What About the Sea Creatures?

[Skeptical]

I know that JWs believe in a Paradise on Earth. And I know that some of the Bible verses that they base their beliefs on are Genesis 1:28-30 in conjunction with Isaiah 11:6-9 and Revelation 21:1-4. However, I would like to ask JWs and other Christians who have the belief in paradise earth: What about the sea creatures?

Because even in the Bible, the dangerous and ferocious creature Leviathan was created by God according to Psalm 104:24-26. Plus, according to science, there are other dangerous and ferocious creatures that God created such as sharks. But in all fairness, I would like to post this 2 minute and 8 seconds video, which puts sharks in the best light possible.



However, if that was too long for you, I have this 51 second video, which features characteristics that only a Creator God could create. (Hebrews 3:4 and Revelation 4:11)



Therefore, are the scriptures that mention total peace in the human kingdom and the animal kingdom only referring to land creatures? And do those verses exclude the sea creatures? Because I don't quite get it.

But here is another example of the electric eel in this 2 minute and 25 second video, even though there are many, many more dangerous and predatory sea creatures such as this.

[Skeptical]

Okay... I'm through with that

Perhaps the wisest decision on your part. I think we have both expressed our position clearly enough:

• You believe (without millions of years) animals digestive systems can only adapt to their environment through surgery.

• I don't know exactly what the starting point was regarding the first animals on earth and dont believe you or anyone does, so I don't believe anyone can or should be dogmatic as to limiting the potential adapatbility of creatures.

Well, sure I do. It's right here at Genesis 1:20-23 where God created the sea creatures (also now, we're back on topic) on the fifth day...

20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

And then at Genesis 1:24-31, the land animals and humans were created on the sixth day...

24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.

Therefore, I don't know what the mystery is. Also, as far as animals' digestive systems only adapting to their environment... So, I guess you're saying that God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood? And if so... why? Plus, we know that they weren't carnivorous prior to the flood because if so, then a lot of the pairs of animals that came on the boat... wouldn't have came out.

[JehovahsWitness]

I guess you're saying that God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood?

Where did I say that? Please produce the post where I said "God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood"

[Skeptical]

... basically what I was saying was that God DID change his own laws ...

And basically I disagree; I have already explained why I disagree with you in Post #32
viewtopic.php?p=1124656#p1124656

You did more than disagreed. You ignored what I said in my post #44 about:

because basically what I was saying was that God DID change his own laws and his own standards as found in Genesis 9:3. Because his original standards was the eating meat was bad... and that it will be bad again during JWs' new system. (Yes, No?)

Because I'm not the one going on about Isaiah 11:6-9, but you are.

[JehovahsWitness]

we know that they weren't carnivorous prior to the flood because if so, then a lot of the pairs of animals that came on the boat... wouldn't have came out.

There is no scripture that says that were no carnivorous prior to the flood ; you seem to be speculating. Please prove there is a scripture that says "that were no carnivorous prior to the flood".

[Skeptical]

So, are you saying that it's Biblical that concubines are actually wives? And if so, then how does that work?

I am saying that in the biblical usage concubines were in the nature of a secondary wives and sometimes spoken of as a wife.

.... how does that work?

Those some like weasel words. Also, is there a reason why that isn't allowed with Christians?

A man married (usually a slave) and she had similar rights to a wife.

Ummmm. So, I guess the word "similar" doesn't mean anything to you? smh

[Skeptical]

his original standards was the eating meat was bad... and that it will be "bad again" during JWs' new system. (Yes, No?)

No. There is no scripture that says that eating meat is bad. Nor us there any statement in any Watchtower that says that eating meat will be bad in the new system. Where did you read that?

LOL You mean you can say that with a straight face after all of your arguments about there not being predation in the new system? LOL

[JehovahsWitness]

You ignored what I said in my post #44 about:

because basically what I was saying was that God DID change his own laws and his own standards as found in Genesis 9:3. Because his original standards was the eating meat was bad... . (Yes, No?)

Okay here is my response to the above (from post #44): My response to is the above is as follows.

No.


I will now explain why I say "No": There was no law to prohibit eating animals prior to the flood in Noahs day. God had stated that fruit and plants were given to man for food and that continues to be the case to this day . Since there was no mention if animals being given as food, its a fair to presume that it was not God's original purpose animals be eaten, but there was no prohibitive law to change since no law had been given.

That said , divine laws come and go according to circumstances, divine PRINCIPLES remain constant.

If by standards you mean what God considers right and wrong , then they too remain constant. It is (and always will be) wrong to take a life without divine permission to do so. What God allows humans to eat may vary according to population and circumstances but the principle is that all life belongs to him and all life (including animal life) is sacred so killing (humans or animals) are subject to his permission.



JW



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[Skeptical]

I guess you're saying that God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood?

Where did I say that? Please produce the post where I said "God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood"

Um, Albert E... It's just like when you ask me a question like: Are you saying this or that? It's just a question the same way that you ask me similarly. However, I guess JWs are used to applying double standards.

[JehovahsWitness]

I guess you're saying that God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood?

Where did I say that? Please produce the post where I said "God performed some sort of miraculous surgery on the animals right after Noah's flood"

... It's just like when you ask me a question like: Are you saying this or that?

Oh okay, am I saying that.... ? My answer is : No I am not saying that.

[Skeptical]

we know that they weren't carnivorous prior to the flood because if so, then a lot of the pairs of animals that came on the boat... wouldn't have came out.

There is no scripture that says that were no carnivorous prior to the flood ; you seem to be speculating. Please prove there is a scripture that says "that were no carnivorous prior to the flood".

Please prove to me first that it's not true that a lot of the pairs of animals that came on the boat [Noah's ark]... wouldn't have came out.