A new forum member has suggested that he would sincerely like to "debate" (or possibly just discuss) the question, "What is the Message of the Bible?"
I think this question can be addressed by everyone. It's not required that a person actually believe the Bible to be true in order to answer this question. Anyone who is familiar with the Bible can answer this question even if they believe it to be nothing more than a man-made superstitious myth. They should still be able to say what they believe the message of the myth is.
So everyone on this forum should be able to express their views and opinions on this question.
It's not necessary to "debate" other people's views in this thread. If you find that they would like to "debate" a specific view just copy and paste that view to a thread in Christianity and Apologetic with your specific questions for debate concerning the view in question.
In the meantime don't forget to post YOUR answer to this question here.
Thank you.
What is the Message of the Bible?
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Divine Insight
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What is the Message of the Bible?
Post #1[center]
Spiritual Growth - A person's continual assessment
of how well they believe they are doing
relative to what they believe a personal God expects of them.
[/center]
Spiritual Growth - A person's continual assessment
of how well they believe they are doing
relative to what they believe a personal God expects of them.
[/center]
-
Divine Insight
- Savant
- Posts: 18070
- Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:59 pm
- Location: Here & Now
- Been thanked: 19 times
Post #2
What is the Message of the Bible?
My personal answer to this question:
I would sum up the message of the Christian Holy Bible as follows:
In the Beginning:
1. A God supposedly created two humans named Adam and Eve.
2. Adam and Eve were beguiled by an evil entity in the Garden of Eden.
3. Having been beguiled they supposedly disobeyed God.
4. The God then saw it fit to physically punish the evil entity in a very cruel manner.
5. The God then also punished the woman Eve by cursing here with greatly multiplied pain and sorrow in childbirth.
6. The God decreed that the man shall rule over the woman and that the woman shall serve the desire of the man.
7. Both Adam and Eve were cast out of the Garden of Eden and since that time all humans have been "out of grace" with God.
Along the way:
1. All of mankind continued to disobey God and turn to evil.
2. God chose one man and his family to build a large boat to save the animal kingdom from drowning in a Great Flood that God would cause to drown out the sinners.
3. God then caused the Great Flood that drowned out the sinners.
Thus far nothing this God has done has solved the problem of sin. Mankind continues to sin and fall short of the glory of God.
The Savior Comes
1. Recognizing that mankind can never save himself from sin God sends his only begotten son to save mankind.
2. God does this by having his very own corrupt priests call for the brutal crucifixion of his son because this God only knows how to solve problems by having someone seriously hurt or injured in some way.
3. Now those who believe in this story and this "Son of God" will be saved from the wrath of this God and from their sins. Those who cannot believe this story are doomed to this God's damnation.
~~~~~~
As far as I can see, that's the story in a nutshell. Granted there are a lot of other stories along the way, but this is the crux of it.
I personally don't believe any of it, starting with the "Fall from Grace" in the Garden of Eden. I don't believe in the Great Flood story. And I don't believe that this God had his son brutally crucified to pay for the salvation of men.
I simply don't believe any of it.
For this I will supposedly be damned by this God. And if that's the case then so be it. If this is what this God is truly like I would prefer damnation over worshiping him for eternity anyway.
So that's my view on the Holy Bible.
My personal answer to this question:
I would sum up the message of the Christian Holy Bible as follows:
In the Beginning:
1. A God supposedly created two humans named Adam and Eve.
2. Adam and Eve were beguiled by an evil entity in the Garden of Eden.
3. Having been beguiled they supposedly disobeyed God.
4. The God then saw it fit to physically punish the evil entity in a very cruel manner.
5. The God then also punished the woman Eve by cursing here with greatly multiplied pain and sorrow in childbirth.
6. The God decreed that the man shall rule over the woman and that the woman shall serve the desire of the man.
7. Both Adam and Eve were cast out of the Garden of Eden and since that time all humans have been "out of grace" with God.
Along the way:
1. All of mankind continued to disobey God and turn to evil.
2. God chose one man and his family to build a large boat to save the animal kingdom from drowning in a Great Flood that God would cause to drown out the sinners.
3. God then caused the Great Flood that drowned out the sinners.
Thus far nothing this God has done has solved the problem of sin. Mankind continues to sin and fall short of the glory of God.
The Savior Comes
1. Recognizing that mankind can never save himself from sin God sends his only begotten son to save mankind.
2. God does this by having his very own corrupt priests call for the brutal crucifixion of his son because this God only knows how to solve problems by having someone seriously hurt or injured in some way.
3. Now those who believe in this story and this "Son of God" will be saved from the wrath of this God and from their sins. Those who cannot believe this story are doomed to this God's damnation.
~~~~~~
As far as I can see, that's the story in a nutshell. Granted there are a lot of other stories along the way, but this is the crux of it.
I personally don't believe any of it, starting with the "Fall from Grace" in the Garden of Eden. I don't believe in the Great Flood story. And I don't believe that this God had his son brutally crucified to pay for the salvation of men.
I simply don't believe any of it.
For this I will supposedly be damned by this God. And if that's the case then so be it. If this is what this God is truly like I would prefer damnation over worshiping him for eternity anyway.
So that's my view on the Holy Bible.
[center]
Spiritual Growth - A person's continual assessment
of how well they believe they are doing
relative to what they believe a personal God expects of them.
[/center]
Spiritual Growth - A person's continual assessment
of how well they believe they are doing
relative to what they believe a personal God expects of them.
[/center]
Post #3
The bible has paradoxical stories and is a message by God through people who had their complexity aspect unveiled which is evident through the right brain hemisphere of the brain(paradox/ambiguity aspect) being unveiled. Society has been for thousands of years plagued by a neurosis induced by discrimination against right brain hemisphere aspect and which emphasizes cognition over spiritual/philosophically just ideals. The message of repentance(neglecting baser desires for higher virtue) which is also in Buddhism is taught so that people can escape the psychological death(having cognitive part of the brain overshadowing the holistic/concentration aspect of the brain) known as samsara so they can reach nirvana(sound-mindedness). Moses was among tribesmen and they were, unlike Egyptians willing to accept him and were not neurotic because they did not take the 3 R's (Reading, Writing, Arithmetic) at an age where the frontal lobe was developed and taught in a way that is biased towards the right hemisphere of the brain.
What it comes down to is, society discriminates against the right hemisphere - Roger Wolcott Sperry.
When the right hemisphere is unveiled the powerhouse mental aspect is unveiled and the intuition becomes abnormal, sense of time fades, tolerance is higher and agape love increases and this is evident through higher gamma brain waves. The message of the Gospel is to believe in the Son of God(the Lord Yehoshua) not only in His existence but also to believe in what He taught. His philosophy of meekness, humility, kindness, love, altruism. seems impossible for people to do because of the effects of neurosis. The ancient scriptures were not translated well and that is due to people with the complexity aspect being veiled trying to interpret them.
An example of a person who is closer to reaching the state of nirvana would be a dyslexic, who learns not through linear teaching dominantly but through imagery and parables and such. In society they are looked down on but they are in contrast to the majority tolerant, and loving people.
The truth has been taught in many different countries under many cultures and unfortunately as in the past the majority of society is induced with neurosis, an idea which Sigmund Freud supported.
A cure for this neurosis would be ''submission'', following the eight-fold path or even to go so far as to ignore the strongest signal the hypothalamus could send you, the death signal. Isaac overcame that and was saved so to say, and this was portrayed in Hebrews 11:19. The death signal ignoring method would give the full measure and the result would be the hypothalamus giving signals only when there is a need for the signal. ''Whoever loves his life(is proud of the fact they are alive) will lose it(will die), but whoever hates his life(is suicidal while induced with neurosis) will preserve it(will have the neurosis cured).
Thank You - Augustine.
What it comes down to is, society discriminates against the right hemisphere - Roger Wolcott Sperry.
When the right hemisphere is unveiled the powerhouse mental aspect is unveiled and the intuition becomes abnormal, sense of time fades, tolerance is higher and agape love increases and this is evident through higher gamma brain waves. The message of the Gospel is to believe in the Son of God(the Lord Yehoshua) not only in His existence but also to believe in what He taught. His philosophy of meekness, humility, kindness, love, altruism. seems impossible for people to do because of the effects of neurosis. The ancient scriptures were not translated well and that is due to people with the complexity aspect being veiled trying to interpret them.
An example of a person who is closer to reaching the state of nirvana would be a dyslexic, who learns not through linear teaching dominantly but through imagery and parables and such. In society they are looked down on but they are in contrast to the majority tolerant, and loving people.
The truth has been taught in many different countries under many cultures and unfortunately as in the past the majority of society is induced with neurosis, an idea which Sigmund Freud supported.
A cure for this neurosis would be ''submission'', following the eight-fold path or even to go so far as to ignore the strongest signal the hypothalamus could send you, the death signal. Isaac overcame that and was saved so to say, and this was portrayed in Hebrews 11:19. The death signal ignoring method would give the full measure and the result would be the hypothalamus giving signals only when there is a need for the signal. ''Whoever loves his life(is proud of the fact they are alive) will lose it(will die), but whoever hates his life(is suicidal while induced with neurosis) will preserve it(will have the neurosis cured).
Thank You - Augustine.
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ChildofJesus
- Newbie
- Posts: 8
- Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2015 9:33 am
Post #4
[Replying to post 2 by Divine Insight]
To Love, have compassion, mercy in one's own heart to all others, giving greatly to people living in poverty, people in need, people of whom are disabled, the vulnerable, the Elderly, the addicted, general kindnesses expressed to others, a smile from the heart to others walking along and any positive good things done for others to assist them.
Many acts from the heart given to others, extinguishes, in God's Holy Will, a multitude of sins, if not blaspheming against God) and God's Holy Scriptures/His Bible teaches these things.
To obey God's Commandments of which includes 'to forgive all others including our enemies from our hearts'.
I am deeply sad that you believe the following You have posted:
The Savior Comes
1. Recognizing that mankind can never save himself from sin God sends his only begotten son to save mankind.
2. God does this by having his very own corrupt priests call for the brutal crucifixion of his son because this God only knows how to solve problems by having someone seriously hurt or injured in some way.
3. Now those who believe in this story and this "Son of God" will be saved from the wrath of this God and from their sins. Those who cannot believe this story are doomed to this God's damnation.
In my experience and opinion, Divine Insight, Jesus descended Himself from God The Most High and The Holy Spirit down to His Earth, to establish His Covenant to create His Divine Mercy - the Mercy God The Most High spoke about to His Apostles including Esdra/Ezra and others, BC. God stated that His Messiah would be forthcoming to give the world His Mercy. Jesus then descended to Earth and gave His Love, Mercy and Compassion to others, spreading God's Holy Word then guided by God, and to fulfil God's Holy Decree and Prophesy, for mankind to receive Jesus Christ our Saviour's Mercy, Divine Mercy at the time of death, He suffered His bitter Passion and Agonies so that...
When God The Most High is judging mankind without Mercy, He is looking right through Jesus' Holy Cross with Jesus manifested on His Cross in Heaven, in Sorrow for Jesus, His Son, and allows Jesus to give His Divine Mercy to Souls that are taken into Jesus' Abyss of Divine Mercy...Mercy.
Yet, Jesus delivered His Divine Mercy to Catholics, Saints/Nuns/Sisters with His Divine Mercy Chaplet - to Saint Faustina and to the world in so many of His ways, if people go back to reading what God stated in His Old Testament about "Mercy" then compare to what Jesus has stated within His Divine Mercy Holy messages, then every piece of a large jigsaw fits perfectly that Jesus died in order for mankind to receive His Two Holy Rays - one is Jesus' Red Holy Ray that shines forth from His Sacred Heart which is the life Blood of souls, and the other is the pale Ray on the Right Hand side shining forth that represents - is given to Souls for the Cleansing of sins. Many people have not read Jesus' Divine Mercy Holy messages within His Love for people/Souls and Jesus explains everything about the reasons for His dying.
What I cannot comprehend fully about people of whom are non-believers at different stages on their soul journeys is why, if they do not know for sure, do people not pray The Our Father and The Hail Mary to Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary, to allow Jesus to come into their hearts, to "receive" Jesus into their Hearts through the precise Prayers He gave mankind to "receive" Him now and eternally?
Just as Jesus did with His Heavenly Father to "receive" God speaking to His Heart.
Then with Love and Respect, non-believers declare they do not believe yet have not tried opening their hearts to "receive" Jesus in the first place? Similar to when I was raising my Children not praying not thinking about Jesus Himself and what this Man Jesus had endured while on earth. Was not thinking at all about Jesus Himself nor God, nor The Holy Spirit nor The Blessed Virgin Mary. Until I was dying. No life line, no back up plan to get me out of it, no-one to assist me, no-one whom really loved and cared at the time, no-one 'there' until...the Most powerful Prayer presented itself right in front of my screen...from up above! So many miracles in my life, so many happenings, so many incredible, Loving, Holy positive things within God's Loving Holy Blessings and Jesus healed me within ten days of praying daily to Him in complete Trust. His Gifts and Graces Divine Insight.
There was only one temporary traitor at the time being Judas of whom went away, wept bitterly in sorrow, because he loved Jesus, and took his own life. The remaining Disciples of whom were His priests Loved and supported Him. It was Jesus/God whom sent them away, with the exception of John whom was there with Jesus right until the end, then there for The Blessed Virgin Mary looking after Her. The Pharisees believed in God and were not Jesus/God's priests. Jesus had His Priests, His Disciples of whom all Loved Him, followed Him and then dedicated the remainder of their lives to bringing about the Good News, the New Testament, ensuring that it was available to mankind today in God's Holy Will.
Believing in Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit is attainable always through Prayer with The Sign of The Cross and The Our Father Prayer and Hail Mary's prayed, for Jesus/God to lead hearts coming closer to Him, Jesus being "received" into hearts and then guided to read His Holy Scripture with The Holy Spirit explaining through our hearts God's Holy Word.
I was not a reader of God's Holy Word when I received Jesus into my heart.
It has been the other way around.
Prayer to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit with The Sign of The Cross made while focussing on His bitter Passion in illustrations was done for the first 6 months which led to me repenting my sins to Jesus from my heart....so many sins....a lifetime of them....Jesus then guided me back to Holy Mass, then at times to read His Holy Word...then I asked for His Holy Callings in which Jesus/God gifted me quite a few years ago with many more to be accomplished by Him through me if I keep praying to Jesus and receiving Him daily, through Fasting three times a week, have cut out all junk in my life, most worldly things, rubbish, not committing mortal sins, repenting venial sins, keeping my heart mind soul and body clean and clear, focussing on Jesus, His Life, His bitter Passion while being guided by The Blessed Virgin Mary.
If I break some of those things:- Jesus cannot speak to my heart, because of blockage. The Blessed Virgin Mary does not speak to my heart until I repent the sins in my thoughts to Jesus. It takes a bit of time and effort; everything is worth sacrificing to receive Jesus into my heart and speaking to my heart.
No person/soul is damned eternally unless they have not turned to Jesus Christ our Saviour to receive Him. Now that can be done by saying sorry to Him for sins, going and receiving His Blessed Holy Eucharist in which Jesus is manifested in His Holy Host, present Himself at His Altar near His Blessed Sacrament and Holy Tabernacle, just as God The Most High told Esdra, Jesus told His Disciples and Saint Faustina in the 1930s. Jesus is also present in His confessional box...now I never knew these things growing up as a Catholic until I read Jesus' Holy messages to Saint Faustina.
Jesus has His Mercy for every one of His Children, You, others and myself.
Everyone.
What Jesus requests is for mankind to either pray His Divine Mercy Chaplet just once during their lives, even hardened sinners, He says, and/or turn to Him in Trust saying "Jesus, I Trust in You" every day throughout the day when one is able. Then allowing Jesus/God to move into our hearts.
/i]
May God Bless You on your Soul journey Divine Insight.
To Love, have compassion, mercy in one's own heart to all others, giving greatly to people living in poverty, people in need, people of whom are disabled, the vulnerable, the Elderly, the addicted, general kindnesses expressed to others, a smile from the heart to others walking along and any positive good things done for others to assist them.
Many acts from the heart given to others, extinguishes, in God's Holy Will, a multitude of sins, if not blaspheming against God) and God's Holy Scriptures/His Bible teaches these things.
To obey God's Commandments of which includes 'to forgive all others including our enemies from our hearts'.
I am deeply sad that you believe the following You have posted:
The Savior Comes
1. Recognizing that mankind can never save himself from sin God sends his only begotten son to save mankind.
2. God does this by having his very own corrupt priests call for the brutal crucifixion of his son because this God only knows how to solve problems by having someone seriously hurt or injured in some way.
3. Now those who believe in this story and this "Son of God" will be saved from the wrath of this God and from their sins. Those who cannot believe this story are doomed to this God's damnation.
In my experience and opinion, Divine Insight, Jesus descended Himself from God The Most High and The Holy Spirit down to His Earth, to establish His Covenant to create His Divine Mercy - the Mercy God The Most High spoke about to His Apostles including Esdra/Ezra and others, BC. God stated that His Messiah would be forthcoming to give the world His Mercy. Jesus then descended to Earth and gave His Love, Mercy and Compassion to others, spreading God's Holy Word then guided by God, and to fulfil God's Holy Decree and Prophesy, for mankind to receive Jesus Christ our Saviour's Mercy, Divine Mercy at the time of death, He suffered His bitter Passion and Agonies so that...
When God The Most High is judging mankind without Mercy, He is looking right through Jesus' Holy Cross with Jesus manifested on His Cross in Heaven, in Sorrow for Jesus, His Son, and allows Jesus to give His Divine Mercy to Souls that are taken into Jesus' Abyss of Divine Mercy...Mercy.
Yet, Jesus delivered His Divine Mercy to Catholics, Saints/Nuns/Sisters with His Divine Mercy Chaplet - to Saint Faustina and to the world in so many of His ways, if people go back to reading what God stated in His Old Testament about "Mercy" then compare to what Jesus has stated within His Divine Mercy Holy messages, then every piece of a large jigsaw fits perfectly that Jesus died in order for mankind to receive His Two Holy Rays - one is Jesus' Red Holy Ray that shines forth from His Sacred Heart which is the life Blood of souls, and the other is the pale Ray on the Right Hand side shining forth that represents - is given to Souls for the Cleansing of sins. Many people have not read Jesus' Divine Mercy Holy messages within His Love for people/Souls and Jesus explains everything about the reasons for His dying.
What I cannot comprehend fully about people of whom are non-believers at different stages on their soul journeys is why, if they do not know for sure, do people not pray The Our Father and The Hail Mary to Jesus and The Blessed Virgin Mary, to allow Jesus to come into their hearts, to "receive" Jesus into their Hearts through the precise Prayers He gave mankind to "receive" Him now and eternally?
Just as Jesus did with His Heavenly Father to "receive" God speaking to His Heart.
Then with Love and Respect, non-believers declare they do not believe yet have not tried opening their hearts to "receive" Jesus in the first place? Similar to when I was raising my Children not praying not thinking about Jesus Himself and what this Man Jesus had endured while on earth. Was not thinking at all about Jesus Himself nor God, nor The Holy Spirit nor The Blessed Virgin Mary. Until I was dying. No life line, no back up plan to get me out of it, no-one to assist me, no-one whom really loved and cared at the time, no-one 'there' until...the Most powerful Prayer presented itself right in front of my screen...from up above! So many miracles in my life, so many happenings, so many incredible, Loving, Holy positive things within God's Loving Holy Blessings and Jesus healed me within ten days of praying daily to Him in complete Trust. His Gifts and Graces Divine Insight.
There was only one temporary traitor at the time being Judas of whom went away, wept bitterly in sorrow, because he loved Jesus, and took his own life. The remaining Disciples of whom were His priests Loved and supported Him. It was Jesus/God whom sent them away, with the exception of John whom was there with Jesus right until the end, then there for The Blessed Virgin Mary looking after Her. The Pharisees believed in God and were not Jesus/God's priests. Jesus had His Priests, His Disciples of whom all Loved Him, followed Him and then dedicated the remainder of their lives to bringing about the Good News, the New Testament, ensuring that it was available to mankind today in God's Holy Will.
Believing in Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit is attainable always through Prayer with The Sign of The Cross and The Our Father Prayer and Hail Mary's prayed, for Jesus/God to lead hearts coming closer to Him, Jesus being "received" into hearts and then guided to read His Holy Scripture with The Holy Spirit explaining through our hearts God's Holy Word.
I was not a reader of God's Holy Word when I received Jesus into my heart.
It has been the other way around.
Prayer to Jesus/God/The Holy Spirit with The Sign of The Cross made while focussing on His bitter Passion in illustrations was done for the first 6 months which led to me repenting my sins to Jesus from my heart....so many sins....a lifetime of them....Jesus then guided me back to Holy Mass, then at times to read His Holy Word...then I asked for His Holy Callings in which Jesus/God gifted me quite a few years ago with many more to be accomplished by Him through me if I keep praying to Jesus and receiving Him daily, through Fasting three times a week, have cut out all junk in my life, most worldly things, rubbish, not committing mortal sins, repenting venial sins, keeping my heart mind soul and body clean and clear, focussing on Jesus, His Life, His bitter Passion while being guided by The Blessed Virgin Mary.
If I break some of those things:- Jesus cannot speak to my heart, because of blockage. The Blessed Virgin Mary does not speak to my heart until I repent the sins in my thoughts to Jesus. It takes a bit of time and effort; everything is worth sacrificing to receive Jesus into my heart and speaking to my heart.
No person/soul is damned eternally unless they have not turned to Jesus Christ our Saviour to receive Him. Now that can be done by saying sorry to Him for sins, going and receiving His Blessed Holy Eucharist in which Jesus is manifested in His Holy Host, present Himself at His Altar near His Blessed Sacrament and Holy Tabernacle, just as God The Most High told Esdra, Jesus told His Disciples and Saint Faustina in the 1930s. Jesus is also present in His confessional box...now I never knew these things growing up as a Catholic until I read Jesus' Holy messages to Saint Faustina.
Jesus has His Mercy for every one of His Children, You, others and myself.
Everyone.
What Jesus requests is for mankind to either pray His Divine Mercy Chaplet just once during their lives, even hardened sinners, He says, and/or turn to Him in Trust saying "Jesus, I Trust in You" every day throughout the day when one is able. Then allowing Jesus/God to move into our hearts.
/i]
May God Bless You on your Soul journey Divine Insight.
