Out-of-body experiences

[Compassionist]

Has anyone on this forum had an out-of-body experience? I bought this book Navigating the Out-of-Body Experience: Radical New Techniques on 23 August 2018 and have been trying to have one since then but still have not managed to have one. I would be grateful if you would share your experiences with me. Thank you.

[William]

@

Compassionist:Thank you for your reply.

William: You are welcome.

Compassionist: I am agnostic about whether or not we have immortal souls.

William: If this is the case, then your position is neutral. Otherwise, you are not agnostic.

Compassionist: 84% of humans currently believe in one religion or another. Most of them believe in the resurrection of our immortal souls which will then go to hell or heaven. Some of them believe in reincarnation according to the karmic bank balance

William: That is a large percentage of Humanity.
Of course, the stats alone do not help - but at least they point to something going on.
How many simply believe from the sidelines and how many believe through personal experience?

Compassionist: I am skeptical about both resurrection and reincarnation.

William: Okay...

Compassionist: I think that OBEs and NDEs are the products of a malfunctioning brain.

William: I am sceptical about that being the reason, but each to their own beliefs on the subject.

Compassionist: I have experienced dreams, delusions and hallucinations and am convinced that these are all products of our neurochemistry.

William: Then if you are convinced, why do you say you are agnostic about the subject?

Compassionist: I don't think that we are immortal spiritual beings in a physical body. I think we are impermanent constructs made of atoms, as are all living things.

William: Then your position isn't one of being agnostic.

Compassionist: When we die, our atoms become part of other living and non-living things.

William: I am convinced enough through personal experience that when our bodies die, we go on to the next phase of existence.

Compassionist: As I am an open-minded person, I am open to be proven wrong with incontrovertible evidence for the existence and the resurrection or reincarnation of immortal souls.

William: I am a realist. As such, I know there is only one way for any of us to get the incontrovertible evidence...

Compassionist: So far, I have not found such evidence but I will keep looking...

William: What are you expecting you might find exactly? Since you think all such experiences are simply brain malfunctions?

Compassionist:... until I die.

William: Therein, you shall have your incontrovertible evidence. No one can provide this for you while your brain yet lives.

[Compassionist]

@

Compassionist:Thank you for your reply.

William: You are welcome.

Compassionist: I am agnostic about whether or not we have immortal souls.

William: If this is the case, then your position is neutral. Otherwise, you are not agnostic.

Compassionist: 84% of humans currently believe in one religion or another. Most of them believe in the resurrection of our immortal souls which will then go to hell or heaven. Some of them believe in reincarnation according to the karmic bank balance

William: That is a large percentage of Humanity.
Of course, the stats alone do not help - but at least they point to something going on.
How many simply believe from the sidelines and how many believe through personal experience?

Compassionist: I am skeptical about both resurrection and reincarnation.

William: Okay...

Compassionist: I think that OBEs and NDEs are the products of a malfunctioning brain.

William: I am sceptical about that being the reason, but each to their own beliefs on the subject.

Compassionist: I have experienced dreams, delusions and hallucinations and am convinced that these are all products of our neurochemistry.

William: Then if you are convinced, why do you say you are agnostic about the subject?

Compassionist: I don't think that we are immortal spiritual beings in a physical body. I think we are impermanent constructs made of atoms, as are all living things.

William: Then your position isn't one of being agnostic.

Compassionist: When we die, our atoms become part of other living and non-living things.

William: I am convinced enough through personal experience that when our bodies die, we go on to the next phase of existence.

Compassionist: As I am an open-minded person, I am open to be proven wrong with incontrovertible evidence for the existence and the resurrection or reincarnation of immortal souls.

William: I am a realist. As such, I know there is only one way for any of us to get the incontrovertible evidence...

Compassionist: So far, I have not found such evidence but I will keep looking...

William: What are you expecting you might find exactly? Since you think all such experiences are simply brain malfunctions?

Compassionist:... until I die.

William: Therein, you shall have your incontrovertible evidence. No one can provide this for you while your brain yet lives.

Thank you for your reply. I would like there to be immortal souls as I want humans and other sentient organisms to have Life After Death. I want to see my family and friends and dog again in heaven but I realise that just because I want something to be true it doesn't make it true. I had a NDE when I was four. My religious friends say NDE proves Life After Death and my secular friends say that NDE occurs in a malfunctioning brain. I don't know who is right. I am really looking forward to dying and finding out. Obviously, different religions have different beliefs about what happens after we die. None of these beliefs are proven with incontrovertible evidence. I am an agnostic because I don't know with 100% certainty what the truth is.

[William]

@

Compassionist: Thank you for your reply.

William: No problem...

Compassionist: I would like there to be immortal souls as I want humans and other sentient organisms to have Life After Death.

William: Seems reasonable.

Compassionist: I want to see my family and friends and dog again in heaven

William: I think I would want a whole change - something quiet and trouble free where I can gather my thoughts and take my time and enjoy that for a time.

Compassionist: but I realise that just because I want something to be true it doesn't make it true.

William: From what I gather, the Metaphysical Universe responds to ones beliefs - and attitude.
I don't mind the idea of dying with the hope of what I want will be so.

Compassionist: I had a NDE when I was four. My religious friends say NDE proves Life After Death and my secular friends say that NDE occurs in a malfunctioning brain. I don't know who is right.

William: None of us really do, although I have yet to hear any reasonable argument regarding the malfunctioning brain belief, in relation to those things I mentioned I experienced.
I think it prudent to give precedence to my own subjective experiences rather than depend on, or otherwise be swayed by others opinions and beliefs on the matter.
Given that the idea that we create our own reality experience in the next phase, it would pay not to get into the habit of being talked into or out of something by someone else, wouldn't you agree?

Compassionist:I am really looking forward to dying and finding out.

William:Me too! If we are just the creation of the brain, then there won't be any disappointment! Am in no hurry, as it were - but am not afraid of the thought of dying. Nor am I afraid of the thought of that being the end of "me".

Compassionist: Obviously, different religions have different beliefs about what happens after we die.

William: Yes. The Christian religion in particular tends to put a shadowy evil thing on to it. I have met few - if any - who are willing to even try to investigate through OBE as they believe that it is a devilish deception which they must avoid!
Jesus - on the other hand - told his Disciples otherwise. He consistently spoke about The Knowledge of The Secrets of The Kingdom of Heaven. One simply does not get to know about something by not experiencing it for themselves. Making up superstitious nonsense in order not to have to, while proclaiming assumptions about it, is avoidance...
The Disciple wrote that Jesus said of such, that they stood at the gateway to life and prevented others from going through into that knowledge-by-experience and neither would those ones go through that gate themselves.
Using fear tactics to justify not doing something they are invited to do...not a good idea. For that matter, it is not a good idea to be fearful about it at all, as the experience is usually unpleasant when fear is involved...
Having said as much, because such experiences are extremely unusual for the initiate, it is tempting to be afraid.
Love overcomes fear.

Compassionist: None of these beliefs are proven with incontrovertible evidence.

William: Generally for those - like myself - who have experienced the alternate reality, the evidence in that, is as close as it gets, although I have meet one or two who have had such experiences and still think it may be nothing more than 'in the brain'... each to their own on that, I say!
If others want to doubt their OWN experiences, that is their choice. But their own self-doubt is no incontrovertible evidence against my lack of doubt.

Compassionist: I am an agnostic because I don't know with 100% certainty what the truth is.

William: Continue studying up on it and learning how to do it and just trust yourself and leave doubt aside as it is not useful either way.
You might even learn to become adept at it and explore it as a fun and entertaining thing which costs you relatively nothing, and as long as you remain positive and happy, who cares in the end whether it is all just a brain malfunction or not!
If it isn't, then your transition into the next phase will be smooth and familiar.

[Compassionist]

I don't mind the idea of dying with the hope of what I want will be so.

Thank you for your reply. I find the above comment to be striking. Isn't this indulging in wishful thinking? I have faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse and all living things in the infinite number of universes of the omniverse go to my omnibenevolent heaven after they die because of my unconditional faith, hope and love. Am I right or am I just deluding myself? How can I know for sure without dying?

[William]

@

William: From what I gather, the Metaphysical Universe responds to ones beliefs - and attitude.
I don't mind the idea of dying with the hope of what I want will be so.

Compassionist: I find the above comment to be striking.
Isn't this indulging in wishful thinking?

William: Not so much 'wishful' as 'hopeful', since hope is the word I used.
But if that is merely semantics, just remember the comment was not presented on its own, but in the context of personal experience.
In context I was writing that, since I have experienced OBE and other related alternate reality, the idea that we continue on after death of the biological instrument, I accept as more a given.
The hope part is to do with what happens in relation to that.
Even so, it is based upon the stories of those who Astral Travel as frequent flyers and reported back what they have discovered re the Metaphysical Universe, which most - if not all - agree, observe the MU reacts instantaneously with the individuals beliefs and attitudes. Not just those presented on the surface of the individuals psyche, but the hidden ones at our very core.

Compassionist: I have faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse and all living things in the infinite number of universes of the omniverse go to my omnibenevolent heaven after they die because of my unconditional faith, hope and love. Am I right or am I just deluding myself?

William: This is a figurative analogy right?
I myself think such a position is a few steps ahead of a Human Spirit to be able to accomplish in interacting with the MU.
For me, I leave such to The First Source. That is The Fathers House you speak of, and I am simply speaking of one Mansion within that House.
I would be more content with creating something along the lines of this type of situation;
Around The Campfire as an environment I get to control and expand upon.
Learning to be a Good GOD...at my own pace. No need to jump in at the deep end as that has already been taken care of...


Compassionist: How can I know for sure without dying?

William: What makes you think you would be in a position to know for sure anything, other than your biological human instrument has died and yet you live?
What if in the transition, you panic and start thinking the worst, and that panic produces thoughts which then manifest a creation you are not even aware your own thoughts are creating...and before you know it you are in a seemingly impossible situation filled with whatever it is your panic manifested?

The opportunity to prepare for that, is in the here and now.

Continue studying up on it and learning how to do it and just trust yourself and leave doubt aside as it is not useful either way.
You might even learn to become adept at it and explore it as a fun and entertaining thing which costs you relatively nothing, and as long as you remain positive and happy, who cares in the end whether it is all just a brain malfunction or not!
If it isn't, then your transition into the next phase will be smooth and familiar.

[Compassionist]

@

William: From what I gather, the Metaphysical Universe responds to ones beliefs - and attitude.
I don't mind the idea of dying with the hope of what I want will be so.

Compassionist: I find the above comment to be striking.
Isn't this indulging in wishful thinking?

William: Not so much 'wishful' as 'hopeful', since hope is the word I used.
But if that is merely semantics, just remember the comment was not presented on its own, but in the context of personal experience.
In context I was writing that, since I have experienced OBE and other related alternate reality, the idea that we continue on after death of the biological instrument, I accept as more a given.
The hope part is to do with what happens in relation to that.
Even so, it is based upon the stories of those who Astral Travel as frequent flyers and reported back what they have discovered re the Metaphysical Universe, which most - if not all - agree, observe the MU reacts instantaneously with the individuals beliefs and attitudes. Not just those presented on the surface of the individuals psyche, but the hidden ones at our very core.

Compassionist: I have faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse and all living things in the infinite number of universes of the omniverse go to my omnibenevolent heaven after they die because of my unconditional faith, hope and love. Am I right or am I just deluding myself?

William: This is a figurative analogy right?
I myself think such a position is a few steps ahead of a Human Spirit to be able to accomplish in interacting with the MU.
For me, I leave such to The First Source. That is The Fathers House you speak of, and I am simply speaking of one Mansion within that House.
I would be more content with creating something along the lines of this type of situation;
Around The Campfire as an environment I get to control and expand upon.
Learning to be a Good GOD...at my own pace. No need to jump in at the deep end as that has already been taken care of...


Compassionist: How can I know for sure without dying?

William: What makes you think you would be in a position to know for sure anything, other than your biological human instrument has died and yet you live?
What if in the transition, you panic and start thinking the worst, and that panic produces thoughts which then manifest a creation you are not even aware your own thoughts are creating...and before you know it you are in a seemingly impossible situation filled with whatever it is your panic manifested?

The opportunity to prepare for that, is in the here and now.

Continue studying up on it and learning how to do it and just trust yourself and leave doubt aside as it is not useful either way.
You might even learn to become adept at it and explore it as a fun and entertaining thing which costs you relatively nothing, and as long as you remain positive and happy, who cares in the end whether it is all just a brain malfunction or not!
If it isn't, then your transition into the next phase will be smooth and familiar.

It's not a figurative analogy. It stems from my omnibenevolence and my desire to save everyone and make everyone eternally happy. What if my faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse is a self-fulfilling reality?

I will keep trying to have OBEs. Thank you for sharing your experience. I wish you all the best in this life and the next.

[William]

@

Compassionist: It's not a figurative analogy. It stems from my omnibenevolence and my desire to save everyone and make everyone eternally happy. What if my faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse is a self-fulfilling reality?

William: Then you will be given a mansion in The Father House, in which to explore this idea in full.
In what ways now can you apply imagination in order to see what that might actually involve, in the way of creative exploration?

[Compassionist]

@

Compassionist: It's not a figurative analogy. It stems from my omnibenevolence and my desire to save everyone and make everyone eternally happy. What if my faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse is a self-fulfilling reality?

William: Then you will be given a mansion in The Father House, in which to explore this idea in full.
In what ways now can you apply imagination in order to see what that might actually involve, in the way of creative exploration?

I imagine everyone living happily forever in loving fellowship. There is no suffering and no unfairness. That's my idea of heaven. Once I die, I will find out, if that is true. Hope to see you in my omnibenevolent heaven for all.

[William]

[Replying to post 18 by ]

Compassionist: What if my faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse is a self-fulfilling reality?

William: Then you will be given a mansion in The Fathers House, in which to explore this idea in full.
In what ways now can you apply imagination in order to see what that might actually involve, in the way of creative exploration?

Compassionist: I imagine everyone living happily forever in loving fellowship. There is no suffering and no unfairness. That's my idea of heaven.

William: As I wrote, it appears the next phase of experience - The Metaphysical Universe - (Astral Realm. Kingdom of Heaven.) is something which responds to ones beliefs and attitudes and delivers a full immersion experience.

Compassionist: Once I die, I will find out, if that is true. Hope to see you in my omnibenevolent heaven for all.

William: If you do, it will be because you have created that 'me' to be there with you.
I myself will most likely be elsewhere in my own self-created environment, learning through creativity, at a gentle non-rushed pace, about the bigger picture...what makes it all 'tick'.
I would probably include the ability to be able to go and have a look at what others have created for themselves...as an observer rather than injecting myself into their creation.

I am pretty sure that I would be interested in observing how you managed to save everyone and make everyone eternally happy, in the universe you created for that purpose.

[Compassionist]

[Replying to post 18 by ]

Compassionist: What if my faith that I am the omnibenevolent omnisaviour of the omniverse is a self-fulfilling reality?

William: Then you will be given a mansion in The Fathers House, in which to explore this idea in full.
In what ways now can you apply imagination in order to see what that might actually involve, in the way of creative exploration?

Compassionist: I imagine everyone living happily forever in loving fellowship. There is no suffering and no unfairness. That's my idea of heaven.

William: As I wrote, it appears the next phase of experience - The Metaphysical Universe - (Astral Realm. Kingdom of Heaven.) is something which responds to ones beliefs and attitudes and delivers a full immersion experience.

Compassionist: Once I die, I will find out, if that is true. Hope to see you in my omnibenevolent heaven for all.

William: If you do, it will be because you have created that 'me' to be there with you.
I myself will most likely be elsewhere in my own self-created environment, learning through creativity, at a gentle non-rushed pace, about the bigger picture...what makes it all 'tick'.
I would probably include the ability to be able to go and have a look at what others have created for themselves...as an observer rather than injecting myself into their creation.

I am pretty sure that I would be interested in observing how you managed to save everyone and make everyone eternally happy, in the universe you created for that purpose.

Thank you. I can't wait to get to my omnibenevolent heaven for all.