Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[Rose2020]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #2539]
Absolutely, Jesus is clearly God's son. Why would anybody think otherwise?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

There will be no going to heaven and coming back to earth ... the meek that inherit the earth will logically have to do any clearing away of debris and replanting of trees themselves.

ISAIAH 65

21They will build houses and dwell in them; they will plant vineyards and eat their fruit. 22No longer will they build houses for others to inhabit, nor plant for others to eat. For as is the lifetime of a tree, so will be the days of My people, and My chosen ones will fully enjoy the work of their hands. 23They will not labor in vain or bear children doomed to disaster; for they will be a people blessed by the LORD—they and their descendants with them

.



God will not "transform" the earth as if he will change the planets fundamental form or makeup. He will remove the wicked and let the planet earth recuperate from their mismanagement naturally.

The wicked go (killed off) the righteous /meek STAY; not the other way round.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

What is the point, please tell me, of going to heaven and returning to Earth? Where does it indicate that in the Bible? Those going to heaven will STAY in heaven, and those righteous ones who stay on the Earth will always be here. We will go through the Great Tribulation and enter into the new system of things and help restore the Earth to Paradise.

People who die now will be resurrected in "the last day," not now, as Jesus said at John 6:40 and 44. They will be here on Earth to be preserved through the Tribulation. Christ will have "returned" when he comes at Armageddon to destroy the wicked. He remains in heaven, but his influence will be seen and understood when Armageddon happens. Revelation 21:1-3 is symbolic for God's influence from heaven over the earth. Many times in the past He is said to have "resided with" mankind. (Jeremiah 14:9; Psalm 78:60)

[Rose2020]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #2543]

I'm sure you are correct. We shall certainly know soon enough.

[William]

This from another link;

...
And what if the murder victim does not get eternal life with God? ....

Then the real problem in Biblical point of view is that he is not righteous.

But, if person gets eternal life, why would the murder be a problem for him?

No one is righteous according to the bible. That aside, everyone is entitled to live their life without having it snatched away by the evil actions of someone else. Even if the victim gets eternal life, what about their life on earth? Doesn't that count for anything? What about their friends and family? Is this what Christianity does to people? Your approach to this is actually making me feel sick inside. I'm glad I don't share the same mind set.

[05:45] Mother and her two children are shot dead by husband/father: She has a NDE and meets Jesus...

[08:20]...
It was then that I realized that I wasn't dreaming, I was dead
"My Kids!?!" I said, looking at Jesus.
I could tell by the expression he made, that they were gone
"Why? Why did you give them to me only to take them away?" I asked.
"That is what they wanted. They chose this ending for themselves."
"Wait. What do you mean they chose this?"
"Every Soul contracts Itself through My Father.
Earth is not your final destination.
Your final destination is to ultimately rejoin with My Father, after you have learned and experienced life"
Stunned, I said back
"That makes no sense Lord. If every Soul is contracted through Your Father, then that means he allows people like Hitler to exist. Why?"
"My daughter, you are not the first to ask these questions, and you will not be the last. All Souls are born with a blank slate. When a Soul wishes to experience life, they approach My Father, who grants them their wish of experiencing Life."
"Yes, but that means that you allow evil. Why? My Children died to evil. Why was that allowed?"
"The evil perpetrated against your children will not go unpunished. After his Soul has been cleansed he will rejoin My Father."
"What about the Lake of Fire and all that?"
"The Lake of Fire is a metaphor for what those Souls that are deemed evil, will go through. It will feel like an unending fire."
"Why did this have to happen? What did I do that was so wrong to be punished like this?"
"You are not being punished My Daughter. Though it might feel that way and you may experience this loss, it is not punishment. The Souls who were your Children were ready to come home."
"I still don't understand how any of this works!" I screamed.
"My Daughter, one day you will understand."
"So what happens now?"
"It is not your time to rejoin with My Father. You must return to your life and tell others what is to come."
"I don't want to return. I have lost everything. The two people most precious to me have been taken by someone who isn't even going to be punished for eternity. It seems like I am the one who is being punished by having to be sent back."
"My Daughter, just like the Souls of your Loved Ones, you too signed a contract with My Father. Your life experience isn't done."
"Well I want it to be! I don't want to go back without my kids!"
Jesus looked at me, hugged me, leaned forward and gently whispered in what would have been my ear.
"You must return. Do not worry. I will show you what awaits you when you go back...[10:49]

In relation to this thread topic, I see no reason why folk who want to, cannot stay within this particular Experiential Reality, help make it more sustainable by introducing a righteous system and cleaning up the pollution of the wicked system and -given that machinery is so advanced, perhaps that will be used in a proper fashion - one in which nature can gently be shaped and nurtured according to the specifications of the righteous...

At the same time, I see no particular problem with how individual Souls approach life and choose to leave the Earth/Universe behind and seek out different Experiential Realities [Heavens/Hells/Stuff like that] or even have access to both/all ER's.

There appear to be no bounds for the righteous, [apart from supporting wicked works], as they are acceptable in The Sight of The Lord.

Overthinking this, or being a stickler for only one of many options and rejecting all others as - if not 'wicked' then certainly 'unscriptural' - is detrimental. As far as I am concerned, if the Bible mentions "it", then "it" is on the table of possible choices one can make.

The Sight of The Lord
The Origin of Sound - The Smallest Spark - The Solar system - Ask and It Will Be Given - Without - Within - - Strength of Soul - The way of knowledge - Practical application - It is all making sense....

[tam]

Peace to you onewithhim and Rose2020, and to you all,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

What is the point, please tell me, of going to heaven

For the marriage/union with the Lamb (with Christ), to be changed "in a twinkling" (1Corinth 15:52); and to be able to come before the Most Holy One.

and returning to Earth?

Because the Kingdom is upon the earth, as are the people living IN that Kingdom. Because the Bride will be REIGNING in that Kingdom, as king-priests, for at least a thousand years. Because the Bride likely has loved ones dwelling upon the earth. Why in the world would the Bride be prevented from visiting loved ones who are on the earth? Why would the Bride have LESS freedom than angels do now, who are able to access both heaven and earth?

If angels are permitted to enter both heaven and earth, why would Christ and His Bride be permitted to enter only heaven?

Where does it indicate that in the Bible?

Rev 21:2, 3:12 (New Jerusalem... aka the Bride... comes down OUT OF heaven) ; Rev 5:10 (reigning upon the earth).

In the parable of the sheep and the goats, (Matt 25) the nations (nations who are on the earth) are gathered before Christ when He returns.




I left the rest alone for now (re: Armageddon, Christ returning, the resurrection), to just address the questions asked.


Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[elijahpne]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

I feel the same urgency and for the same reason you expressed (i.e., "this is a terrible world") - with a subtle difference though.

I don't look forward to going to heaven. I believe the heaven is reserved for those ruling with Christ: "and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth."- Rev 5:10

They have "been bought from the earth" (Rev 14:3) meaning they were taken elsewhere and heaven is the only logical place that would be.

An earthly paradise suits me fine after all wickedness is gone: "And just a little while longer, and the wicked one will be no more; And you will certainly give attention to his place, and he will not be."- Psalm 37:10

After which, we shall live forever - and in peace - in a cleansed earth :

Psalm 37:11 'But the meek ones themselves will possess the earth, And they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace."
Psalm 37:29 "The righteous themselves will possess the earth, And they will reside forever upon it."
______________________________________________________________________________________________

Isaiah 65:22 For like the days of a tree will the days of my people be

[onewithhim]

Peace to you onewithhim and Rose2020, and to you all,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

What is the point, please tell me, of going to heaven

For the marriage/union with the Lamb (with Christ), to be changed "in a twinkling" (1Corinth 15:52); and to be able to come before the Most Holy One.

and returning to Earth?

Because the Kingdom is upon the earth, as are the people living IN that Kingdom. Because the Bride will be REIGNING in that Kingdom, as king-priests, for at least a thousand years. Because the Bride likely has loved ones dwelling upon the earth. Why in the world would the Bride be prevented from visiting loved ones who are on the earth? Why would the Bride have LESS freedom than angels do now, who are able to access both heaven and earth?

If angels are permitted to enter both heaven and earth, why would Christ and His Bride be permitted to enter only heaven?

Because Jesus is a mighty SPIRIT person in heaven and remains that way in the SPIRIT environment that he has found himself back in, where his Father is a SPIRIT, as are all the angels. And his "Bride" is made up of people who have been CHANGED into spirit persons when they went to heaven, and will remain spirit persons, as Jesus and his Father are. There is no need to go back to the earth for any reason. They can affect the earth from heaven, and will do so.
New Jerusalem "comes down" from heaven only in the sense that it influences Earth from heaven, as His organization has always done when Jehovah saw fit to interact with men here.

[tam]

Peace to you,

Peace to you onewithhim and Rose2020, and to you all,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

What is the point, please tell me, of going to heaven

For the marriage/union with the Lamb (with Christ), to be changed "in a twinkling" (1Corinth 15:52); and to be able to come before the Most Holy One.

and returning to Earth?

Because the Kingdom is upon the earth, as are the people living IN that Kingdom. Because the Bride will be REIGNING in that Kingdom, as king-priests, for at least a thousand years. Because the Bride likely has loved ones dwelling upon the earth. Why in the world would the Bride be prevented from visiting loved ones who are on the earth? Why would the Bride have LESS freedom than angels do now, who are able to access both heaven and earth?

If angels are permitted to enter both heaven and earth, why would Christ and His Bride be permitted to enter only heaven?

Because Jesus is a mighty SPIRIT person in heaven and remains that way in the SPIRIT environment that he has found himself back in, where his Father is a SPIRIT, as are all the angels.

And yet - as stated - angels can move between the physical and spiritual realms. Angels can be in heaven and also take form and be on earth. Yet for some reason, you believe that Christ and His Bride (humans) will be confined to the spiritual realm, unable to do what angels can do even now.

Why would the Bride not be permitted to see loved ones on the earth? Do they not get to have the joy of being reunited with their loved ones?

Why would the Bride (and Christ) have less freedom than the angels do even now?

Why would the Bride not also be on the earth, where she reigns with Christ in the Kingdom that is upon the earth?

And his "Bride" is made up of people who have been CHANGED into spirit persons when they went to heaven, and will remain spirit persons, as Jesus and his Father are. There is no need to go back to the earth for any reason.

I just listed multiple reasons. Freedom; loved ones; to reign (as kings and priests) in the Kingdom that is upon the earth.

They can affect the earth from heaven, and will do so.
New Jerusalem "comes down" from heaven only in the sense that it influences Earth from heaven,

That's the WTS company line, but that is not what Revelation describes as happening. Nor is it what Christ describes in the sheep and the goats parable.

as His organization has always done when Jehovah saw fit to interact with men here.

What organization? Sometimes it was just one man who had faith and listened to God (such as Abraham did). There was no organization involved in the communication between God and Abraham. Or between God and Noah. Or between God and Adam/Eve. The reason there was a mediator (Moses) between Israel and God is because Israel did not want to deal with God directly; they were too afraid and they asked to go through Moses.

Even then - and after - God often sent angels to the earth to communicate directly with men, and He sent His Son. That Son is the mediator between man and God. Not an organization.


Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[onewithhim]

Peace to you,

Peace to you onewithhim and Rose2020, and to you all,

[Replying to onewithhim in post #1]

I would say 'now'. Because this is a terrible world. I look forward to be gone to heaven and can look forward to return when God has transformed this into an earthly paradise, once Christ has returned. If it is His will for me of course.

What is the point, please tell me, of going to heaven

For the marriage/union with the Lamb (with Christ), to be changed "in a twinkling" (1Corinth 15:52); and to be able to come before the Most Holy One.

and returning to Earth?

Because the Kingdom is upon the earth, as are the people living IN that Kingdom. Because the Bride will be REIGNING in that Kingdom, as king-priests, for at least a thousand years. Because the Bride likely has loved ones dwelling upon the earth. Why in the world would the Bride be prevented from visiting loved ones who are on the earth? Why would the Bride have LESS freedom than angels do now, who are able to access both heaven and earth?

If angels are permitted to enter both heaven and earth, why would Christ and His Bride be permitted to enter only heaven?

Because Jesus is a mighty SPIRIT person in heaven and remains that way in the SPIRIT environment that he has found himself back in, where his Father is a SPIRIT, as are all the angels.

And yet - as stated - angels can move between the physical and spiritual realms. Angels can be in heaven and also take form and be on earth. Yet for some reason, you believe that Christ and His Bride (humans) will be confined to the spiritual realm, unable to do what angels can do even now.

Why would the Bride not be permitted to see loved ones on the earth? Do they not get to have the joy of being reunited with their loved ones?

Why would the Bride (and Christ) have less freedom than the angels do even now?

Why would the Bride not also be on the earth, where she reigns with Christ in the Kingdom that is upon the earth?

And his "Bride" is made up of people who have been CHANGED into spirit persons when they went to heaven, and will remain spirit persons, as Jesus and his Father are. There is no need to go back to the earth for any reason.

I just listed multiple reasons. Freedom; loved ones; to reign (as kings and priests) in the Kingdom that is upon the earth.

They can affect the earth from heaven, and will do so.
New Jerusalem "comes down" from heaven only in the sense that it influences Earth from heaven,

That's the WTS company line, but that is not what Revelation describes as happening. Nor is it what Christ describes in the sheep and the goats parable.

as His organization has always done when Jehovah saw fit to interact with men here.

What organization? Sometimes it was just one man who had faith and listened to God (such as Abraham did). There was no organization involved in the communication between God and Abraham. Or between God and Noah. Or between God and Adam/Eve. The reason there was a mediator (Moses) between Israel and God is because Israel did not want to deal with God directly; they were too afraid and they asked to go through Moses.

Even then - and after - God often sent angels to the earth to communicate directly with men, and He sent His Son. That Son is the mediator between man and God. Not an organization.


Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

The Kingdom of God will have its eternal headquarters in heaven, ruling OVER the earth, not ON it. God has always had an organization, in heaven. He is the author of peace. There cannot be anything but chaos when there is no organization. To get anything done effectively, there must be order. He is doing that with his organization in heaven AND on the earth today. Soon those anointed ones who will go to heaven will be guiding those on the earth to bring back the planet to Paradise conditions, as it was supposed to be in the beginning.

We don't know if those in heaven will be able to communicate with their loved ones on Earth---this remains to be seen. When we reach perfection here on Earth and have made our stand with Jehovah after the 1,000 years, we will certainly be able to speak with Jehovah one-to-one, and perhaps our loved ones in heaven. We just have to wait and see. It stands to reason. But the fact remains---there are billions of people who will remain on the earth forever, and a smaller number of people who have gone to heaven to reign with Christ from heaven.