Does porn cause harm?

[juliod]

It's been a long time since I've debated pornography. But it used to be a staple during my early internet days.

Some posters here occasionally refer to porn as it it were understood to be a Bad Thing. So I think we should debate the point.

My claim is that porn has been studied extensively since the 70's, and the harm attributable to porn is still zero.

DanZ

[Cathar1950]

I think sex is unnatural if it is done right. No, that is dirty if it is done right.
I think snail have it together. They just run along happy and get it on when they run across another snail. Other wise they are all by themselves. Have you ever seen snails having sex? It is disgusting in a kinky sort of way.

[Cephus]

I think that is the point Cephus. They are divorced from reality.
These born again virgins are not virgins. The ones that are trying to practice abstanace end up doing the human thing and being in denial and lacking sex education.
I didn't say it made sense.

Oh, that I agree with. It's like those people who are signing the abstinence pledges and being a lot worse off because of it. They might hold off on sex longer, but once they actually do start, they go hog wild and have more partners and unprotected sex than they would have otherwise.

These fundamentalists are going to have to get it through their head that sex is natural, and at some level, people are going to have it no matter what silly religious ideas they have about sex. That doesn't mean we shouldn't teach responsibility in sex (which frankly, far too few people have), but to ignore it and be afraid of it entirely is just downright stupid.

[Cathar1950]

Some time the don't go hag wild some times they just "slip" or "give in", what ever they do.
It does seem they should take some responsiblity which includes awareness.
It is easy to say now that I am much older. When I was young I wanted to nap after, now I just want the nap.
Nothing like raging hormones to keep you awake.
I did get kicked out of sex education when I was in High School for telling a joke. They let me come back in for the VD flicks. I am sure they regret it.
I made up for it in college. Did some post graduate work and even had all the requirements to identify and treat sexual problems.
I tend to think sex problems are a human(and animal) thing in a repressed culture including many historical influences. Much is just poor upbringing and parents that infuse a disgust and guilt to their children. Hardly healthy in my opinion. But responsiblity like other things is always welcomed.

[1John2_26]

I'm waiting to hand out a Darwin Award for the first person to argue that sex is unnatural.

I'll present the other award that can prove that sex is not for offspring in Darwinian science.

The survival of a species, where the male of that species depositis its sperm on the mammary glands of the female of that species, is extinct in a very short time.

I also believe, if I remember biology correctly, that the throat and stomach have nothing to do with human sexual organs, since neither an ovum or sperm have any reason to be in either places.

It seems porn certainly is misleading. Reducing women to bady parts for the release of the human males ejaculate also seems a bit off the mark, as it were.

I firmly believe that porn has caused the harm to so many children and women living without fathers and husbands. One thing leads to the other. It's a tough call but the road of evidence is heading in one direction.

Porn causes mush harm. Let us not forget date rapes.

[McCulloch]

The survival of a species, where the male of that species depositis its sperm on the mammary glands of the female of that species, is extinct in a very short time.

You would be right it that was the exclusive sexual activity of the species. However, you seem to miss the point that humans and other mammals seem to engage in a variety of sexual activities, some of which lead to reproduction. Is there any danger that we are running low in the area of reproductive capacity as a species?
We also engage in many activities associated with eating which do not serve the digestive needs of the species. What is the point here? How does that relate to the question for debate?

Closer to being on topic,

It seems porn certainly is misleading. Reducing women to bady parts for the release of the human males ejaculate also seems a bit off the mark, as it were.

I firmly believe that porn has caused the harm to so many children and women living without fathers and husbands. One thing leads to the other. It's a tough call but the road of evidence is heading in one direction.

Porn causes mu[c]h harm. Let us not forget date rapes.

My understanding of 1John's list of harm caused by porn:

• Porn causes men to view women as objects rather than as people.
• Porn leads to masterbation which reduces reproductive capacity.
• Porn leads to divorce, widowhood and orphans.
• Porn causes date rape.

[juliod]

I'll present the other award that can prove that sex is not for offspring in Darwinian science.

I'm glad you accept evolution, but I don't think you've quite grasped all the implications. Biologically speaking there will always be an "excess" of sex drive. This is so that populations will increase rapidly when conditions are favorable. But this also means that when conditions are unfavorable the population tends to grow too high. (Remember Malthus: populations increase faster than the food supply.)

So the alternatives are mass starvation (favored by the theists) or attenuation of the reproductive potential. In this light, masturbation and no-procreative sex are essential for the survival of the species. In other words, they are parfectly natural.

It seems porn certainly is misleading.

On the contrary, porn is truth. Pornography is an exemplification rather than a representation. Representations may be false, but exemplifications are always true. review your philosophy of art textbooks!

Reducing women to bady parts

"bady parts" I couldn't have written something so Freudian if I tried.

Anyway, arguments about "objectification" don't carry any weight. No one has ever defined exactly what they mean by that, nor have they shown that it is harmful even if it were true.

One thing leads to the other.

Yeah. And porn leads to masturbation, not to unwanted children.

It's a tough call but the road of evidence is heading in one direction.

That direction is "porn does not cause harm". We are still waiting the first publication showing a link between porn and any form of harm.

DanZ

[1John2_26]

My understanding of 1John's list of harm caused by porn:

Porn causes men to view women as objects rather than as people.

That is true.

Porn leads to masterbation which reduces reproductive capacity.

That is wrong. It leads to more sperm production and an addiction to porn and the devaluing of women as just ejaculation devices and not the viewing of them as other people.

Porn leads to divorce, widowhood and orphans.

That is true.

Porn causes date rape.

That is true.

[1John2_26]

Quote:
I'll present the other award that can prove that sex is not for offspring in Darwinian science.


I'm glad you accept evolution, but I don't think you've quite grasped all the implications.

I grasp that evolution makes sexual deviants out to be idiots, worthless and/or worse. I accept evolution as a word. I do not believe we are apes version 06. That myth is for perverts and sociopaths with chairs at Oxford and Harvard.

Biologically speaking there will always be an "excess" of sex drive.

And . . . that is the only reason in nature why males hump other males. Unreasoning beasts that is.

This is so that populations will increase rapidly when conditions are favorable. But this also means that when conditions are unfavorable the population tends to grow too high. (Remember Malthus: populations increase faster than the food supply.)

It still proves that deviants are deviants. I love science don't you?

So the alternatives are mass starvation (favored by the theists) or attenuation of the reproductive potential.

Typical socoipathic mind of the garden-variety atheist.

In this light, masturbation and no-procreative sex are essential for the survival of the species. In other words, they are parfectly natural.

Larry Flynt would be so proud of your convoluted morality. Too bad women aren't happy being masterbated into. Not many women seem to buy into being an object for an ejacualtion. You have read some of their magazines haven't you? Without being paid, women would just be drawings on a wall for the "express" purposes of guys to relieve themsleves by.

Quote:
It seems porn certainly is misleading.

On the contrary, porn is truth. Pornography is an exemplification rather than a representation. Representations may be false, but exemplifications are always true. review your philosophy of art textbooks!

I love it when you prove my point about sexual deviants being so evil.

Quote:
Reducing women to bady parts

"bady parts" I couldn't have written something so Freudian if I tried.

In a structured debate, when you get gleeful over your opponents phonetic (or in this case typographical) error you look unintellectual.

Anyway, arguments about "objectification" don't carry any weight. No one has ever defined exactly what they mean by that, nor have they shown that it is harmful even if it were true.

And you proved it.

Quote:
One thing leads to the other.

Yeah. And porn leads to masturbation, not to unwanted children.

You must live on another planet. Nearly 50-million abortions in just the US alone since Roe v Wade pal.

Quote:
It's a tough call but the road of evidence is heading in one direction.

That direction is "porn does not cause harm".

It seems that the real world has a difference of opinion than you do.

We are still waiting the first publication showing a link between porn and any form of harm.

I believe it is called the Penal Code. What did Ted Bundy say shortly before he was executed for mass murder of women?

He was addicted to porn.

I can't tell Ted Bundy to go to hell. He is dead.

Child molesters are also addicted to porn.

[Wyvern]

I grasp that evolution makes sexual deviants out to be idiots, worthless and/or worse. I accept evolution as a word. I do not believe we are apes version 06. That myth is for perverts and sociopaths with chairs at Oxford and Harvard.

Well you have just demonstrated that you have little if any understanding of evolution. Man is not just a different version of an ape, go back far enough and there might very well be a verifiable common ancestor, but then you are relying on luck to find that common descendant since the fossil record is hit or miss dependant on the geology of the area. Lets go with logic shall we, and it is not logical to assume that everything is has and will be the same for all time, considering how things change over time. Oops just gave the definition of evolution.
You are being ridiculous John, yet again.

Biologically speaking there will always be an "excess" of sex drive.

And . . . that is the only reason in nature why males hump other males. Unreasoning beasts that is.

Does that mean that you see homosexuals as being especially virile?

It still proves that deviants are deviants. I love science don't you?

For a guy that holds psychology in such low esteem you sure do like throwing around their terms when it suits you.

Larry Flynt would be so proud of your convoluted morality. Too bad women aren't happy being masterbated into. Not many women seem to buy into being an object for an ejacualtion. You have read some of their magazines haven't you? Without being paid, women would just be drawings on a wall for the "express" purposes of guys to relieve themsleves by.

An anti-capitalist view from a right wing republican, you better report yourself to your leaders for re-education. Sorry but you need to choose which is more important, morality or capitalism you can't have both without severe restrictions on one or the other. Which to choose, hmm?

"bady parts" I couldn't have written something so Freudian if I tried.

In a structured debate, when you get gleeful over your opponents phonetic (or in this case typographical) error you look unintellectual.

Nearly the textbook definition for a Freudian slip, you make a mistake that ends up saying what you actually mean.

Yeah. And porn leads to masturbation, not to unwanted children.

You must live on another planet. Nearly 50-million abortions in just the US alone since Roe v Wade pal.

Wow, think how overloaded the orphanages would be if abortions and masterbation weren't legal. Considering how many children are sexually abused now think how bad it would be with fifty million children noone wanted or really cared about. You people never seem to come up with solutions for the problems you want to create.

What did Ted Bundy say shortly before he was executed for mass murder of women?

Another thing you must be obsessed about, I have no idea or care what his last words were

He was addicted to porn.

Can you actually prove this or is this yet another one of your unsubstantiated claims?

Child molesters are also addicted to porn.

Again can you prove this or is this yet another unsubstantiated claim?

[Cathar1950]

Even if they were addicted to porn, because some one addicted to porn does not make them a child molester or a T.Bundy. You have committed some major fallacy and I am to tired to look it up or remember.

That myth is for perverts and sociopaths with chairs at Oxford and Harvard.

Can you show any of them to be sociopaths or perverts? Or do you think only pervert and sociopaths should have the chairs?