You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

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2timothy316
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You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #1

Post by 2timothy316 »

The Tanager wrote: Thu Apr 18, 2024 4:28 pm
2timothy316 wrote: Thu Apr 18, 2024 3:40 pm"Correct view" you say. Clear this up for me. You mean one must believe in the basic belief of the trinity to be saved right?
No, I’m saying the complete opposite. I’m explicitly saying one doesn’t have to have the correct/true view of God’s nature (trinitarian or not) to be saved. I’m saying one can be wrong about the trinity and still be saved.
Is this true? One doesn't have to believe in the trinity to be saved?

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #111

Post by onewithhim »

Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 12:35 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 10:22 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 1:28 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 4:24 am
onewithhim wrote: Wed Sep 11, 2024 9:22 am
He doesn't need a "helping hand." The Holy Spirit is directly from Him, and just means His power and force, the way He gets things done. It's not something separate from Him.
The Spirit itself makes intercession for us. Lexicon define "maketh intercession" as to intercede on behalf of someone, with specific emphasis upon the fact that what is being done is for the sake of someone else
Can a force make specific emphasis? (Rom 8:26)
It can when it is God's thoughts! The HS is sent forth to do what God wants done. (Can a Person be divided and sit on 120 people's shoulders? Can a Person split itself up into millions of pieces to influence people all over the earth? The answer is a resounding no.)
When God speaks, it is done. May I know what role does the HS done here? (Psa 33:9)
It is done by means of Holy Spirit. It's almost like God's breath. He speaks and the Holy Spirit goes forth from Him like His breath. It is a force, not a person.
Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #112

Post by Capbook »

onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 12:35 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 10:22 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 1:28 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 4:24 am

The Spirit itself makes intercession for us. Lexicon define "maketh intercession" as to intercede on behalf of someone, with specific emphasis upon the fact that what is being done is for the sake of someone else
Can a force make specific emphasis? (Rom 8:26)
It can when it is God's thoughts! The HS is sent forth to do what God wants done. (Can a Person be divided and sit on 120 people's shoulders? Can a Person split itself up into millions of pieces to influence people all over the earth? The answer is a resounding no.)
When God speaks, it is done. May I know what role does the HS done here? (Psa 33:9)
It is done by means of Holy Spirit. It's almost like God's breath. He speaks and the Holy Spirit goes forth from Him like His breath. It is a force, not a person.
Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #113

Post by onewithhim »

Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 12:35 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 10:22 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 1:28 pm
It can when it is God's thoughts! The HS is sent forth to do what God wants done. (Can a Person be divided and sit on 120 people's shoulders? Can a Person split itself up into millions of pieces to influence people all over the earth? The answer is a resounding no.)
When God speaks, it is done. May I know what role does the HS done here? (Psa 33:9)
It is done by means of Holy Spirit. It's almost like God's breath. He speaks and the Holy Spirit goes forth from Him like His breath. It is a force, not a person.
Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #114

Post by Capbook »

onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:30 am
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 12:35 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 10:22 pm

When God speaks, it is done. May I know what role does the HS done here? (Psa 33:9)
It is done by means of Holy Spirit. It's almost like God's breath. He speaks and the Holy Spirit goes forth from Him like His breath. It is a force, not a person.
Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."
So, you will leave "human society" interpretation and favor all people?

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #115

Post by onewithhim »

Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 3:19 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:30 am
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 12:35 pm
It is done by means of Holy Spirit. It's almost like God's breath. He speaks and the Holy Spirit goes forth from Him like His breath. It is a force, not a person.
Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."
So, you will leave "human society" interpretation and favor all people?
Yes, they are the same. "People" is fine.

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #116

Post by Capbook »

onewithhim wrote: Sun Nov 03, 2024 1:03 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 3:19 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:30 am
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Sep 28, 2024 4:18 am

Can a force grieved? (Eph 4:30)
Maybe you can post a lexicon that define the Holy Spirit as force. To settle this once and for all.
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."
So, you will leave "human society" interpretation and favor all people?
Yes, they are the same. "People" is fine.
I mean "all people".

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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #117

Post by onewithhim »

Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 09, 2024 4:46 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sun Nov 03, 2024 1:03 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 3:19 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:30 am
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am
onewithhim wrote: Tue Oct 01, 2024 3:04 pm
You can settle it by thinking for yourself. The HS can be grieved because Jehovah is grieved. Also, a Person cannot be divided up 120 ways and appear on peoples' shoulders, as in the upper room. Think!
You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."
So, you will leave "human society" interpretation and favor all people?
Yes, they are the same. "People" is fine.
I mean "all people".
Yes, that is what a human society is---all people.

Capbook
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Re: You Don't Need to Believe in the Trinity to be Saved?

Post #118

Post by Capbook »

onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 09, 2024 6:26 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 09, 2024 4:46 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sun Nov 03, 2024 1:03 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 3:19 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Nov 02, 2024 10:30 am
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 30, 2024 4:32 pm
onewithhim wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:57 pm
Capbook wrote: Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:21 am
onewithhim wrote: Fri Oct 04, 2024 1:04 pm
Capbook wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 2:40 am

You are just under estimating the power of HS. (Acts 2:4)
As you will not give lexicon definition of HS during the time of its usage.
I'll give you one; (
1. (holy) of persons whose services God employs,
2. (Spirit) or divine God.

Acts 2:4
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

NT:40 hagios, hagia, hagion
1. properly reverend, worthy of veneration: Luke 1:49
a. used of things which on account of some connection with God possess a certain distinction and claim to reverence, as places sacred to God which are not to be profaned, Acts 7:33;
b. of persons whose services God employs
2. set apart for God, to be, as it were, exclusively his; followed by a genitive or a dative: Luke 2:23
3. of sacrifices and offerings; prepared for God with solemn rite, pure, clean
4. in a moral sense, pure, sinless, upright, holy: 1 Peter 1:16
(Thayer's Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database)

NT:4151 pneuma (pnyoo'-mah); from NT:4154; a current of air, i.e. breath (blast) or a breeze; by analogy or figuratively, a spirit, i.e. (human) the rational soul, (by implication) vital principle, mental disposition, etc., or (superhuman) an angel, demon, or (divine) God, Christ's spirit, the Holy Spirit:

KJV - ghost, life, spirit (-ual, -ually), mind. Compare NT:5590.
(New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. )
You're just quoting a lot of lexicons and so-called Bible scholars (who are all biased). You are not reasoning on the scriptures themselves. You can't seem capable of thinking for yourself.
Lexicographers have higher credentials to define Bible word at the time of its usage.
If you interpret Bible words without consulting lexicons you will be misguided, just like "earth' as human society.
I am not fond of adding my own interpretation as it would be a man's contribution and not of God then.
Bible text interpreted by Bible text is safe from eisegesis.
The meaning of EISEGESIS is the interpretation of a text (as of the Bible) by reading into it one's own ideas.
Well I am not guilty of "eisegesis." I haven't inserted my own ideas into anything.

You haven't commented on Genesis 11:1. It shows that the "earth" is human society, and you can see that without referring to your lexicons.

"And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech." (KJV) Tell me that's not referring to human society.
If you make your own definition of Bible words, I believe you'll be misguided and prone to eisegesis.
It could mean "people" as one of the "land inhabitants", but not solely means human society.

Human society is a group of people who share a common lifestyle, organization, and culture, and who are involved with each other through persistent relationships:
OK, at Genesis 11:1 it refers to the earth as being people. Why quibble over the meaning of "human society?" I'll go along with "people."
So, you will leave "human society" interpretation and favor all people?
Yes, they are the same. "People" is fine.
I mean "all people".
Yes, that is what a human society is---all people.
Can you provide online definition of human society?
Link also.

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