One of the hallmarks of Protestantism is their adherence to the principle of "Sola Scriptura" or the Bible alone.
But the Bible does not spell out the doctrine of the Trinity. At best, it is only implied in the New Testament. So why do Protestants accept the Trinity when that doctrine is not in the Bible? Isn't the Trinity a Catholic doctrine?
Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trinity?
Moderator: Moderators
-
Elijah John
- Savant
- Posts: 12236
- Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:23 pm
- Location: New England
- Has thanked: 11 times
- Been thanked: 16 times
Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trinity?
Post #1 My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-
Elijah John
- Savant
- Posts: 12236
- Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:23 pm
- Location: New England
- Has thanked: 11 times
- Been thanked: 16 times
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #21Continue to verse 9. "this is why God, your God has anointed you..."MarysSon wrote:
Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O GOD, is forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Does God have a God? Does God need to be anointed, by anyone?
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #22This verse doesn't say, But unto the Son he saith, "Thy throne, MY God" - it says, "O God." The Father is talking to the Son.Elijah John wrote:Continue to verse 9. "this is why God, your God has anointed you..."MarysSon wrote:
Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O GOD, is forever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Does God have a God? Does God need to be anointed, by anyone?
They have different ROLES within the Godhead.
The Father sends the Son - the Son obeys the Father and the Holy Spirit proceeds from BOTH the Father and the Son.
-
Eloi
- Banned
- Posts: 1775
- Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:31 pm
- Has thanked: 43 times
- Been thanked: 216 times
- Contact:
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #23[Replying to MarysSon]
You're forgeting who those words were said to in the first place:
Psal. 45:6 God is your throne to time indefinite, even forever;
The scepter of your kingship is a scepter of uprightness.
 7 You have loved righteousness and you hate wickedness.
That is why God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of exultation more than your partners.
Those words were dedicated originally to a human king. That means that this translation you're talking about is wrong.
You're forgeting who those words were said to in the first place:
Psal. 45:6 God is your throne to time indefinite, even forever;
The scepter of your kingship is a scepter of uprightness.
 7 You have loved righteousness and you hate wickedness.
That is why God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of exultation more than your partners.
Those words were dedicated originally to a human king. That means that this translation you're talking about is wrong.
Post #24
The language of the Trinity is not found in the Bible.
The concepts that the Trinity tried to explain are found in the Bible.
The Trinity is an effort to explain three truths that are repeated implicitly and explicitly in the Bible. They are:
1. There is only one God.
2. Jesus is not the Father.
3. Jesus is equally God with the Father.
We have been through the debates about these statements, especially the last one, several times. I am not currently in the mood to go through them again.
On the topic of the Bible claiming that Jesus is God I will say this: The overwhelming majority of people who read the Bible, both among those who accept it as true and those who reject it, agree that it teaches that Jesus is God. The overwhelming majority of Historical Jesus scholars agree that if the New Testament is entirely true then Jesus claimed to be God. The only major group in the world today that believes that the Bible is true but rejects the deity of Christ are Jehovah’s Witnesses, which make up roughly 1/3 of 1 percent of the people who say that the Bible is true.
It is possible that this overwhelming majority is wrong. However, it would be a fallacy to say that they should not accept the Trinity as true when they (even if they are wrong) believe that the Bible teaches the essential doctrines of the Trinity are true.
My last note is the language of the Trinity was developed in the second century, while the organization of the Catholic Church would not exist until at earliest the fifth century. Most historians trace the beginning of the Roman Catholic Church to 1054 AD.
The concepts that the Trinity tried to explain are found in the Bible.
The Trinity is an effort to explain three truths that are repeated implicitly and explicitly in the Bible. They are:
1. There is only one God.
2. Jesus is not the Father.
3. Jesus is equally God with the Father.
We have been through the debates about these statements, especially the last one, several times. I am not currently in the mood to go through them again.
On the topic of the Bible claiming that Jesus is God I will say this: The overwhelming majority of people who read the Bible, both among those who accept it as true and those who reject it, agree that it teaches that Jesus is God. The overwhelming majority of Historical Jesus scholars agree that if the New Testament is entirely true then Jesus claimed to be God. The only major group in the world today that believes that the Bible is true but rejects the deity of Christ are Jehovah’s Witnesses, which make up roughly 1/3 of 1 percent of the people who say that the Bible is true.
It is possible that this overwhelming majority is wrong. However, it would be a fallacy to say that they should not accept the Trinity as true when they (even if they are wrong) believe that the Bible teaches the essential doctrines of the Trinity are true.
My last note is the language of the Trinity was developed in the second century, while the organization of the Catholic Church would not exist until at earliest the fifth century. Most historians trace the beginning of the Roman Catholic Church to 1054 AD.
Last edited by bjs on Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
Eloi
- Banned
- Posts: 1775
- Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:31 pm
- Has thanked: 43 times
- Been thanked: 216 times
- Contact:
Post #25
That depends on what you think about the word "god" applied to Jesus. Not only about Jesus the Bible said is god, but about others. Nevertheless the Bible only talks about one God of gods. Jesus has a God, so he is not that God of gods. Jesus said who was that God of gods:
John 17:3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
The Father of Jesus is his God, the God of gods and the God every real Christian should be thinking on:
John 20:17 Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’�
Nobody can be brother of the God of gods, but Jesus called his disciples as brothers, and said all of them have the same God; that is why Christians become sons of God, not sons of Jesus.
Deut. 10:17 For Jehovah YOUR God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the God great, mighty and fear-inspiring, who treats none with partiality nor accepts a bribe, 18 executing judgment for the fatherless boy and the widow and loving the alien resident so as to give him bread and a mantle.
John 17:3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
The Father of Jesus is his God, the God of gods and the God every real Christian should be thinking on:
John 20:17 Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’�
Nobody can be brother of the God of gods, but Jesus called his disciples as brothers, and said all of them have the same God; that is why Christians become sons of God, not sons of Jesus.
Deut. 10:17 For Jehovah YOUR God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the God great, mighty and fear-inspiring, who treats none with partiality nor accepts a bribe, 18 executing judgment for the fatherless boy and the widow and loving the alien resident so as to give him bread and a mantle.
-
brianbbs67
- Guru
- Posts: 1871
- Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:07 am
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 2 times
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #26I'm not claiming this of Jesus, necessarily, because he did not. Could it be so, like under cover boss? Sure, but I don't see scripture backing that up.polonius wrote:brianbbs67 wrote:If you are saying God is One, I agree. Monotheism can not accept more than one.Wootah wrote: [Replying to Elijah John]
Yes, we are proving the Trinity again.
Why do you assume Jesus is empowered by God and YHWH is not empowered by God? Instead of making that assumption which involves an infinite regress just assume if X can do something that only God can do then X is God.
How about we apply the adage: If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck it's a duck.
You are giving undue weight to the Old Testament. I call the whole thing the Bible and read it equally.
YHWH creates = YHWH is God.
Jesus creates = Jesus is God.
Further, the Holy Spirit hovered over the waters and can create.
Spirit creates = Spirit is God.
More on the Spirit:
https://answersingenesis.org/answers/bi ... -creation/
https://www.ligonier.org/blog/five-trut ... ly-spirit/
RESPONSE: But if you claim Jesus too was divine, you have two Gods.
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #27Uhhhhhh, no.Eloi wrote: [Replying to MarysSon]
You're forgeting who those words were said to in the first place:
Psal. 45:6 God is your throne to time indefinite, even forever;
The scepter of your kingship is a scepter of uprightness.
 7 You have loved righteousness and you hate wickedness.
That is why God, your God, has anointed you with the oil of exultation more than your partners.
Those words were dedicated originally to a human king. That means that this translation you're talking about is wrong.
This is a reference to Psalm 45:7 - and is addressed to GOD:
Psalm 45:7
Your throne, O God, stands forever;c your royal scepter is a scepter for justice.
The author of Heb. 1:8 is referencing this verse and applying it to Jesus, the Son.
Re: Sola Scriptura? Then why do Protestants accept the Trini
Post #29Then, please explain WHO is being spoken about in the following verse:
Psalm 45:7
Your throne, O God, stands forever; your royal scepter is a scepter for justice.
Who else besides God is referred to as "God" in the Scriptures?
