Gun Control

[jgh7]

Gun control in America is a very hot topic right now. Do religious views factor at all into swaying someone to be for or against gun control?

I'm also just plain interested in the topic of gun control and whether it's right or wrong. I know this site is meant for topics to be relating back to religion, but for this topic in addition to religious views I'd also just like to know people's general opinions of gun control.

[OpenYourEyes]

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[OpenYourEyes]

I see no reason for Sig Sauers and assault-type semi-automatic rifles for 'civilian use'. Even then, I get it about gun collectors and all that. I wish there were some way law abiding gun collectors could own Uzis and the like, whatever fire arm they enjoy collecting or firing for sport -- without arming radicalized and/or mentally disturbed persons. They are far too easy to purchase, they are designed to kill as many people with as little effort as possible and thoroughly.

Your post mentioned more than this, most of which I agree with, except for the part I quoted here. You mentioned that you see no reasons for semi-automatic assault rifles but you unknowingly stated the reason or purpose for having civilian-style assault rifle, and that reason as you stated is, "... to kill as many people with as little effort as possible and thoroughly". If we take disassociate this scenario of killing many people from recent mass shootings, then I think we can come up with reasons for why a civilian would need to kill a mass number of people.

A civilian would need to lawfully kill a lot of people if there are a lot of people trying to commit a physical crime against him or another innocent person, such as can and has happened in American history when it comes to civil unrest (violent rioters, looters, vandals, etc) and communities plagued by organized crime (mob or gang violence). Other scenarios would involve a tyrannical government takeover, both domestic or foreign.

Secondly, an assault rifle does not automatically kill a mass number of people but rather it kills as many times as the shooter pulls the trigger. One pull of the trigger fires off ONE round or bullet. This is no different than a handgun.

- We should maximize gun possession in the hands of GOOD guys and minimize gun possessions in the hands of bad guys.

- The United States have high gun crime rates but the problem once again appears to be that we have problems keeping guns out of the hands of the bad guys...

Then surely the first step is to ban the sale of handguns to non CHL holders? How is that not a no-brainer?

I'm all for it. It is legal for civilians to own fully automatic weapons. It is legal for cops to carry their guns openly and into State and Federal buildings, schools included. But yet, we hardly see LAWFUL fully automatic gunowners and cops committing mass shootings. Why is that?

Extensive and periodic background checks?!

[Strider324]

OpenYourEyes scribed:

- We should maximize gun possession in the hands of GOOD guys and minimize gun possessions in the hands of bad guys.

And who are the geniuses that will determine who these 'good' guys are? You?

But yet, we hardly see LAWFUL fully automatic gunowners and cops committing mass shootings. Why is that?

I hate to be the one to tell you, but virtually EVERY serial killer we know of was a LAWFUL person right up until they decided to use their automatic weapon to murder innocent adults and children. You'll have to do better than this.

[OpenYourEyes]

OpenYourEyes scribed:

- We should maximize gun possession in the hands of GOOD guys and minimize gun possessions in the hands of bad guys.

And who are the geniuses that will determine who these 'good' guys are? You?

The government with the help and counsel of citizens and various gun rights groups. A good and obvious criteria is the absence of a felony record. Remember, the majority of gun crimes are committed with handguns and the majority of those crimes are carried out by unlawful gun owners.

But yet, we hardly see LAWFUL fully automatic gunowners and cops committing mass shootings. Why is that?

I hate to be the one to tell you, but virtually EVERY serial killer we know of was a LAWFUL person right up until they decided to use their automatic weapon to murder innocent adults and children. You'll have to do better than this.

You mean almost every recent and popularized shooting? I emphasize this because people die everyday from gun crimes and in the overall context mass shootings (of the magnitude if Sandy Hook school or Pulse nightclub) accounts for a small percentage of gun crime. Surely that shows that an overwhelmingly majority of gun owners are not mass murderers.

Secondly, to greatly minimize lawful gun owners carrying out gun crimes, however rare it may be, we should get more in depth with background checks, including making it periodic instead of a one time check. This screening process can work which is why i bring up cops and lawful fully automatic gunowners who go through a much more extensive background check and the fact that we dont see cops and higher level gunowners committing mass shootings. I mean nothing is perfect, including banning all guns.

[Strider324]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/texas-mom-ki ... 17690.html

Here's yet another 'lawful' woman and gun enthusiast. She was completely lawful - right up until last Friday when she shot and killed her 2 daughters. Gee, I wish one of these alleged 'experts' on guns would have taken into account her mental illness and not allowed her to have guns.

But here's her presumably 'sane' position on guns. Sounds eerily familiar:

"It would be horribly tragic if my ability to protect myself or my family were to be taken away, but that's exactly what Democrats are determined to do by banning semi-automatic handguns,"

Again, it's ludicrous to assume anyone can decide who the 'lawful' people are that 'deserve' guns.

[OpenYourEyes]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/texas-mom-ki ... 17690.html

Here's yet another 'lawful' woman and gun enthusiast. She was completely lawful - right up until last Friday when she shot and killed her 2 daughters. Gee, I wish one of these alleged 'experts' on guns would have taken into account her mental illness and not allowed her to have guns.

But here's her presumably 'sane' position on guns. Sounds eerily familiar:

"It would be horribly tragic if my ability to protect myself or my family were to be taken away, but that's exactly what Democrats are determined to do by banning semi-automatic handguns,"

Again, it's ludicrous to assume anyone can decide who the 'lawful' people are that 'deserve' guns.

I'm not sure if your post here was intended to refute my post or to just be your opinion against some aspect guns or guns overall. Either way, nothing here takes away from the validity of my point about requiring extensive and periodic background checks, including checks that assess mental health, requiring training for all firearms (assault rifles, included) and not just handguns, etc and how that would reduce 'lawful' gun owners from committing gun crimes just as it has worked for cops, federal agents, and higher level gun owners. If this was done, we should have about the same confidence in lawful civilian gun owners as we do in cops, etc.

More specifically to your point, all the government has to do is apply the same background checks that they require to federal agents, cops, and higher level gun owners to every civilian who wants to own a gun.

[OpenYourEyes]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/texas-mom-ki ... 17690.html

Here's yet another 'lawful' woman and gun enthusiast. She was completely lawful - right up until last Friday when she shot and killed her 2 daughters. Gee, I wish one of these alleged 'experts' on guns would have taken into account her mental illness and not allowed her to have guns.

But here's her presumably 'sane' position on guns. Sounds eerily familiar:

"It would be horribly tragic if my ability to protect myself or my family were to be taken away, but that's exactly what Democrats are determined to do by banning semi-automatic handguns,"

Again, it's ludicrous to assume anyone can decide who the 'lawful' people are that 'deserve' guns.

Keep in mind also, that less than 1% of gun crime is committed by lawful gun owners. So just pointing out random stories about lawful gun owners committing gun crimes, and trying to paint even lawful gunowners as being part of the problem which I assume is your point, is unreasonable. But yet, I think even gun crimes committed by lawful gun owners can be reduced, even with it being a *rare* occurrence to begin with. I explained how to reduce that statistic in the previous post.


Read for yourself where Texas compares gun crimes committed by lawful gunowners vs unlicensed/unlawful gunowners: (lawful gunowners account for less than 1% of total guncrime in Texas!):
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/re ... vrates.htm[/quote]

[abell29]

[Replying to post 51 by OpenYourEyes]

Hello,  

I am a cultural anthropology student working through my anthropology capstone course. I am researching whether or not current (within the last five years) events such as marriage equality and the Affordable Care Act are uniting the Catholics and Protestants? If anyone would like to anonymously answer my questions, it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time and I do not wish to sideline the current debate at all.  

1) What have you felt you have witnessed as far as the evolution of the relationship between Catholics and the Protestants?  

2)When a natural disaster occurs if your congregation decides to step in and help would you coordinate your efforts only within your denomination?  


3)In your opinion do you feel that the onset of frequent natural disasters has encouraged a closer working relationship between Protestants and Catholics due to the sheer volume and frequency of these occurrences?  

4)In your opinion do you feel like the resolved issue of the Affordable Care Act that exempted certain religious organizations but not religious organizations that employed employees of different faiths or of no faith at all, to pay for birth control and abortions and the issue surrounding the definition of marriage are uniting Christians from different denominations?  

5)What was your interpretation of the response the Pope received when he came to America?  

6)How significant is the importance of the response received from the Pope's support/ nonsupport of Kim Davis?Back to top

[OpenYourEyes]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/texas-mom-ki ... 17690.html

Here's yet another 'lawful' woman and gun enthusiast. She was completely lawful - right up until last Friday when she shot and killed her 2 daughters. Gee, I wish one of these alleged 'experts' on guns would have taken into account her mental illness and not allowed her to have guns.

But here's her presumably 'sane' position on guns. Sounds eerily familiar:

"It would be horribly tragic if my ability to protect myself or my family were to be taken away, but that's exactly what Democrats are determined to do by banning semi-automatic handguns,"

Again, it's ludicrous to assume anyone can decide who the 'lawful' people are that 'deserve' guns.

On July 14, 2016, terrorist in Nice, France commits mass murder by running over people with a truck and then getting out and shooting into a crowd. Do we ban trucks?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 57 by abell29]

I believe that the bible's promise of an end to war is a reality.

A new world order is at hand, with Jesus reigning as king!!

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS