The Bible is not the word of God

[DrProctopus]

A bunch of people who believed that God was talking to them wrote down what they believed God was saying.

The more relevant or successful scriptures were kept and eventually composed into the OT.

Something similar happend after Jesus did his thing, and the NT was produced.


Nowhere in this process do I see any reason to believe that every single word in the Bible is the word of God. Why should I believe someone when they claim to speak for God?

So, the point of debate is this:

Is there actually any decent reason to believe that the Bible is 100% the word of God?

[joer]

OK Thanks QED!

[Cephus]

So debating whether or not the Bible is the word of an unproven deity is really pretty silly.

OK. But even assuming a God, is there any reason to believe that the Bible has been verbally inspired by such a being as the Christian conception of God?

Nope. It's just as likely that it was inspired by someone's dog. Actually, that's more likely because at least we know dogs exist.

Now can we debate "The Bible is not the word of Dog"?

[1John2_26]

Nope. It's just as likely that it was inspired by someone's dog. Actually, that's more likely because at least we know dogs exist.

Now can we debate "The Bible is not the word of Dog"?

How utterly offensive. So typical of the mindless perspective.

You don't see a Christian like me saying atheists and anti-Christian secularists are idiots believing literally in "non" sense.

OK I guess I do come across as doing that maybe. I'm sorry and I apologize. To some of you.

OK. But even assuming a God, is there any reason to believe that the Bible has been verbally inspired by such a being as the Christian conception of God?

Yes.

The text of the Bible is ruthlessly honest in its presentation of itself and for believing in the peoples it offers. Its God does not hide either.

[Cephus]

How utterly offensive. So typical of the mindless perspective.

Then you should stop holding the mindless perspective. Faith is without rational thought by it's very nature.

You don't see a Christian like me saying atheists and anti-Christian secularists are idiots believing literally in "non" sense.

Yes I do, every single day.

The text of the Bible is ruthlessly honest in its presentation of itself and for believing in the peoples it offers. Its God does not hide either.

Then maybe you'd like to trot this God that does not hide out for everyone to see. We'll be waiting.

[QED]

You don't see a Christian like me saying atheists and anti-Christian secularists are idiots believing literally in "non" sense.

Is it nonsense to demand that some claim or other be falsifiable in principle? Say someone tells you that after we die we go on a world cruise on an invisible magic carpet -- is it nonsense to reject this claim unless it can either be falsified in some way or shown to be true?

The text of the Bible is ruthlessly honest in its presentation of itself and for believing in the peoples it offers. Its God does not hide either.

I can't easily parse that first sentence but the second is even more confusing. You like to trot out your 0x1 example, but you never seem to stop and consider how if there can be an uncaused God, there might be such a thing as an uncasued universe. Isn't it simply naive to conjure-up an intelligent creator of all things to account for the existence of everything? It's all to easy to look at ourselves as creators on a puny scale and then blow this up to cosmic proportions, but this is a very superficial analogy.

Perhaps we don't see "a Christian like you saying atheists and anti-Christian secularists are idiots believing literally in "non" sense" because you sneak a peek now and then at some of the debates here relating to cosmology and the Anthropic Principle where the ambiguities of the world become readily apparent. The classic example is the apparent fine-tuning of the physical constants that determine whether or not organic life can exist. If this is the only universe, then it's a bit of a mystery how things got to be the way they are (although that's not to say that a Grand Unified Theory couldn't resolve this as some sort of necessity). But as soon as we introduce the notion of there being more than one universe (there are dozens of different theories postulating multiple universes in various configurations) then we can expect to find ourselves in just this sort of universe, much in the same way as we find ourselves on this planet breathing oxygen. Oxygen is a requirement for organisms with high metabolic rates (to support complex thinking equipment) -- so if we can think we force the planet to have a particular atmosphere. This is just a cute way of saying that it didn't take an outside agency to set things up -- so long as there were enough planets with enough variables to allow one or more to exist in this way, then that's where we'll find ourselves.

In the light of such ambiguities (not to forget intelligent design vs. evolution) all you can do is hold to your bible stories which, to me, have the unmistakable ring of pre-industrialised minds making their best guess at things -- in the absence of a great deal of contradictory data gathered ever since.

[Aristarkos]

Is there actually any decent reason to believe that the Bible is 100% the word of God?

Great topic. At the heart of most issues between Christians and non-Christians is the question of Biblical authority.

The bible has many accounts of the supernatural. These type of events and abilities are not seen today. Even the writing of the book is supposed to be inspired by God in some supernatural way. How else would it be considered the Word of God? Apparently that level of supernatural inspiration is no longer available today.

What seems constantly abundant in the world, however, are examples of people lying, exaggerating, rationalizing, and being gullible. People who are insecure seem eager to grab on to something that makes them feel safe. They are attracted to ideologies that provide all the answers, and they are not eager to question the premise … if there is one. Instead rationalizations are subconsciously welcomed and there’s no looking back.

The Bible, in part, is a source of wisdom, but why idolize it? Some seem to place their faith in it … as if it were God. If you use your imagination, you realize that GOD could come up with a better way to communicate. As Mark Twain says, “You cannot depend on your judgment when your imagination is out of focus.” Don’t let insecurities effect your imagination and intelligence. Question everything.

[Easyrider]

The bible has many accounts of the supernatural. These type of events and abilities are not seen today.

There's any number of healing ministries around the world - some false, many real. I'd say that is supernatural.

The Bible, in part, is a source of wisdom, but why idolize it? Some seem to place their faith in it … as if it were God.

I've been around Christianity a long time. And never in any instance have I ever seen anyone worship a Bible. Yeah, most hold it in very high regard as the Word of God, but I've never seen anyone bow down to it or claim it (rather than the object of the book - God / Jesus) can save anyone.

[McCulloch]

There's any number of healing ministries around the world - some false, many real. I'd say that is supernatural.

I've seen evidence of the false ones. Have any of the alleged real ones been proven objectively?

[Aristarkos]

There's any number of healing ministries around the world - some false, many real. I'd say that is supernatural.

If something supernatural is going on why isn’t it in the news? It should be a huge deal. Why doesn’t everyone know about it? If it happens so much we should have undeniable proof. Maybe you should work on that.

I've been around Christianity a long time. And never in any instance have I ever seen anyone worship a Bible. Yeah, most hold it in very high regard as the Word of God, but I've never seen anyone bow down to it or claim it (rather than the object of the book - God / Jesus) can save anyone.

I didn’t say “worship”. I’m referring to literalists that can’t see the big picture, and those that think “The Word” (John 1) is the Bible. They think it’s infallible and perfect.

[Cephus]

There's any number of healing ministries around the world - some false, many real. I'd say that is supernatural.

Oh really? Let's see where any of them have been demonstrated to be real scientifically. We'll wait for your peer-reviewed sources on this.