly apparent that Lewis was a devout, convinced Christian, and that he had most of it figured out correctly.

Van Nattan, I think, can be filed away in that dusty drawer in which are stored UFO advocates and those who worry about music played backwards.

Good post, Zeke, you saved me from writing a nearly identical reply.

The person who wrote that book is a badly deranged, paranoid man. Shame on you Van Nattan! Hope nobody buys that one, don't fund the delusion.

[Confused]

I would have to allow that part of my response stems from having little patience with those who are convinced that everything Roman Catholic is from Satan. Those who claim this, I believe, are profoundly misguided and lacking in good judgment and clear thinking.

I am sorry, I would have to take major offense at this. While I realize you couldn't give a rats patooshi about how you offend some, keep this in mind, the background of catholism usually speaks for itself. If there is a common thought out there that everything satanic is related to the roman catholic church, its a news flash to me. Since you freely admit that your response stems from this belief, I question your good judgement and clear thinking.

I watched and read "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe. I think it represents christianities finest in reality. The sacrificial lion for the freedom of all, the youngest brother being the betrayer. It screams christianity and the fight of good and evil. So is my judgment lacking and my thinking clouded?

I think you are misunderstanding me.

I am not saying I think Roman Catholicism is satanic.

I am, in fact, strongly objecting to those who claim RC is satanic.

I was simply observing that the Van Nattan's seem to buy into this notion that RC is satanic, which is why I was objecting to their analysis.

I have not said anything negative at all about Lewis or the Narnia books.

As far as the prevalence of the notion that "RC is satanic" I think if you search around little you will find that this idea is quite widespread.

I can say that I have heard directly many people in my own location say such things.

I went to a Christian music festival the summer before last and there were a number of art works on display with an anti-Catholic themes, including the idea that the Pope was the anti-Christ. I have seen people insist that Rome/the Vatican is the "Babylon" mentioned in Revelations, etc. Many times I have heard what might be termed somewhat "milder" statements as 'catholics aren't really Christians,' or 'Catholics are deceived'.

Prominent conservative columnist Cal Thomas has stated in public that he doesn't think Catholics are really Christians.

Here are a few examples from the net.

The John Ankerberg Theological Research Institute has ample discussion of Catholics as not really being Christain. See this article for example.

Here is another article from the Ankerberg site likening catholics to Pharisees.

Here is an example of a thread from another forum. One poster writes.

Fatima is Satan' movie theater.

The signs and wonders...

Satan hides behind the Virgin Mary. (not the real one, of course). He is a liar and pretending to be what one is not is lying!

In the meantime, he gets the devotion he craves.
The Catholics call her Madonne. In "Madonne" you have the letters for "Demon",
and Madonne... mad one...

A good way to test the spiritsis to avoid every website that advocates her cult!
The cult of the Virgin Mary is just an updated Babylonian cult, deep, deep into apostasy!

At any rate. This view does unfortunately (IMV ) seem to be quite prevalent in some Christian circles.

I hope this clarifies what my views are, anyway. I certainly intended no offense, but did intend to speak strongly against those who view Catholicism as satanic.

I understand your viewpoint. I apologize for my post. I am not sure why I worte it in the context it is written in. I am sure at the time I had my reasons, but reading it back over now, I have no clue what they were. I don't view catholicism as satanic, though between Catholicism and Judaism, the amount of rites performed on a daily basis could probably put any church of "satan" to shame.

[LightGrenade04]

In C.S. Lewis -The Heretic! Mary Van Nattan makes the following claims about Lewis:

1. Lewis believed in the power and use of spells
2. Lewis Says sincere unbelievers may go to Heaven
3. We're saved by works according to Lewis
4. Said descriptions of heaven found in the Bible are all symbolism
5. To be born again is still in the future; it is a continuing process not yet completed
6. Mysticism is a means by which one can leave "this world" before death
7. Says there is a purgatory which we must suffer after death
8. There is no literal hell. It is a state of mind.
9. Man evolved from animals. Theistic evolution.
10. The Bible contains myths.
11. Lewis Accepted that the Genesis account came from pagan myths
12. Job is "unhistorical.
13. There is error in the Bible
14. To be truly human you must participate in the Tao
15. Man does not necessarily have dominion over God's creation
16. Apollo is probably a lower species of Christ, and could probably be prayed to as such

Question for debate: was C.S. Lewis a christian apologist? Or was he a heretic?

With the exception of point 6 (though I'm not going to be dogmatic about it) and point 16 (and I'm actually rather skeptical that Lewis actually believed that - though I'm open to correction if someone could point it out to me in his writings) I don't see anything heretical about any of that. I think Lewis was much more orthodox in his beliefs than many modern fundamentalists.