Jehovah of the OT, is Jesus Christ of the New Testament

[Revelations won]

Jehovah of the Old Testament, is Jesus Christ of the New Testament

There are some today who do not understand or accept that Jehovah of the Old Testament is in fact Jesus Christ of the New Testament. My observation is that He is in very deed the great Jehovah, who was and is King of kings and Lord of lords, even the very Messiah, our lord and redeemer, the Holy One of Israel and the the author of our resurrection and the only name whereby man can be saved. This is my “take� on this topic. I welcome all would care to debate and provide your evidence to support contrary or opposing views. The following scriptures are presented as evidence supporting my “take� on the above subject:

Isaiah 43:3 “For I am the LORD thy God, the Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour:"

Isaiah 43:11 “I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour�

Isaiah 9:6-7 “For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
7
Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.


Isaiah 25:8-9 “He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

9And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.


Isaiah 26:19 “Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.�


Matthew 27:52-53 “And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

53And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.


Acts 4:10-12 “Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.


Exodus 3:14 God calls himself “I AM� “3 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.�


John 8:54-58 (Before Abraham was “I AM�. 54 “Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:
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Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
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Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
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Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
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Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was,
I AM.�


Exodus 6:3 “And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.�


Deuteronomy 32:2-4 “My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass:

3Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God.

4 He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.�


1Corinthians 10:1-4 “Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.�


Hebrews 5:8-9 “Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;�


Psalms 118:22-24 “The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.
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This is the LORD'S doing; it is marvellous in our eyes.
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This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.�





Acts 4:10-12 “Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.�


John 10:1-11 “Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
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But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
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To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
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And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
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And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
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This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.
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Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.
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All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.
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I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
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The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
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I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.


Ephesians 2:18-20 “For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
19Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;


Hebrews 1:1-4 “God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
4
Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.�


Hebrews 2:8-11 “And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

9Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.�

John 1:1-5 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2
The same was in the beginning with God.
3
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4
In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
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And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.�


Colossians 2:8-14 “Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

10And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;�

[tam]

Peace to you (all),

Just before I go through your previous response, the following caught my eye:

Well the burden of proof is really on you, myth-one. Prove to me that He did (pray before He calmed the sea). Good luck with that...

Same as the burden of proof is on you regarding the OP title (and the trinity)?

The silence is deafening, though, Tcg,

Indeed.

Christ never once spoke of being [YHWH]. He never once spoke of being part of a "triune Jehovah" (or that any such being exists). He never once said that being the Son of God, means that He is [YHWH].


Peace again to you.

[PinSeeker]

Just before I go through your previous response, the following caught my eye:

Well the burden of proof is really on you, myth-one. Prove to me that He did (pray before He calmed the sea). Good luck with that...

Same as the burden of proof is on you regarding the OP title (and the trinity)?

Sure. That's perfectly fair. I proved it. Your acceptance is up to you. I know where you stand. We can leave it at that.

The silence is deafening, though, Tcg,

Indeed.

Concerning what myth-one, Tcg, and I were talking about, there was/is silence. Concerning what you and I have been talking about, not so much.

Christ never once spoke of being [YHWH].

He absolutely did. And He demonstrated it, too, as I said.

He never once spoke of being part of a "triune Jehovah" (or that any such being exists).

He spoke of God existing in three Persons, most explicitly in John 14, as I have said.

He never once said that being the Son of God, means that He is [YHWH].

Not in those exact words, no, I agree.


Grace and peace to you.

Peace again to you.
[/quote]

[tam]

Peace to you Pinseeker,

I am not going to respond to things that are just repetition at this point, but to a few things:

I am going to remain with Christ and listen to His word. I don't care what any other religion, sect, religious leader, or persons claims the "bible says". I care what Christ said (and says).

Right, and that's the problem. You're... mis-hearing.

You have yet to show me where I have said something in contradiction to Christ.

You have provided only interpretations (based perhaps upon religious doctrines and traditions, but tradition and truth are not the same thing).

He is the One to whom God told us to listen yes? "This is my Son, my Chosen One. Listen to Him."

Sure. Okay, so why then do you (apparently) not listen to Him when He says, "These things I have spoken to you while I am still with you. But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." (John 14:26)

Remember that He also said 'woe to you scribes', and I am sure you recall mention of the lying pen of the scribes from Jeremiah 8:8. I am sure you must also realize that those who translated these verses did so according to their belief in the trinity. So it might appear on the surface that some verses must be speaking of a third person, consider the following:

"These things I have spoken to you while I am still with you. But the helper, the holy spirit [that] the Father will send in my Name, [it] will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you."

The word for whom can be translated as which/that.

ὅς hós, hos; probably a primary word (or perhaps a form of the article G3588); the relatively (sometimes demonstrative) pronoun, who, which, what, that:—one, (an-, the) other, some, that, what, which, who(-m, -se), etc.

The word for he can be translated as the it/that.

ἐκεῖνος ekeînos, ek-i'-nos; from G1563; that one (or (neuter) thing); often intensified by the article prefixed:—he, it, the other (same), selfsame, that (same, very), × their, × them, they, this, those.

This is in line with what John writes here (referring to the anointing of holy spirit):

As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him. 1John 2:27


Granted, there are also times where the (Holy) Spirit is referring to Christ (He is the Holy One of God after all... and He is the Spirit, 1 Corinthians 3:18... aka the Holy Spirit). In those cases, personification would be appropriate. Otherwise, holy spirit (the breath, blood, seed of JAH) should not be personified. It is referring to the anointing of holy spirit (which Christ gives us, as He breathed holy spirit upon the apostles and again at Pentecost, and with Cornelius and his family, etc.

The translators (scribes) always personified holy spirit, because of their belief in the trinity, not because the text made it necessary for holy spirit to be personified.

Jesus said and did many, many things that only God can do,

Who says only God can do them?

Uh, God Himself. LOL! Well, the prophets of the Old Testament, who, as prophets, relayed God's words to His people.

Can you support your statement with clear examples?

(Oh wait, that's right, you only listen to Christ... I mean that's good that you listen to Christ; at least you're listening to one of the Persons of the triune YHVH... Anyway, this is why the Jews wanted to stone Jesus. They knew exactly what He was doing and saying -- things that only God can do (all the things I mentioned, in addition to claiming to be God). Do you think they were merely mistaken?

Of course they were mistaken. They made many mistakes that Christ corrected. They did not know that God had a Son. They did not know the Messiah would be the Son of God (also the Tree of Life, the Light, the Truth, the Word, etc.) Why would you take their belief as the test of what is true?

Anyway... Who says anyone other than God can forgive sins?

Christ does:

But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins...” He said to the paralytic, 11“I tell you, get up, pick up your mat, and go home.”

His Father gave Him that authority.

Who says anyone other than God can judge (come on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory)?

Christ does. John 5:26, 27

His Father gave Him that authority.

(this is going to be the same with the rest of the points on this issue)

including foretelling future events,

Except for one (that we know of): Christ did not know the day or hour that He would return. God knew, but Christ did not. He may know now; the Father may have told Him after He returned to the Father in heaven. But at the time He said those words, Christ did not know this. God knew, Christ did not.

Yes, and this is no real point at all. Not insignificant, by any means, but it does absolutely nothing to refute the fact that Christ is the second Person of the triune Jehovah.

But it does refute your claim that foretelling future events must mean that Christ is God (YHWH).

controlling the weather, forgiving sins, and of course making restitution and atoning for all the sin of mankind and reconciling the Father's Elect to Him (accomplishing salvation), not to mention reassuming the glory He possessed with the Father from all eternity. Were Jesus not fully God, He could not have possibly done any of those things.

Again, says who?

LOL! See above. Well, I'll answer:

1.) We know that God shares His glory with no one, yet Jesus reassumed the glory He possessed with the Father before anything was made. I guess you may be suggesting that Jesus's prayer went unanswered or was rejected, maybe.

The context of not sharing glory is for idols, Pinseeker. Not His own Son.

Jesus assigned to Himself in John 8:58 the Name the Father assigned Himself in answer to Moses's request to know God's name in Exodus 3:14.

No. Christ did not name Himself "I AM" - that is something people are again reading into the text - simply because He said that He is before Abraham. And that was the context of the discussion.

Question: "You are not yet 50 years old and you have seen Abraham?"

Answer: "Before Abraham was born, I am."

Okay, stop there. The short answer is yes (in response to your 'no'). Kudos to you for actually writing it, but yes, Jesus's answer was, "Before Abraham was, I am." You would do well to take proper note of the different tenses of the two verbs, there ('was' and 'am'). Why did Jesus, to Whom you claim to listen (and hear), not say "Before Abraham was, I was"? You will probably wave that away; do what you will, but I would admonish you to not do so.

The tense in English might seem a bit clumsy with the formation of the sentence (though I don't see that as a problem "I am before Abraham was"... or... "Before Abraham was, I am."). But it could also read as 'was' or 'have been'.

In keeping with the context of what is being said.

The sentence does not even make sense if you take the words "I am" and turn them into a name. "Before Abraham was born, Name."

So continuing with this last sentence, The sentence does not make sense if you do not take it as the name God assigned Himself in answer to Moses (in Exodus 3:14).

If you insert the name of God (as the name of God, rather than as what translators suggest it means), it also does not make sense.

In Psalm 23, David acknowledges the LORD (YHVH) as his Shepherd, and Jesus asserts in John 10 the He Himself is the Good Shepherd. Subsequently, as also documented in John 10, He said, "I and the Father are one."

You are going to find things that describe both Christ and His Father, because Christ does as His Father has taught Him, speaks as his Father has told Him. He is also the heir, so there are many titles that apply to the Son, just as they apply to the Father. Same as with a human father and son.

And you are going to continue, as far as I can tell, to deny what is right in front of you, even Christ's own words. Hey, it just occurred to me, too: He said He was the Good Shepherd, right? Well, He also said there is no one good except God, right? Chew on that one a bit; it shouldn't take long.

He said that when someone called HIM good, remember?

"Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone."

Jesus, in John 6, proclaimed Himself the leader, protection and sustenance of God's Israel in the same manner as YHVH as the pillars of cloud (by day) and fire (by night), the bread of heaven, and water from the Rock in Exodus 13-17... and finally made this crystal clear in John 14 by saying, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life."

Yes, of course Christ is these things. If the Son does as the Father does, why would Christ not also protect and lead Israel?

A mere man would not be able to lead protect and lead Israel, providing for them and even being their very sustenance, as God did in their wandering in the desert. Not even King David, the man after God's heart, was able to do that.

You seem to have deflected the point. No one suggested that Christ was a mere man.

Paul is not refuting the position that there are many 'gods' and 'lords'. He is emphasizing, BUT FOR US, there is One God (the Father) and One Lord (the Son).

Yes he is. The implication is that others believe there are many gods and many lords. Which, you know, all you have to do is read any decent history book and know that was very true in those days. The phrase "but for us" -- thanks for emphasizing it -- indicates very clearly that he is contrasting "us" with another group of folks (unbelievers).

Yes, that is what I also said.

To say that Paul in 1 Corinthians 8:6 only applies "God" to the Father in exclusion of Christ (and/or the Spirit) and "Lord" to Christ in exclusion of the Father (and/or the Spirit)...

That is exactly what Paul said.

Nope. The Father is both God and Lord, and Jesus is both God and Lord. And Paul doesn't specifically say it here

Paul did not say it at all.

Paul says specifically, there is ONE God: the Father. There is ONE Lord: Christ.

Paul explains the answer to your query here himself: "In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, because we are members of his body." And then, quoting from Genesis, he says, “Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." You knew the answer to that. Or... didn't you? Surely you did.

Yes of course. But I don't see how that is supposed to prove the trinity (or that Christ IS YHWH).

It attests to the fact that God is more than one person. We are relational beings because God is relational (among the Persons of the trinity) even within Himself. The idea of being created in God's image can easily be linked here. We are relational beings. It all goes together.

We are relational beings without being more than one person.

Regardless, this is of course a spiritual reality, not a physical one. The same is true of Christ and the church, as Paul goes on to say, and on a much higher level of the triune Jehovah. Perfect love, union and fellowship. As Paul says, it is, right now, a profound mystery to us. But someday it will no longer be.

No, the profound mystery had nothing to do with the concept of a 'trinity'. The profound mystery is that that Paul was referring to Christ and the Church, rather than just a husband and his wife.

After all, no one ever hated their own body, but they feed and care for their body, just as Christ does the church— 30 for we are members of his body. 31 “For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh.”[c] 32 This is a profound mystery—but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33 However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.

The conjunction there is 'and,' Tammy, not 'but,' as if Paul were presenting a contrast. "This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church." So what Paul is saying there applies to the husband and wife, but also (albeit on a greater level) to Christ and the church. Our marriages -- husband and wife -- are models of and indications to (should be anyway) the much greater reality, mysterious as it is, of the marriage between Christ and His church. My goodness.

Yes, what you just said is correct, and we are in agreement that the profound mystery Paul was referring to was that he was referring to Christ and His Church.

In your previous post, you seemed to be saying that the profound mystery Paul was referring to was the trinity; and that is all I was objecting to.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[PinSeeker]

You have yet to show me where I have said something in contradiction to Christ.

I've been very clear. You disagreed. That's enough, right?

You have provided only interpretations (based perhaps upon religious doctrines and traditions, but tradition and truth are not the same thing).

Yet again, your opinion is duly noted. That's enough, right?

I am sure you must also realize that those who translated these verses did so according to their belief in the trinity. So it might appear on the surface that some verses must be speaking of a third person...

Ah, so what you're saying, in essence, is that the Bible we have today is not inerrant, that it has been corrupted. Aside from the fact that that's against board rules, I wholly disagree, and that, Tammy, is a non-negotiable for me. And I scanned the rest of your post here, and disagree with most everything therein. So, no offense intended, certainly, but I'm going no further with this.

Thank you. Grace and peace to you.

[tam]

[Replying to PinSeeker in post #165]

Peace to you Pinseeker,

I am content to leave the previous posts stand and move on as well. I did not break any rules that I can see though, simply by pointing out that there are translation or scribal errors in what is written. I don't think there are many who disagree with that, since we have various translations in existence, obviously, there are various ways to translate certain words and phrases.

From the rules:

Criticism of sources, authorship, or redaction with the intent to discredit the authority of the canon are more appropriate for the Christianity and Apologetics subforum. However, such tools may be used to trace historical developments of doctrine or other subjects pertinent to theology. In other words, the Biblical books have theological authority because they are contained within the canon, regardless of any purportedly false claims to authorship and regardless of redactional interpolations. Therefore, wholesale dismissals of entire books of the Bible are not considered valid here. However, certain verses can be dismissed that are considered inauthentic by Biblical scholars and supported by Biblical criticism (such as the Johannine Comma) since such verses may be considered only spuriously canonical.

I don't see anything in the rules that say one must proceed as if the bible is inerrant and that the bible has no translation issues or errors.


But no worries at all.

Since your non-negotiable is that the bible must be inerrant, you can understand that my non-negotiable is Christ (and His words/teaching).


Peace again to you, and to your household,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[myth-one.com]

• 1.) Jesus said and did many, many things that only God can do, including foretelling future events, controlling the weather, forgiving sins, and of course making restitution and atoning for all the sin of mankind and reconciling the Father's Elect to Him (accomplishing salvation), not to mention reassuming the glory He possessed with the Father from all eternity. Were Jesus not fully God, He could not have possibly done any of those things.

The man Jesus Christ did not have power of His own to heal people, raise people from the dead, and perform other miracles.

One can know this to be true, because Jesus prayed!

If He was a God during His thirty-three years on the earth, He could have performed such feats directly with His own godly powers.

===================================================

On the other hand, if Jesus ever prayed even once for God's assistance in performing some supernatural act, then was He "fully God" as you claim?

If He was "fully God" why would He need to pray ever?

And whom would He be praying to?

Himself?
====================================================

The fact remains that Jesus was a man as the scriptures state.

[Revelations won]

Dear Tammy,

You should carefully consider and answer the following 2 questions:

1.

Is Jesus Christ the “Holy one of Israel” who alone, has provided the gift of resurrection for all mankind?

2.

Ezekiel 37: 12
Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13
And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
14
And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

If you claim that the scripture above does not apply to the great I AM later known as Jehovah and later known as Jesus the Christ, then please present scriptural evidence showing otherwise.

Kind regards,
RW

[tam]

Peace to you RW,

[Replying to Revelations won in post #168]

So you're not going to answer the question I asked you? You want me to keep responding to your questions but you won't respond to mine? To the one question on the scripture that does dispute (even refute) the claim of the OP title?


I'm not going to keep pushing you though. Respond or not as you choose. But the scripture is there (Psalm 110:1) and even if you do not respond on the board, it might be worth considering.




Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[onewithhim]

Not to lend relevancy or credence to the assertion that Jesus is not God because He prayed, but, well, did He pray before He calmed the sea? No. Did He pray when He turned the water to wine? No. Did he pray when He multiplied the fish and the bread and fed over 20,000 people? No. Did He pray when He pronounced the forgiveness of sins? No.

How do you know that Jesus didn't pray before all the things you mention? Did he have to make a public spectacle out of it every time he prayed? Of courses not. One doesn't have to pray on one's knees or look up at heaven every time one prays. I'm sure he said prayers under his breath before doing his miracles. And you cannot claim to know that he did not.

[onewithhim]

Not to lend relevancy or credence to the assertion that Jesus is not God because He prayed, but, well, did He pray before He calmed the sea? No. Did He pray when He turned the water to wine? No. Did he pray when He multiplied the fish and the bread and fed over 20,000 people? No. Did He pray when He pronounced the forgiveness of sins? No.

How do you know that Jesus didn't pray before all the things you mention? Did he have to make a public spectacle out of it every time he prayed? Of courses not. One doesn't have to pray on one's knees or look up at heaven every time one prays. I'm sure he said prayers under his breath before doing his miracles. And you cannot claim to know that he did not.