A belief of the Jehovah Witnesses?

[polonius]

Garbe, Detlef (2008). Between Resistance and Martyrdom: Jehovah's Witnesses in the Third Reich. University of Wisconsin Press. pp. 37, 38. ISBN 0-299-20794-3.

" In their opinion, only people who have accepted Jehovah and subsequently submit to his requirements will survive Armageddon and enter into the New World ... Jehovah's Witnesses also believe that a person confessing to worship God has to be associated with the true Christian denomination. Since they claim to be the only true religious denomination, they also claim to have the only means for salvation."

Is this a belief that all Jehovah Witnesses hold?

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to post 85 by tam]

"Only Jehovah's Witnesses, those of the anointed remnant and the "great crowd," as a united organization under the protection of the Supreme Organizer, have any Scriptural hope of surviving the impending end of this doomed system dominated by Satan the Devil." - Watchtower 1989 Sep 1 p.19 par 7a

Jehovah's Witnesss believe the only ORGANIZATION [ *] that will survive the coming destructon of Armageddon will be ours.

* made up of two groups an anointed remnant of (the 144, 000) born again christians and potential members of the "great crowd" ie Christians with an earthly hope

QUESTION: Does the fact that Jehovah's Witnesses believe only their ORGANIZATION will survive Harmageddon not constitute a belief that no other individuals outside their organization will survive?

• No, the survival of an organization is not to be equated with the destiny of those that work elsewhere.

Sounds like double speak to me. Lets examine it more fully, beginning with the question that was asked (which prompts the quote):

7. (a) Only by remaining in what relationship with one another may Jehovah’s people expect to survive the great tribulation? (b) How did the Flood survivors get through the global Deluge, and whom did they prefigure?

The question asks about the PEOPLE. How might "Jehovah's" PEOPLE survive? The question does not ask what organization will survive.


The answer:

7 Only Jehovah’s Witnesses

The people (in direct response to the question). Plain and simple.

, those of the anointed remnant and the “great crowd,� as a united organization under the protection of the Supreme Organizer have any Scriptural hope of surviving the impending end of this doomed system dominated by Satan the Devil. (Revelation 7:9-17; 2 Corinthians 4:4)

,


A description being given of those Jehovah's witnesses.

They will make up the “flesh� that Jesus Christ said would be saved through the worst tribulation of all human history.

Note the word 'they'... as in the PEOPLE. Not "it" as in an organization.

As it was in the days of Noah, said Jesus, so it would be in the day when He would be revealed. Inside the ark that took many years of organized effort to complete, only eight human souls survived the global Deluge. They survived as a united family group. (Matthew 24:22, 37-39; Luke 17:26-30) Noah’s wife corresponds to the bride of Christ, and his sons and daughters-in-law to Jesus’ present-day “other sheep,� who have grown into an increasing great crowd, the final proportions of which we do not now know. (John 10:16)

Did anyone outside of that united family group survive the flood?

For survival into the Millennium under the Greater Noah, Jesus Christ, they have to remain organized with the anointed remnant, “the chosen ones� on account of whom the days of the “great tribulation� will be cut short.​—Matthew 24:21, 22.

THEY - again speaking about the PEOPLE.



Not "it" speaking about the organization.






Peace again to you.

[JehovahsWitness]

Sounds like double speak to me.

I don't care what it sounds like to you, the word "organisation" is not the same as "individual". We believe we part of Gods earthly organisation (an organisation is made up of people /individuals) and as the article says we entertain the hope of surviving armagedddon. The only guarantee however is that the organisation will survive (ie there will be an organized body of people) everyone's individudal fate however lies with God. If you think Christians that don't endure will survive armageddon you might like to consult your bible.

MATTHEW 24:13

But the one who has endured to the end will be saved.

As for all your verbage about the ark/noah, the point is God has an organisation and expects his people to work together like Noah and his family within it. The ark itself corresponds to an approved standing before God and God (through his son Jesus) will be the final arbitrator on that, whether we are active members of his organisation or not.

No comment is made about the fate of those (the people/the individuals) outside of Gods organisation.




JW

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to post 86 by JehovahsWitness]

Like the Apostle Peter and his companions we have held erronous ideas, (that's no secret we don't hide that). Jehovah's Witnesses are a progressive organisation that has enjoyed ever increasing spiritual enlightenment as God has revealed it to us. We believe God chose us as an organization because we have, like the Apostles, been willing to change our ideas when errors have been revealed.

Can you say the same thing of yourself?

Can I say that I would be willing to change my ideas when errors have been revealed?

It would be pretty foolish of me to put faith in my own ideas... and irresponsible of me to teach my own ideas as if they were the truth... but yes of course I would be willing to change my ideas if/when an error has been revealed.


I am not entirely sure why my Lord (Jaheshua) chose me. But He did and I love Him (He loved me first), and I will continue to obey Him and bear witness to Him, out of love and gratitude. I do know that my Father in heaven drew me to His Son (I had been seeking His Truth and I had asked to be led where He - God - wanted me to be), and I know the moment of my anointing (being anointed with holy spirit).




May anyone who wishes and anyone who thirsts, "Come! Take the free gift of the water of Life!"

(which water is holy spirit; poured out from Christ - the Tree of Life - and given to whomever He chooses)



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

[JehovahsWitness]

Can I say that I would be willing to change my ideas when errors have been revealed?...yes of course I would be willing to change my ideas if/when an error has been revealed.

Well that is exactly the same for us Jehovahs Witnesses.


Anything else?





JW

[tam]

...

[tam]

Peace to you,

Anything else?

Sure, feel free to go back and answer the questions I asked in post 69.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 93 by tam]

If you go back and check you will see I already answered that post. Anything else?


JW

[tam]

Peace again to you,

October 2019, Watchtower (study edition):

Read Matthew 28:19, 20. As we conduct Bible studies, we have to try our best to “make disciples . . . , teaching them to observe all the things [Jesus has] commanded.� We need to help people understand how important it is for them to take their stand for Jehovah and his Kingdom. This means trying to motivate people to make the truth their own by applying what they learn, dedicating their life to Jehovah, and getting baptized. Only then will they survive Jehovah’s day.​—1 Pet. 3:21.

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/201 ... +day&p=par

[tam]

Peace again to you,

[Replying to post 93 by tam]

If you go back and check you will see I already answered that post. Anything else?


JW

You responded to the post. You did not answer the questions.



But I'm not going to make you do anything you do not wish to do. I supplied the quotes from the WTS that support my statement (which you claimed was false). I made my claim based upon what I had read in the Grand Climax book and other magazines, and it is supported in the links I provided.


What you (or anyone else) does with that is up to you.




Peace again to you.

[JehovahsWitness]

Peace again to you,

October 2019, Watchtower (study edition): ....
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/201 ... +day&p=par

Are you turning against the bible now!? Does not the bible say people need to be baptised to be saved?


IS IT UNSCRIPTURAL TO SAY BAPTISM SAVES?

1 PETER 3:21 - NWT

Baptism, which corresponds to this is also now saving you (not by the removing of the filth of the flesh, but by the request to God for a good conscience)

This means trying to motivate people to make the truth their own by applying what they learn, dedicating their life to Jehovah, and getting baptized. Only then will they survive Jehovah’s day​—1 Pet 3:21" -Watchtower Oct 2019 #40 p. 12 par 14

DOES TEACHING PEOPLE THE IMPORTANCE OF 1 PETER 3:21 MEAN BELIEVING EVERYONE THAT ISN'T BAPTISED WILL BE KILLED?


No. Teaching people to obey Jesus command is not a judgement on those that either have not had the opportunity or are for whatever reason are not ready to make such a committment. For such people Jesus (as Jehovahs appointed judge) will decide. We JWs tell people what the bible says, including their need to be baptised in obedience to Jesus command, and leave the rest in Gods capable hands.

Read Matthew 28:19, 20. As we conduct Bible studies, we have to try our best to “make disciples . . . , teaching them to observe all the things [Jesus has] commanded.� We need to help people understand how important it is for them to take their stand for Jehovah and his Kingdom" -Watchtower Oct 2019 #40 p. 12 par 14

MATTHEW 28:19, 20 - NWT

Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you.

Extrapolating the obeying God's word to teach people must be baptised, to robbing Him of his position as universal judge at ARMADEDDON is something no true christian would do. I'm surprised to find such an objection as this coming from a believer!



JW