Hosea 5:15

[placebofactor]

Hosea 5:15

I have several questions that need the insight of others. My questions concern Hosea 5:15. The LORD is speaking to the prophet and said to him,

“I will go and return to my place, until they (the Jews) acknowledge (or confess) their offense, and seek my face; in their affliction, they will seek me early.”

When do you think the Lord returned to his place? My response can be found in Acts 1:9 when Jesus “was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.” In other words, when he returned to his Father in heaven.
Your thoughts.

Second question: “What was the offense of the Jews?” I think it was the rejection and the murder of the Son of God.
Your thoughts.

Third question: What affliction is he speaking of? I believe it’s the time of Jacob’s trouble, or the ‘Great Tribulation" the Jews will have to suffer through.
Your thoughts.

[1213]

Second question: “What was the offense of the Jews?” I think it was the rejection and the murder of the Son of God.
Your thoughts.

I think the main offence has been that they have rejected God and His word (teachings), don't love God and neighbor as they should.

[placebofactor]

Second question: “What was the offense of the Jews?” I think it was the rejection and the murder of the Son of God.
Your thoughts.

I think the main offence has been that they have rejected God and His word (teachings), don't love God and neighbor as they should.

I agree!

[onewithhim]

Hosea 5:15

I have several questions that need the insight of others. My questions concern Hosea 5:15. The LORD is speaking to the prophet and said to him,

“I will go and return to my place, until they (the Jews) acknowledge (or confess) their offense, and seek my face; in their affliction, they will seek me early.”

When do you think the Lord returned to his place? My response can be found in Acts 1:9 when Jesus “was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.” In other words, when he returned to his Father in heaven.
Your thoughts.

Second question: “What was the offense of the Jews?” I think it was the rejection and the murder of the Son of God.
Your thoughts.

Third question: What affliction is he speaking of? I believe it’s the time of Jacob’s trouble, or the ‘Great Tribulation" the Jews will have to suffer through.
Your thoughts.

The LORD in Hosea 5:15 is YHWH [Jehovah], for whenever you see "LORD" in all capital letters that is where God's name appears in the original Hebrew language. So Jehovah will return to His place until the Jews acknowledge their offense. "His place" would merely be away from the Israelites, because they offended Him. He forgave them over and over but they kept on disobeying Him and worshipping other gods. When they are sorry for their offenses, Jehovah forgives them and is "with" them again. This happened time and time again. It has nothing to do with Jesus being taken up in a cloud to return to heaven, or the Great Tribulation.

The offense of the Jews as found in Hosea was their disobedience and faithlessness as well as their idolatry. The Jews were responsible for murdering Jesus, but that wasn't the situation in Hosea's day. Eventually they were held accountable for Jesus' death as well.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #4]

Onewithhim, you wrote, " "His place" would merely be away from the Israelites."

Now let's reason this out, there are two places the LORD would go in the days of Israah. He would either remain with his people in the Temple or return to his place in heaven. Now he only came to the Temple once each year on the day of atonement. Or he came to the prophets in dreams and visions.

2. Whose face (protection) are the Jews going to be seeking during their time of tribulation? Verse 6:1, tells us his people have been 'torn," but one day in the future, they will be healed. They haven't been healed yet; they remain under his curse.

Your thoughts.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #4]

Onewithhim, you wrote, " "His place" would merely be away from the Israelites."

Now let's reason this out, there are two places the LORD would go in the days of Israah. He would either remain with his people in the Temple or return to his place in heaven. Now he only came to the Temple once each year on the day of atonement. Or he came to the prophets in dreams and visions.

2. Whose face (protection) are the Jews going to be seeking during their time of tribulation? Verse 6:1, tells us his people have been 'torn," but one day in the future, they will be healed. They haven't been healed yet; they remain under his curse.

Your thoughts.

1. I see you think that Jehovah is literally in the temple when he is "with" his people. I believe that he remains in heaven and sends his representatives or merely his Holy Spirit to intercede for him. Solomon brought out a good point when he said about Jehovah: "Will God truly dwell upon the earth? Look! The heavens, yes, the heaven of the heavens, cannot contain you; how much less, then, this house that I have built!" (I Kings 8:27) So, not literally coming to the earth he would turn his face away from the people right there in his abode, heaven. Perhaps his representative would "return to his place," and that is said as if Jehovah did so, because it is his representative that went to the earth.

2. Later

[placebofactor]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #6]

Leviticus 16:2, "And the LORD said unto Moses, speak unto Aaron they brother (the High Priest of Israel), that he come NOT at all into the holy place within the vail before the mercy seat, which is upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat."

He also appeared to Moses as a burning fire in the burning bush, to Manoah as the angel of the Lord, to Abraham as a man, etc. After these appearances, my understanding is, that he returns to his place in heaven.

[JehovahsWitness]

IN WHAT SENSE DOES JEHOVAH LEAVE [GO AWAY] OR RETURN ?

The "going away /returning" that Jehovah does in Hosea 5:15 is not literal but metaphoric.

A metaphor is a way of communicating an idea though word pictures and should not be taken literally. For example in English when we say "return to health " we do not mean there is a place called 'health' that we left and then came back to, but rather that we regained or returned to a healthy condition.

When the bible speaks about God [JEHOVAH] the Father leaving / going or returning it is always speaking about his turning particular aspect of his attention or favor in a particular direction and/or taking (or withholding) a particular action , never of him literally leaving his location in heaven

• Jehovah God never literally has to displace his person as he can see everything from his home in heaven.

• There is no need for him to literally bodiy move anywhere because he can send out his holy spirit [active force] to achieve anything anywhere.

• Jehovah has the myriads of angels* at his disposal, who he can literally sent to earth to convey messages from him to humans or act on their behalf

• No human can see Almighty God and live

* On several occassions it seems that his son Jesus (also called Michael in scripture) in his prehuman existence , was sent to act and communicate with faithful humans


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[onewithhim]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #6]

Leviticus 16:2, "And the LORD said unto Moses, speak unto Aaron they brother (the High Priest of Israel), that he come NOT at all into the holy place within the vail before the mercy seat, which is upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat."

He also appeared to Moses as a burning fire in the burning bush, to Manoah as the angel of the Lord, to Abraham as a man, etc. After these appearances, my understanding is, that he returns to his place in heaven.

Jehovah's angel is who is in the cloud and in the fire. His angels represent Him who is too glorious to fit Himself onto the earth. See Exodus 14:19.

"Then the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear..."

The representatives of God would literally return to heaven. God Himself would always remain in heaven, sending His Spirit to do His works.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #9]

Onewithhim, You wrote, Jehovah's angel is who is in the cloud and in the fire. His angels represent Him who is too glorious to fit Himself onto the earth. See Exodus 14:19.

He went behind the Jews to block the light of the day from the Egyptians, yet the front of the cloud gave light to the Jews. And then by his power, he opened the sea for the Israelites to pass. You're not saying the LORD cannot be in the cloud and open the sea at the same time, are you?

You wrote, "Then the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to the rear...

You put quotes on "Then the angel of the true God ----"

You added the word "True" to the verse obviously to make it more emphatic, and agreeable to what you teach. You can't do that. The Bible says we are not to add or subtract words.