Who is a Christian?? !!

[oldbadger]

Before Covid I used to cycle around my local area and would visit chapels and churches which held tea'n'chat meetings. On one occasion I passed a Christian hall and saw a poster which read something like 'soup and chat', and I walked inside just as the event was commencing. A long table was set and many mid-aged and elderly folks sat around; I was guided to a place.

A very stern lady across the table fixed me in her gaze and an interrogation began:-
Who are you?
Hello I'm oldbadger.
Why have you come here?
I wanted to meet you, and the soup is interesting.
How did you know about this meeting?
I saw a big poster outside.
Do you walk in to any place because of posters?
Yes..... I often do.
Where else have you just walked in to?
Oh, lots of places. The Methodist church holds tea/biscuit meets on Saturday mornings.
She grunted what sounded like disapproval. I mentioned a few other meetings and then the room erupted.
I said....
Oh, and the Christian Spiritualists in T--------- offering healing and tea on Mondays at 1.30pm.

This stern lady exploded.
They are not Christians! They worship the Devil! All these evil people who pretend to be Christians...... Jesus warned us about you all! And that disgusting Halloween...... ............ well this carried on for minutes until she could be calmed down.

This has happened many times....... I once mentioned that we have JW Christian friends and we are pleased to let them park on our driveway when visiting homes in the area, and several Christians immediately pointed out that JWs are different, or not proper Christians......

There are many many differing churches and creeds, and so I wonder....... who is a proper Christian?

[2timothy316]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

Regardless, 'what is the true religion (if any)' is a different question from 'who is a Christian'.

This is obviously on your list and it favors your dogma. Thanks for the example from your bias list.

It's not a list, timothy, it's just a statement. These are two different questions.


Peace again.

That is your opinion and that again fits your dogma. That doesn't make it a fact.

The Bible, which is my source, doesn't make a difference between the true religion and a Christian. So it is indeed a statement in your list.

"“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will." Matt 7:21

I don't even know how to respond to something like this. A religion is an organization. A Christian is a person. That's not an opinion. That is just a fact.

Lets look at facts shall we?
Religion:a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/religion

So according to the dictionary, a religion can be just one person.

What does that have to do with anything I said?

You said, " A religion is an organization."
That is false.

Okay.... so your objection is that you wish to insist that a person can be a religion of one? Why did you feel the need to come onto this thread just to make that point to me? A religion is still not a person. A religion is a thing (whether you define it as a set of beliefs... and/or a set of practices... and/or as an organization/sect/denomination that a person belongs to). A Christian is a person.

As an aside, is your religion not an organization?


Peace again to you.

My religion is my set of spiritual attitudes, beliefs, and practices. I am also part of an organization that follows those same attitudes, beliefs, and practices. My religious beliefs don't stop when I'm all alone.

This all going back to your mistaken comment "what is the true religion (if any)' is a different question from 'who is a Christian'."
You're in error, it's not a different question.

If a person is a Christian then they are in a religion. There is no difference in the two. The real question is are they are a true Christian which is what the title of this thread is all about. Do they follow Christ's list of attitudes, beliefs, and practices or their own list.

My point being that if a person is not following the Bible's list of attitudes, beliefs, and practices is not a Biblical Christian. They are following their own attitudes, beliefs, and practices and calling it Christian.

[tam]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

This is obviously on your list and it favors your dogma. Thanks for the example from your bias list.

It's not a list, timothy, it's just a statement. These are two different questions.


Peace again.

That is your opinion and that again fits your dogma. That doesn't make it a fact.

The Bible, which is my source, doesn't make a difference between the true religion and a Christian. So it is indeed a statement in your list.

"“Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens, but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will." Matt 7:21

I don't even know how to respond to something like this. A religion is an organization. A Christian is a person. That's not an opinion. That is just a fact.

Lets look at facts shall we?
Religion:a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/religion

So according to the dictionary, a religion can be just one person.

What does that have to do with anything I said?

You said, " A religion is an organization."
That is false.

Okay.... so your objection is that you wish to insist that a person can be a religion of one? Why did you feel the need to come onto this thread just to make that point to me? A religion is still not a person. A religion is a thing (whether you define it as a set of beliefs... and/or a set of practices... and/or as an organization/sect/denomination that a person belongs to). A Christian is a person.

As an aside, is your religion not an organization?


Peace again to you.

My religion is my set of spiritual attitudes, beliefs, and practices. I am also part of an organization that follows those same attitudes, beliefs, and practices. My religious beliefs don't stop when I'm all alone.

Sure but that is the problem with using one word to describe two different things: beliefs... or... the organization that is a religion. The latter is what I was speaking about. If I wanted to refer to belief, I would use the word belief. Or faith (if indeed it is faith).

This all going back to your mistaken comment "what is the true religion (if any)' is a different question from 'who is a Christian'."

You're in error, it's not a different question.

I disagree.

WHAT is...

WHO is...

Two different questions.

My point in making the statement to begin with was simply that I did not want to derail the thread into another discussion on which is the true religion (if any): the JW religion, the RCC, the LDS, etc, etc, ad nauseum.

I guess we derailed into minutia instead. Not sure there is any need to continue that minutia, so hopefully this is the end of it.


Peace again to you and to you all.

[oldbadger]

Peace to you,

The problem with making a "list" is that the religion calling itself "the true religion" is the one that chose the requirements on that list. Obviously that list is going to favor itself. The RCC has a list of requirements as well... a list that favors itself.

Regardless, 'what is the true religion (if any)' is a different question from 'who is a Christian'.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

Tam.......and Peace to you.
I understand exactly.... if a person should write, saying that any body who is a Christian must be following their list of conditions, then they exclude billions of others.
This is not new, and I have even met with Christians who will not eat or drink with any other people.
The RCC does have a list as well, as you say.
Many other Creeds and churches may have their own lists.

Tam.... if you had to define what a Christian is, how would you do that so that any person could easily understand?

[oldbadger]

I would think that the Bible would be the source to tell who is a Christian. Many say it's the Word of God, so shouldn't the One that gave the name also shape the critreria for who is truly Christian?

Hello again.... are you saying that a Christian must accept all that is in the bible? Is it all the word of God?

[oldbadger]

As for me, I am spiritual but not religious, yet I am just a servant, one who is pointing to Christ. HE is the One who leads His sheep into all truth. Not the bible, not religion, not men. Just Christ.

Peace again to you, and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

I am a Deist, but I admire that, very much.
Because you searched for yourself, found by yourself, and have faith.....you are free to go anywhere that will receive you, stand or kneel with any who will greet you......you are not a follower of institutional indoctrination but rather you found for yourself.

[oldbadger]

A person that claims to be a pilot but can't fly airplanes means he is not actually a pilot.
A person that claims to be a Christian but doesn't do the will of Almighty God as laid out in the Bible, isn't a Christian.

That cannot help a person who is searching for truth, surely?
That's like telling a lost traveller ....'Go get the correct map and a compass and learn how to use them.'
.......... when all they needed were some simple directions. ???

[oldbadger]

Religion:a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/religion

So according to the dictionary, a religion can be just one person.

Can it? I've always thought that Belief, Faith and Religion have quite different meanings.

Good old IT:-
Main Difference – Faith vs Religion
The main difference between faith and religion is that faith is the complete trust and confidence in someone or something whereas religion is a specific system of belief and/or worship, often involving a code of ethics and philosophy.

Can you see the difference?

[oldbadger]

My point being that if a person is not following the Bible's list of attitudes, beliefs, and practices is not a Biblical Christian. They are following their own attitudes, beliefs, and practices and calling it Christian.

Can you direct me to that list, please?

[JehovahsWitness]

I would think that the Bible would be the source to tell who is a Christian. Many say it's the Word of God, so shouldn't the One that gave the name also shape the critreria for who is truly Christian?

Hello again.... are you saying that a Christian must accept all that is in the bible? Is it all the word of God?

Yes!

2 TIMOTHY 3:16

All Scripture is inspired of God+ and beneficial for teaching,+ for reproving, for setting things straight,+ for disciplining in righteousness,+ 17 so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.

Accepting the entire canon of "holy writings" as the bible puts it, is one way we can identify "a man or women of God". Which is why (unless a Christian doesnt have to be a man of God) so many that self-identify as Christians, disqualify themselves right off the bat. They freely admit they reject certain parts of holy scripture while also claiming to be Christian; biblically an impossibility.

[oldbadger]

Yes!

Accepting the entire canon of "holy writings" as the bible puts it, is one way we can identify "a man or women of God". Which is why (unless a Christian doesnt have to be a man of God) so many that self-identify as Christians, disqualify themselves right off the bat. They freely admit they reject certain parts of holy scripture while also claiming to be Christian; biblically an impossibility.

Thank you for your post.
Do you think that only the Jehovah's Witnesses could be identified as Christians, or are there any other churches that you know of that follow the same list of characteristics?