The 10 Commandments

[Flail]

As I understand it, the 10 Commandments were communicated by a 'God' to Moses to relay to the people then living in Israel. In them 'God' is supposedly 'speaking' for Himself. One of these Commandments instructs the people of Israel that they are not to 'take any other god' before this particular god and that He is their Lord God.

If I understand these words correctly, would a logical interpretation not imply that there are other 'gods' equal to the one issuing these Commandments? Is not the statement "...shall take no other gods before me", a clear indication that,at least according to this 'God', there are other similar beings existent, ie. 'other gods'?

[naz]

Flail you think thats wierd, take a look at this.

Exodus 20:3-5
Thou shalt not make unto thee(worship) any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or is in the sea below.

Christians have the image of Jesus in the churches and at home and pray to him?
That is the clearest quote in the old testament that Jesus is not God because man should not pray to any image.

When I see Jesus in church he is usually on the cross and when he is in my house he is usually haunting my lil’brother.

Exactly his image is graven and your worship is directed to him.

no its not, I always thought it was stupid to worship a dead man on the cross. Maybe that is just a reflection of my brothers worship?

[naz]

i will kill your avatar

Thanks, I needed a good laugh. I actually laughed for about 30 minutes after reading your post. pprec

[Flail]

Winepusher wrote:

The commandment, given to the ancient hebrews, forbids them from worshipping other God's promoted by the other religions in the near east belonging to the tribes of the Hittites, Amalekites and so on.

If the Commandment forbids only ancient Hebrews from worshipping other gods, why is it applicable to anyone else worshipping other gods? If this God was the only God out there, why would He not have said so? In any event, I don't understand the words of the Commandment as forbidding the worship of other gods. It simply states that these people were not to put any gods above this God. This implies that there are not only other gods of equal or lesser status existent, but that people are free to worship them so long as the people living in Israel at the time put this God foremost. It also seems that taking Jesus as a pre-condition for access to this particular God violates the Commandment. Maybe each country or each planet has it's own particular god?

[naz]

Flail you think thats wierd, take a look at this.

Exodus 20:3-5
Thou shalt not make unto thee(worship) any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or is in the sea below.

Christians have the image of Jesus in the churches and at home and pray to him?
That is the clearest quote in the old testament that Jesus is not God because man should not pray to any image.

That is an interesting concept, but a sculpted image of Jesus on the cross doesn’t go against the above passage. It might give some people an uneasy feeling, but worship isn't directed towards imagery like that. BTW, i was just joking about Jesus haunting my lil'bro when he is in my house. I thought it was kind of funny. But i guess it was just an inside-joke

[McCulloch]

Thou shalt not make unto thee (worship) any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or is in the sea below.

Exactly his image is graven and your worship is directed to him.

No its not, I always thought it was stupid to worship a dead man on the cross.

That is an interesting concept, but a sculpted image of Jesus on the cross doesn’t go against the above passage. It might give some people an uneasy feeling, but worship isn't directed towards imagery like that.

God says don't make or worship any image of anything in heaven, earth or the sea.
Christians make images of Jesus.
Christians worship Jesus, using the images in their worship.
But Christians do not violate God's commandment.
Good one! Tell me another.

[naz]

Thou shalt not make unto thee (worship) any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or is in the sea below.

Exactly his image is graven and your worship is directed to him.

No its not, I always thought it was stupid to worship a dead man on the cross.

That is an interesting concept, but a sculpted image of Jesus on the cross doesn’t go against the above passage. It might give some people an uneasy feeling, but worship isn't directed towards imagery like that.

God says don't make or worship any image of anything in heaven, earth or the sea.
Christians make images of Jesus.
Christians worship Jesus, using the images in their worship.
But Christians do not violate God's commandment.
Good one! Tell me another.

Okay it could be a violation depending on how you look at it. If that is the case then all religion is corrupt, not just Christianity.

[McCulloch]

Okay it could be a violation depending on how you look at it. If that is the case then all religion is corrupt, not just Christianity.

As much as I would like to conclude that all religion is corrupt, it is not that easy.

For example, modern Judaism makes no images to be used in worship. There is no representation of the god. Another example is Islam. A third example is Hinduism. Wait! I hear you say, the Hindus have graven images. Yes, they certainly do. But they have no commandment from their gods forbidding them. No, the only examples of religions that both forbid and use images in worship are Christian.

[naz]

Okay it could be a violation depending on how you look at it. If that is the case then all religion is corrupt, not just Christianity.

As much as I would like to conclude that all religion is corrupt, it is not that easy.

For example, modern Judaism makes no images to be used in worship. There is no representation of the god. Another example is Islam. A third example is Hinduism. Wait! I hear you say, the Hindus have graven images. Yes, they certainly do. But they have no commandment from their gods forbidding them. No, the only examples of religions that both forbid and use images in worship are Christian.

[strike]I would like to know what the pope has to say about this. Catholic churches are the biggest promoters of idolatry. It might hinder some people’s ability to give proper praise, because they may focus on the material things and not the spiritual. If people preached outdoors, I don’t think they would have that problem. If anyone ever wanted to see the pope put his foot in his mouth, then that might be the best way to do it.[/strike]

[Murad]

As much as I would like to conclude that all religion is corrupt, it is not that easy.

For example, modern Judaism makes no images to be used in worship. There is no representation of the god. Another example is Islam. A third example is Hinduism. Wait! I hear you say, the Hindus have graven images. Yes, they certainly do. But they have no commandment from their gods forbidding them. No, the only examples of religions that both forbid and use images in worship are Christian.

Well said McCulloch

But Christians will say Paul came with a new covenant, and that christians no longer had to follow the teachings of the prophet moses.
All Jews, All muslims, every single soul that follows the prophets, they have to circumcise, they cannot eat pig.
How is it, Paul decides, its OK to worship the image of Jesus.
How is it, Paul decides its OK to DISREGARD the teachings of moses.
How is it Paul decides that the 10 commandments should become OBSOLETE to christians?
How is it Paul decides the Sabbath should be changed from saturday to sunday?
Because thats when constantine worshipped the sun (in roman mythology)

Jesus said:

(Matt. 5:17)

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

Who do christians really follow? Jesus and Moses or Paul?

[naz]

Symbols and Idols are two different things though. A cross is a symbol it isn’t something people worship. It symbolizes an event. It isn’t something people idolize.
/end-of-discussion