Jesus is not an angel- hebrews 1

[Wootah]

5 For to which of the angels did God ever say,

“You are my Son;
today I have become your Father”?

The whole of hebrews 1 makes it clear Jesus is not an angel.

Anyone disagree?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

How so seeing Jesus was not born?

He came down from heaven after being alive for billions of years, even creating with his Father. His life didn't begin when he was born on Earth. Check out John chapter 17.

[slowrider]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

How so seeing Jesus was not born?

He came down from heaven after being alive for billions of years, even creating with his Father. His life didn't begin when he was born on Earth. Check out John chapter 17.

This is so incorrect, check out all the bible.
Instead of making absurd statements make them one at a time and then prove it one at a time.
By the way
earth is completely surrounded by heaven.

Would that not make earth located in heaven?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

How so seeing Jesus was not born?

He came down from heaven after being alive for billions of years, even creating with his Father. His life didn't begin when he was born on Earth. Check out John chapter 17.

This is so incorrect, check out all the bible.
Instead of making absurd statements make them one at a time and then prove it one at a time.

What is absurd about Jesus saying at John chapter 17 that he had glory with God before coming here? John 17 is proof of my statement. Do you have scriptures in mind that show that Jesus did not exist before he was born on Earth?

"So now you, Father, glorify me alongside yourself with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was." (John 17:5)

[slowrider]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

How so seeing Jesus was not born?

He came down from heaven after being alive for billions of years, even creating with his Father. His life didn't begin when he was born on Earth. Check out John chapter 17.

This is so incorrect, check out all the bible.
Instead of making absurd statements make them one at a time and then prove it one at a time.

What is absurd about Jesus saying at John chapter 17 that he had glory with God before coming here? John 17 is proof of my statement. Do you have scriptures in mind that show that Jesus did not exist before he was born on Earth?

"So now you, Father, glorify me alongside yourself with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was." (John 17:5)

What is absurd is just about everything you post. I do not see how any one in their right mind would allow you to post on their forum.

To begin with you
NEVER EVER PROVE ANYTHING YOU POST.

AND YOU RARELY ANSWER A DIRECT QUESTION.

ALL YOU DO IS PUSH YOU JW PROPAGANDA ON THIS FORUM
DAY AFTER DAY.

THAT IS ALL YOU DO

AND I AM SICK OF IT

SO MUCH I MIGHT DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

I HAVE POWER WITH GOD.

[Wootah]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

Hebrews 1 seems to making a strong case that Jesus is not an angel. So that we don't confuse Jesus with an angel. So that we understand it is OK to worship Jesus because it is not OK to worship an angel.

I mean what NT verses are you using for that claim? Where is your case for the exodus reference.

Any postman is an angel btw.

I will argue back that Angel of the Lord is a title. Probably.

But I think first let's establish the message of hebrews 1 is to clearly separate Jesus from the angels.

[otseng]

What is absurd is just about everything you post. I do not see how any one in their right mind would allow you to post on their forum.

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[Capbook]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

Do the Bible says that Jacob (Israel) sinned when he prayed to an angel he addressed as God in verse 15?

Gen 48:15 And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
Gen 48:16 The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

Do the Bible says that Jacob (Israel) sinned when he prayed to an angel he addressed as God in verse 15?

Gen 48:15 And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
Gen 48:16 The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.

I don't see where Jacob prayed to an angel. Please explain.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

If Jesus is an angel then God is an angel.

Explain Exodus 14:19.

Explain how God can Father an angel?

God creates angels, Mormons say he has sexual intercourse with angels and produces sons and daughters called man and woman.

[Capbook]

[Replying to Wootah in post #1]

Do you agree, as most people do, that Jesus was in the cloud and the column of fire that brought the Israelites out of Egypt? At Exodus 14:19 it says that "the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear and the pillar of cloud departed from their van and stood in the rear of them."

How does that answer hebrews 1?

It shows that Jesus is an angel. The archangel, in fact. How does Hebrews 1 conform to that? I think it refers to all the other angels, other than the higher angel--the archangel. (There is only one archangel mentioned in the Bible.)

Do the Bible says that Jacob (Israel) sinned when he prayed to an angel he addressed as God in verse 15?

Gen 48:15 And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day,
Gen 48:16 The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth.

I don't see where Jacob prayed to an angel. Please explain.

Verse 15 he talked to God, adore of what God had done to him, if you pray does it mean you don't talk to God?
Verse 16 he mentioned the Angel that redeemed him from all evil, who do you think your Redeemer is?
Do the Bible says Jacob sinned when he consider his redeemer is the Angel?