The Roman Crucifixion

[placebofactor]

The Crucifixion:
I wrote the following some 25 years ago. I do not recall the name of the doctor who did the research concerning the human body when put through the torture of crucifixion. But I remember how it moved me. We read casually about the punishment and crucifixion, not fully getting the impact and degree of suffering.

The Persians between 539 B.C. and 335 B.C. were the inventors of the Crucifixion. They tied their victims to a single stake and left them there to die a slow and agonizing death. Eventually, around 100 B.C., the Romans picked up on this form of torture and death, then brought it to a new level of pain and eventual death. The word ‘excruciating’ did not exist until Christ was crucified. Excruciating interpreted means, “Pain out of the cross.”

Jesus' suffering began in earnest at Gethsemane. It was the day before the Jewish Passover, in early April of 31 A.D. Luke 22:44, “And being in agony he (Jesus) prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood.” because blood may have been mixed with his sweat, he would have been under great physiological stress.

He was then blindfolded and then taken to the high priest’s palace where he was falsely accused of blasphemy, spit on, and beaten. He was then taken to Pilate, and here was Pilate’s offer to the people.
Matthew 27:17, “Who will you that I release unto you? Barabbas or Jesus which is called Christ? And the crowd answered “Barabbas.” They also cried out, “Let his blood be on us, and on our children.”

Barabbas means “son of the Father.” The people called for the “son of God, so they called for Barabbas. The Roman soldiers mocked him, stripped him, put a scarlet robe on him, then made a crown of thorns and placed it on his head. The thorns that grow in that area are two inches in length. The soldiers would have pressed the thorns down on his head cutting deeply into the flesh. They then bowed down mocking him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!”

Isaiah gives further details concerning Jesus' punishment. Isaiah 53:3, He was despised, rejected,” --- Verse 4, “Surely he hath born our griefs and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten”--- wounded, bruised, and “with his stripes” we are healed.”

The Roman whip consists of three braided pieces of rawhide, attached to a round wooden handle, the last 12 inches were not braided. At the ends of the three lashes were tied pieces of sheep bone and iron lead balls. The iron balls would cause deep contusions in the skin tissue, and the bone would cause deep lacerations in the skin, tendons, and muscles under the skin.

The victim was tied to a post, and the Roman soldier doing the lashing would whip the upper back and work their way down the legs. He would move to the other side and repeat his work. When finished, there would be deep cuts and trauma to the back and legs. The blood loss would be significant, causing a significant drop in his blood pressure. Normally 39 lashes were required by law, but the Romans were not obligated to Jewish law, and depending on their mood no count was necessary.

The crossbeam Jesus carried is estimated to weigh 75 to 100 lbs. When they arrived where the sentence was to be carried out, the crossbeam was nailed to the vertical beam that lay on the ground. He was then laid down on top of the vertical beam his arms in a horizontal position before being nailed to it. The nails used were about 6” long and ¼ inch square. They were driven into the wrist just below the carpal bones, considered part of the hand back then. The nails crushed the median nerve and carpal tunnel causing a great deal of excruciating pain. Then the feet were nailed down into the vertical beam. But before they were nailed down, the knees would have to be bent to bring the feet down flat on the beam. The driven nail would crush the medial plantar nerve causing great pain throughout his body.

When finished, the vertical beam was lifted and set in place. When this happened, the weight of Jesus' body would be pulled downward, placing a great deal of pressure on the elbow and shoulder joints, as well as the nails in his feet being driven up into the bones of the feet. It is estimated that the load on his elbow and shoulder joints was between 150 to 200 lbs. on each arm. This would cause the bones of his joints to separate, lengthening his arms six inches. What prevented the arms from tearing off were the tendons and muscles.

In this position, breathing out was much more difficult than breathing in. To exhale, the Lord had to push down on the nails holding his feet to the beam to raise himself. Each time he would make this move, the open flesh on his back would rub up and down on the beam.

Eventually, in his condition, the blood became filled with carbon dioxide causing him to suffocate. Also, from the loss of blood, he would become very thirsty as his tongue would cleave to the roof of his mouth. Due to the loss of blood, he would go into bulimic shock and eventually die of heart failure.

The Roman guard then plunged a spear into the right side of his heart causing blood and water to come out through the wound, proving that he was dead. If he had been alive, they would have broken both of his legs.
So, the next time you look at, or speak of the man hanging from the cross, understand fully what he suffered for every one of us. Also, have you ever considered how the Lord feels when we fail him in words, deeds, motives, and love?

[onewithhim]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 5 feet 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

[JehovahsWitness]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

[placebofactor]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Do you really believe they hung Jesus up on a 6" wide pole? Get a ruler and see how ridiculous that would be. Light wood would snap with 150 lbs. hanging from it. And you think Jesus weighed 180 lbs.? He would have been a giant among the Jewish population back then. Jews were not fat like most Americans. If he weighed 180 lbs, he would have been at least 6' or 6' 2" tall, 5 or 6' taller than the average Jew. And you think his feet were inches off the ground? You only make that claim because you want to shorten the pole, not because it's realistic. Your whole argument is ridiculous and dishonest.

Jesus' height, probably 5' 6 or 7" Weight is 140 to 150 Lbs. The length of the pole is 15 feet. Width of the pole, 9" possibly 10" Weight of pole, is 250 to 300 lbs. That's an honest breakdown. Jesus carried the crossbeam; weight, 40 or 50 lbs. length 7'. The vertical pole was already set when they arrived at the spot of the crucifixion and was already secured in the ground.

Jesus' physical condition: dehydrated, weak from loss of blood, tired because of the long interrogation, and a crown of 6" thorns driven down into his skull.

[placebofactor]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Do you really believe they hung Jesus up on a 6" wide pole? Get a ruler and see how ridiculous that would be. Light wood would snap with 150 lbs. hanging from it. And you think Jesus weighed 180 lbs.? He would have been a giant among the Jewish population back then. Jews were not fat like most Americans. If he weighed 180 lbs, he would have been at least 6' or 6' 2" tall, 5 or 6' taller than the average Jew. And you think his feet were inches off the ground? You only make that claim because you want to shorten the pole, not because it's realistic. Your whole argument is ridiculous and dishonest.

Jesus' height, probably 5' 6 or 7" Weight is 140 to 150 Lbs. The length of the pole is 15 feet. Width of the pole, 9" possibly 10" Weight of pole, is 250 to 300 lbs. That's an honest breakdown. Jesus carried the crossbeam; weight, 40 or 50 lbs. length 7'. The vertical pole was already set when they arrived at the spot of the crucifixion and was already secured in the ground.

Jesus' physical condition: dehydrated, weak from loss of blood, tired because of the long interrogation, and a crown of 6" thorns driven down into his skull.

One more thing, look at your picture, the timber Jesus is carrying looks to me like it would weigh at least 250 lbs. (dead weight).

[placebofactor]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Do you really believe they hung Jesus up on a 6" wide pole? Get a ruler and see how ridiculous that would be. Light wood would snap with 150 lbs. hanging from it. And you think Jesus weighed 180 lbs.? He would have been a giant among the Jewish population back then. Jews were not fat like most Americans. If he weighed 180 lbs, he would have been at least 6' or 6' 2" tall, 5 or 6' taller than the average Jew. And you think his feet were inches off the ground? You only make that claim because you want to shorten the pole, not because it's realistic. Your whole argument is ridiculous and dishonest.

Jesus' height, probably 5' 6 or 7" Weight is 140 to 150 Lbs. The length of the pole is 15 feet. Width of the pole, 9" possibly 10" Weight of pole, is 250 to 300 lbs. That's an honest breakdown. Jesus carried the crossbeam; weight, 40 or 50 lbs. length 7'. The vertical pole was already set when they arrived at the spot of the crucifixion and was already secured in the ground.

Jesus' physical condition: dehydrated, weak from loss of blood, tired because of the long interrogation, and a crown of 6" thorns driven down into his skull.

One more thing, look at your picture, the timber Jesus is carrying looks to me like it would weigh at least 250 lbs. (dead weight).

One other thing you may want to consider, in Matthew 27:37, "And set up over his (Jesus) head his accusation written, this is Jesus the King of the Jews."
Note, it reads, "Over his head, not over his hands. If hanging on a pole, his hands would have been above his head, and the sign placed over his hands.

[placebofactor]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Do you really believe they hung Jesus up on a 6" wide pole? Get a ruler and see how ridiculous that would be. Light wood would snap with 150 lbs. hanging from it. And you think Jesus weighed 180 lbs.? He would have been a giant among the Jewish population back then. Jews were not fat like most Americans. If he weighed 180 lbs, he would have been at least 6' or 6' 2" tall, 5 or 6' taller than the average Jew. And you think his feet were inches off the ground? You only make that claim because you want to shorten the pole, not because it's realistic. Your whole argument is ridiculous and dishonest.

Jesus' height, probably 5' 6 or 7" Weight is 140 to 150 Lbs. The length of the pole is 15 feet. Width of the pole, 9" possibly 10" Weight of pole, is 250 to 300 lbs. That's an honest breakdown. Jesus carried the crossbeam; weight, 40 or 50 lbs. length 7'. The vertical pole was already set when they arrived at the spot of the crucifixion and was already secured in the ground.

Jesus' physical condition: dehydrated, weak from loss of blood, tired because of the long interrogation, and a crown of 6" thorns driven down into his skull.

One more thing, look at your picture, the timber Jesus is carrying looks to me like it would weigh at least 250 lbs. (dead weight).

One other thing you may want to consider, in Matthew 27:37, "And set up over his (Jesus) head his accusation written, this is Jesus the King of the Jews."
Note, it reads, "Over his head, not over his hands. If hanging on a pole, his hands would have been above his head, and the sign placed over his hands.

Also, if Jesus was hanging close to the ground, the Romans would not have used a spear to pierce his side, but a sword or knife. Roman spears were over 6 feet in length, so they must have had to reach up in order to pierce under his ribs.

[onewithhim]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

I know. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to take ownership of that great post you made.

[onewithhim]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

OK. That goes along with my idea completely. You just proved my point, and even for a man 9 inches tall and very strong, weighing about 180 pounds. The 100 lb. stauros would have been child's play if he hadn't been beaten and starved and sleep-deprived. And, the Romans undoubtedly had dug a hole 4 feet deep.

That's my post One. I wrote the above to refute the idea that the stauros would have had to weight 300 pounds!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

If you're referring to post #35, I don't know how on earth that post was ascribed to me. I didn't mean to do that.

[JehovahsWitness]

If you're referring to post #35, I don't know how on earth that post was ascribed to me. I didn't mean to do that.

You did nothing wrong One , I thought you meant to replyi to place instead of me , no matter .... anyway the bottom line is the information in #35 didnt seem to make any difference anyway ... still I learnt a lot from doing the research, so that's something...

Agapé ,

JW

ps could have saved myself an afternoon of research and just asked chatgpt

[placebofactor]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #79]

I get the impression few of you have never worked with lumber or timbers or have any construction experience. And have never lifted a 15' 6x6 or 15' 8x8, or a 15' 10x10. if I were a new reader on this forum, and knew nothing about the crucifixion, and had no knowledge of timber, here's the impression I would get from some of the analyzing of Christ's crucifixion.

Jesus was 6'2", weighed 300 lbs., and went to the gym daily. Could bench press 450 lbs. and deadlift 800 lbs. The beating he received did not affect his physical condition, and neither did his loss of blood. What he carried to the site of crucifixion was a 15-foot straw-like stake that weighed 20 lbs. When they nailed him up, they used tacking nails, and his toes touched the ground.

Wow, what an amazing characterization of the crucifixion.