Is my statement blasphemy to you?

[Wootah]

'Wootah is one with God and is in God and is equal to God.'

Is my statement blasphemy to you?

[JehovahsWitness]

Oh so now all those guys are in you as well ....

They aren't on the throne...

Your point?

[Wootah]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #21]

My point is you keep injecting not God into your faith with God.

Think about how blasphemous it is to have a false idol in God's temple. Only God can be worshipped in his temple.

If my body is now the temple of God only God dwells in it and not Jesus or the Spirit which are (according to you) not God.

Your theology makes the NT blasphemy.

[JehovahsWitness]

If my body is now the temple of God only God dwells in it and not Jesus or the Spirit ...

John 14:23
Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and --> My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.

Ephesians 3:17
so that --> Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

2 Timothy 1:14
Guard, through the --> Holy Spirit who dwells in us, the treasure which has been entrusted to you.

[Wootah]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #23]

And your job is to explain your theology of how those verse are not blasphemy.

Remember the shema. No other gods.

[Miles]

None of the verses you refer to above have Jesus claiming equality God, indeed Jesus was quite explicit about his position vis-a-vis to his Father.

Yet we read . . .

John 10:30
30 I and the Father are one.” [If X = Y why wouldn't Y = X? . (If 34 = 34 why wouldn't 34 = 34?)]

[Wilhelm Wundt credits Gottfried Leibniz with the symbolic formulation, "A is A". Leibniz's Law is a similar principle, that if two objects have all the same properties, they are in fact one and the same: Fx and Fy iff x = y. ]
source: Wikipedia
__________________________________________


Mark 14: 61-64 “Once again the high priest interrogated him: ‘Are you the messiah, the
Son of the Blessed One?’ Then Jesus answered: ‘I am; and you will see the Son of
Man seated at the right hand of the Power and coming with the clouds of heaven.’ At
that the high priest tore his robes and said: ‘What further need do we have of witnesses?
You have heard the blasphemy….’”

John 8:58
“Jesus answered them: ‘I solemnly declare it:
before Abraham came to be, I AM.”
[I recognize that the JW Bible has changed Jesus's reply here to "Jesus said to them: 'Most truly I say to you, before Abraham came into existence, I have been." to avoid having Jesus say "I AM." which would identify him as god, but 92% of the Bibles I checked disagree with this change and do use "I AM."]

[This was the name God gave himself when he first communicated
with Moses, Exodus 3:14
“God replied, ‘I am who am.’ Then he added, ‘This is what you
shall tell the Israelites: I AM sent me to you.’”]

.

[JehovahsWitness]

DID JESUS BLASPHEME WHEN HE CLAIMED TO BE GOD'S SON?

JOHN 10:34-36

Jesus answered them: “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said: “You are gods”’?+ 35 If he called ‘gods’+ those against* whom the word of God came—and yet the scripture cannot be nullified— 36 do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?

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viewtopic.php?p=1128991#p1128991

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To learn more please go to other posts related to ....

IDOLATRY and ... BLASPHEMY and ... THE "TRINITY TEXTS" DEBUNKED

[JehovahsWitness]

John 10:30
I and the Father are one.”

• EXPLAINED : John 10:30: What did Jesus mean by My father and I are one?
  viewtopic.php?p=1112220#p1112220

__________________________________________


Mark 14: 61-64 “Once again the high priest interrogated him: ‘Are you the messiah, the
Son of the Blessed One?’ Then Jesus answered: ‘I am; and you will see the Son of
Man seated at the right hand of the Power and coming with the clouds of heaven.’ At
that the high priest tore his robes and said: ‘What further need do we have of witnesses?
You have heard the blasphemy….’”

• EXPLAINED : Did Jesus blasphemously claim to be GOD during his illegal night trial ?
  viewtopic.php?p=1129000#p1129000

__________________________________________

John 8:58
“Jesus answered them: ‘I solemnly declare it:
before Abraham came to be, I AM.”

• EXPLAINED : Did Jesus declare himself YHWH at John 8:58 ?
  viewtopic.php?p=1128994#p1128994

__________________________________________

[This was the name God gave himself when he first communicated
with Moses, Exodus 3:14
“God replied, ‘I am who am.’ Then he added, ‘This is what you
shall tell the Israelites: I AM sent me to you.’”]

• EXPLAINED : Did Jesus apply the name of God as declared at Exodus 3:14 to himself?
  viewtopic.php?p=1128995#p1128995

[JehovahsWitness]

EGO EMINI

in John 8:58, Jesus was not using the verb 'to be' as a TITLE but rather normally in a phrase to explain his existence prior to Abraham. If Jesus was using the verb "to be" as a title He would have needed to say "I am [the] I AM" .



HOW SHOULD EGO EIMI (English "I am") BE PROPERLY TRANSLATED IN JOHN 8:58 ?

"Ego eimi" is literally simple present. However the usage of Jesus is similar to what many scholars refer to as the historical present. meaning that Jesus places his present tense usage in a past tense context by using the word "BEFORE" Jesus said "before Abraham came to be existing "[lit] I am". In this situation in English we would normally use the present perfect tense ('I have been').

J. H. Moulton's Grammar of New Testament Greek states: ["The Present which indicates the continuance of an action during the past and up to the moment of speaking is virtually the same as Perfective, the only difference being that the action is conceived as still in progress (Burton § 17).It is frequent in the NT: Luke 2:48; 13:7; 15:29; Jn 5:6; 8:58; 14:9; 15:27; Acts 15:21; 26:31; 2 Cor.12:19,2 Ti.3:18; 2 Pt.3:4; 1 Jn 2:9;3:8." (Note that Moulton includes John 8:58 in this category)

further reading
http://searchforbibletruths.blogspot.co ... x-314.html
http://sahidicinsight.blogspot.com/2010 ... jesus.html
http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.com ... art-1.html

https://fosterheologicalreflections.blo ... elder.html
https://fosterheologicalreflections.blo ... n-858.html

[JehovahsWitness]

#QUESTION: How should "ehyah asher ehyeh" properly be rendered?

God's reply to Moses question in Ex 3: 13 in hebrew was : "ehyah asher ehyeh" Some translations render this as I AM THAT I AM. However, it is to be noted that the Hebrew verb from which the word "Ehyeh" is derived in the imperfect state, first person singular, so it should arguably be rendered "I shall become" or "I shall prove to be" . Note the following.

"Notice that we do not have in v. 14 ANI ASHER ANI but a paranomastic use of the verb HAYAH. This suggests on the one hand that we ought not to translate the phrase 'I am that I am' as if it were an ontological statement, a statement about God's being, but rather we seem to be being told something about God's activity or self-revelation in his activity. The focus then is not on God's being a self-contained, self-existent being . . . God then is not speaking about what God is in the divine essence, but rather what Yahweh is or will be in relationship to his people--in his self-revelation." - Ben Witherington Laura M Ice, The Shadow of the Almighty: Father, Son and Spirit in Biblical Perspective (pp. 10-11)

WERE JESUS WORDS AT JOHN 8:58 A DECLARATION OF THE DIVINE NAME AS FOUND AT EXODUS 3:13, 14?

There is no connection with Exodus 3:14 and John 8:58, because the Hebrew does not say "I Am." It says *ehyeh* which means "I Will Be/Become." . Note the following :

"The imperfect of *hyy* [*ehyeh*] always refers to the future. If one could say 'I am that I am' in Hebrew at all, it would probably be through some such barbarous circumlocution as *anoki hu asher anoki hu*'." , William H.C. Propp, The Anchor Bible's commentary on Exodus 3:14 (1999), p. 204

Later translators in the LXX tradition (e.g., Theodotion) recognized the above rendering Exodus 3:14 as ESOMAI hOS ESOMAI, corresponding to "I will be Who I will be."





Rotherhams trys to reflect this meaning by rendering verse 14 "Will Become whatsoever I please".

[Wootah]

[Replying to Miles in post #2]

Oh ... why not?