You have no Case for Christ until you can Prove God exists

[brandx1138]

Instead of quibbling over scripture and when, where or if Jesus said what, let's start at the beginning. Christians claim that Jesus is God, but who is this "God"? It means nothing to say that Jesus is God if you cannot define, locate, detect or explain God. So who would like to be the first to answer this call:

Prove God exists.

First you must do that, then we can talk about Jesus. If God cannot be proven to exist, then this whole forum is a waste of everyone's time.

[zepper899]

If God cannot be proven to exist, then this whole forum is a waste of everyone's time.

physicists debate the existence of many phonomena, even if they're "just theories."

[brandx1138]

If God cannot be proven to exist, then this whole forum is a waste of everyone's time.

physicists debate the existence of many phonomena, even if they're "just theories."

Such as?

[McCulloch]

Prove God exists.

That's like asking, "Prove Sferotelekinetic Cherunams exist."

We cannot address the question of whether God exists until we agree what we are talking about. What is God?

[brandx1138]

Prove God exists.

That's like asking, "Prove Sferotelekinetic Cherunams exist."

We cannot address the question of whether God exists until we agree what we are talking about. What is God?

Precisely my point. I'm including the call to define God with the request for proof of his existence. Since no one has done either yet, I remain unconvinced of him, and therefore unconvinced of Christianity from the get-go.

[McCulloch]

God is the uncaused first cause.

Using that definition, then simply regress through a series of questions, like "and what caused that?" until you get to whatever it is that does not have a cause, because it either just came into being without a cause, or simply has always existed. That thing is God, or those things are gods.

God existed and may still exist. Nothing more is known about God or the gods, but God exists or the gods exist (or at least existed).

God is Love.
I love my wife and children.
Therefore, God exists.

[brandx1138]

God is the uncaused first cause.

Using that definition, then simply regress through a series of questions, like "and what caused that?" until you get to whatever it is that does not have a cause, because it either just came into being without a cause, or simply has always existed. That thing is God, or those things are gods.

God existed and may still exist. Nothing more is known about God or the gods, but God exists or the gods exist (or at least existed).

God is Love.
I love my wife and children.
Therefore, God exists.

Are these your assertions and beliefs, or are you just parroting what has been said before about God?

My next few questions would be, "How do you know that God is all or some or one of these things? Where did you learn about this God and his attributes? Can you demonstrate the validity of these claims?"

[McCulloch]

God is the uncaused first cause.

Using that definition, then simply regress through a series of questions, like "and what caused that?" until you get to whatever it is that does not have a cause, because it either just came into being without a cause, or simply has always existed. That thing is God, or those things are gods.

[case 1]God existed and may still exist. Nothing more is known about God or the gods, but God exists or the gods exist (or at least existed).

[case 2]God is Love.
I love my wife and children.
Therefore, God exists.

Are these your assertions and beliefs, or are you just parroting what has been said before about God?

Are those my only two choices?

My next few questions would be, "How do you know that God is all or some or one of these things?

You missed the point. I defined God as the being with those characteristics and then went on to prove that God, as defined, exists.

[case 3]Equally valid, God is a ham sandwich with swiss cheese (hardly kosher, eh?). I have made a ham sandwich with swiss cheese, therefore I am the creator of God, and God's destroyer.

Where did you learn about this God and his attributes?

Which attributes are those? In the first case, nothing is known about this God except that it (or they) are uncaused.

In the second case, I read the definition in the Bible. Whatever attributes love has from personal experience.

In the third case, I simply made it up.

Can you demonstrate the validity of these claims?"

No, in fact, I doubt the validity of any discussion about God that is not preceded by a common definition of what is meant by the word God. That is my point.

[brandx1138]

Where did you learn about this God and his attributes?

Which attributes are those? In the first case, nothing is known about this God except that it (or they) are uncaused.

Wrong. Nothing is known about God except for what is professed to be "known" but isn't. You don't "know" that God is uncaused, unless you can explain your methods for obtaining this knowledge and the reasons for coming to this conclusion.

You admit you made it all up. So why am I talking to you?

[Goat]

God is the uncaused first cause.

Using that definition, then simply regress through a series of questions, like "and what caused that?" until you get to whatever it is that does not have a cause, because it either just came into being without a cause, or simply has always existed. That thing is God, or those things are gods.

God existed and may still exist. Nothing more is known about God or the gods, but God exists or the gods exist (or at least existed).

God is Love.
I love my wife and children.
Therefore, God exists.

When there is no apparent time frame, is there a 'first'?