Questions about Jesus and JW’s

[MissKate13]

1. Jehovah’s Witnesses say Jesus was “a god.” This is how the NWT reads (John 1:1).

Do JW’s believe Jesus was a true or false god?

2. JW’s say Jesus is a created being.

When was Jesus (capital or lower case g) created?

I look forward to your responses to one or both questions.

MissKate13

[Eloi]

When the members of the Sanhedrin released the disciples after threatening them and ordering them to stop preaching in the name of Jesus, they prayed to Jehovah. If you've never read it, I'll copy it here:

Acts 4:24 (...)
“Sovereign Lord,
you are the One who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all the things in them,
25 and who said through holy spirit by the mouth of our forefather David, your servant: ‘Why did nations become agitated and peoples meditate on empty things? 26 The kings of the earth took their stand and the rulers gathered together as one against Jehovah and against his anointed one.’
27 For truly both Herod and Pontius Pilate with men of the nations and with peoples of Israel were gathered together in this city against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, 28 to do what your hand and counsel had determined beforehand to occur.
29 And now, Jehovah, give attention to their threats, and grant to your slaves to keep speaking your word with all boldness, 30 while you stretch out your hand for healing and while signs and wonders occur through the name of your holy servant Jesus.”

Did the early Christians believe that Jesus was Jehovah?

[MissKate13]

I have full confidence that my fellow JWs are unified with me and I with them, so whatever they say, it might as well be me that said it too.

MissKate13, the reason for this is that everything the Jehovah's Witness believes has never been personally worked out, individually researched, intellectually examined, investigated with a careful weighing up of facts. They all believe what the movement has indoctrinated them to accept without question. All and sundry believe exactly the same thing; what they have read in their books and told they must believe. If they even waivered from this discipline of thought, they would be excommunicated.

Basically, they have surrendered their brains to books written by generations before them. Sold their souls to a cause. And ceased to think for themselves. Everything they are attesting is straight out of the links they keep posting. It is like carrying someone else's mind in your thought process.

There is another word for this that begins with a 'b'.

Thanks Ross. Your posts are very encouraging, and might I add, respectful!

When someone on the forum makes offensive comments, like guru did, I’ve learned that it’s because they have no real argument to refute what you’ve said. It speaks volumes. Notice how he completely avoided the passages I posted. The Old Testament tells us who Jesus is. He is Yahweh! Stay tuned for proof # 3.

Be blessed!

[Eloi]

Nothing to say about what the Bible says here, MissKate13?

When the members of the Sanhedrin released the disciples after threatening them and ordering them to stop preaching in the name of Jesus, they prayed to Jehovah. If you've never read it, I'll copy it here:

Acts 4:24 (...)
“Sovereign Lord,
you are the One who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all the things in them,
25 and who said through holy spirit by the mouth of our forefather David, your servant: ‘Why did nations become agitated and peoples meditate on empty things? 26 The kings of the earth took their stand and the rulers gathered together as one against Jehovah and against his anointed one.’
27 For truly both Herod and Pontius Pilate with men of the nations and with peoples of Israel were gathered together in this city against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, 28 to do what your hand and counsel had determined beforehand to occur.
29 And now, Jehovah, give attention to their threats, and grant to your slaves to keep speaking your word with all boldness, 30 while you stretch out your hand for healing and while signs and wonders occur through the name of your holy servant Jesus.”

Did the early Christians believe that Jesus was Jehovah?

You said you mind what the Bible says. I am still wondering if that is truth.

[Eloi]

Did anyone who listened Peter here think that Jesus was Jehovah?

Acts 3:12  When Peter saw this, he said to the people: “Men of Israel, why are you so amazed at this, and why are you staring at us as though by personal power or godly devotion we have made him walk? 13 The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our forefathers, has glorified his Servant, Jesus, whom you handed over and disowned before Pilate, even though he had decided to release him. 14 Yes, you disowned that holy and righteous one, and you asked for a man who was a murderer to be given to you, 15 whereas you killed the Chief Agent of life. But God raised him up from the dead, of which fact we are witnesses. 16 And through his name, and by our faith in his name, this man whom you see and know has been made strong. The faith that is through him has made this man completely healthy in front of all of you. 17 And now, brothers, I know that you acted in ignorance, just as your rulers also did. 18 But in this way God has fulfilled the things he announced beforehand through the mouth of all the prophets, that his Christ would suffer.

Well, some people today think so. The funny thing is that they say they mind what the Bible teaches.
Weird, right?

[Eloi]

Here on earth there are many very confused religious people who say that Jesus is Jehovah. Do you think there is someone in heaven with that confusion?

I know for sure that up there no one has that confusion.

Here they praise Jehovah:

Rev. 4:9 Whenever the living creatures give glory and honor and thanksgiving to the One seated on the throne, the One who lives forever and ever, 10 the 24 elders fall down before the One seated on the throne and worship the One who lives forever and ever, and they cast their crowns before the throne, saying: 11 “You are worthy, Jehovah our God, to receive the glory and the honor and the power, because you created all things, and because of your will they came into existence and were created.”

Here they sing to Jesus:

... 5:9 And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

Why do you think there are so confused people and so many of them down here?

[otseng]

Basically, they have surrendered their brains to books written by generations before them. Sold their souls to a cause. And ceased to think for themselves. Everything they are attesting is straight out of the links they keep posting. It is like carrying someone else's mind in your thought process.

There is another word for this that begins with a 'b'.

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[JehovahsWitness]

If JW is interested in taking a closer look at John 8:24, I’m all for it.

I'm really more interested in focusing on the idea that Jesus = YHWH at the moment. I really cannot see how this passage can be used in support of that belief but if I ever see a post or an article explaining how it supports that teaching , I will certainly consider writing a commentary.

JOHN 8:24 NKJV

Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

[MissKate13]

YHWH = Jesus

Proof # 3

WHO IS THE SPEAKER in Isaiah 44:6? It is YHWH AND HIS REDEEMER. BOTH are the first and last. BOTH are redeemer. BOTH say “Besides Me is there is no God.” BOTH are YHWH!

“Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: ‘I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God. (NKJV)

“This is what Jehovah has said, the King of Israel and the Repurchaser of him, Jehovah of armies, ‘I am the first and I am the last, and besides me there is no God. (NWT 1984)

14 Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my strength and my Redeemer. (Psalm 19:14)

13 “looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, 14 who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works. (Titus 2:13-14)

“He entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption.” (Hebrews 9:12)

[onewithhim]

If JW is interested in taking a closer look at John 8:24, I’m all for it.

I'm really more interested in focusing on the idea that Jesus = YHWH at the moment. I really cannot see how this passage can be used in support of that belief but if I ever see a post or an article explaining how it supports that teaching , I will certainly consider writing a commentary.

JOHN 8:24 NKJV

Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

How does that scripture prove that Jesus is God? He wasn't alluding to that at all. He was simply saying that he was the one sent forth to save mankind from their sins. Nothing about being God. The "I Am" part has been thoroughly explained, and it can be said that Jesus was simply using a very common phrase. Far from intimating that he is God.

[2timothy316]

YHWH = Jesus

Proof # 3

WHO IS THE SPEAKER in Isaiah 44:6? It is YHWH AND HIS REDEEMER. BOTH are the first and last. BOTH are redeemer. BOTH say “Besides Me is there is no God.” BOTH are YHWH!

“Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: ‘I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God. (NKJV)

“This is what Jehovah has said, the King of Israel and the Repurchaser of him, Jehovah of armies, ‘I am the first and I am the last, and besides me there is no God. (NWT 1984)

14 Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my strength and my Redeemer. (Psalm 19:14)

13 “looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, 14 who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works. (Titus 2:13-14)

“He entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption.” (Hebrews 9:12)

"...rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am." John 14:28

Your proof goes poof.
YHWH = Jesus is false
YHWH > Jesus is true as the scripture says.