Lying for Islam

[McCulloch]

Lying for Islam.

In recent debates, deliberate falsehoods have been presented by proponents of Islam. Now, I am willing to admit that the debater here may not have been trying to deceive us, but simply passing on what he thought was correct information while neglecting to even perform a simple check of the facts. So the responsibility for the deception may be in his sources. The source cited was Kavkaz-Center on materials of Islamic internet MASS MEDIA. According to Answering Islam, this hoax has been disseminated (and continues to be) by Waqf Ikhlas, Istanbul and Al-Furqan-Ta-Ha.

Jacques Cousteau, Will Smith, Neil Armstrong, Michael Jackson, Maurice Bucaille, King Offa of Mercia, Abdu'l-Ahad Dawud (Professor David Benjamin Keldani), who Muslims falsely claim was a former Catholic Bishop and The Coptic Cardinal Abu Ishaq have all been subject to false claims of conversion to Islam.

I will admit my ignorance about many of the teachings of Islam. I know that Judaism, Christianity and Humanism all claim to value the importance of intellectual honesty.

The question for debate is, does Islam allow, encourage or tolerate lying and fabrication for the benefit of Islam?

[Catharsis]

>>>The question for debate is, does Islam allow, encourage or tolerate lying and fabrication for the benefit of Islam?<<<

Sira, p367: Then he {Kab bin al-Ashraf} composed amatory verses of an insulting nature about the Muslim women. The Apostle said: "Who will rid me of Ibnul-Ashraf?" Muhammad bin Maslama, brother of the Bani Abdu'l-Ashhal, said, "I will deal with him for you, O Apostle of God, I will kill him." He said, "Do so if you can." "All that is incumbent upon you is that you should try" {said the Prophet to Muhammad bin Maslama}. He said, "O Apostle of God, we shall have to tell lies." He {the Prophet} answered, "Say what you like, for you are free in the matter."

Any commentary is superfluous.

http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... php?t=7580

[carolineislands]

Google al-taqiyya. It's a principal of Islam that basically means that it's okay to lie and deceive if it's for a good reason.

[Goat]

Google al-taqiyya. It's a principal of Islam that basically means that it's okay to lie and deceive if it's for a good reason.

There is a difference in hiding ones personal beliefs to escape prosecution.

It is another thing to deliberately lie to try to convert people

[carolineislands]

I can tell you from personal experience that some (perhaps many) Muslims will lie and twist the truth to convert people because it was done to me. I was on the verge of converting until I started doing my own reading and questioning. After I said their little statement of faith, the truth started coming out. That's when I'd ask questions about things like execution for apostates and started getting straight answers like, "That is the rule set down by the Prophet (BIHWS)." That's when many things started coming to light that were never told to me truthfully when I was potential convert -- then it was all sugar coated cover ups and, well -- lies. There's really no other word for it.

So, I can't tell you if it's common all over the world but it happened to me. And it happened to a friend of mine too. That's only two instances, but they're very real and personal.

For what it's worth.

[Goat]

I can tell you from personal experience that some (perhaps many) Muslims will lie and twist the truth to convert people because it was done to me. I was on the verge of converting until I started doing my own reading and questioning. After I said their little statement of faith, the truth started coming out. That's when I'd ask questions about things like execution for apostates and started getting straight answers like, "That is the rule set down by the Prophet (BIHWS)." That's when many things started coming to light that were never told to me truthfully when I was potential convert -- then it was all sugar coated cover ups and, well -- lies. There's really no other word for it.

So, I can't tell you if it's common all over the world but it happened to me. And it happened to a friend of mine too. That's only two instances, but they're very real and personal.

For what it's worth.

I have seen the same pattern develop with Christian missionaries trying to convert Jews.

[Ms_Maryam]

The question for debate is, does Islam allow, encourage or tolerate lying and fabrication for the benefit of Islam?

no

[McCulloch]

The question for debate is, does Islam allow, encourage or tolerate lying and fabrication for the benefit of Islam?

no

Thank you for the unambiguous monosyllabic answer.

That would imply then that Waqf Ikhlas, Al-Furqan-Ta-Ha, the Kavkaz-Center and others who present deliberate falsehoods in support of Islam are, in fact, a disgrace and embarrassment to Islam. Given the fate of those who attempt to disgrace Islam, that is a mighty dangerous position to hold.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

Google al-taqiyya. It's a principal of Islam that basically means that it's okay to lie and deceive if it's for a good reason.

“…and Bingo was his name!�

Muslims see the ‘heart’ as the centre of faith and true belief comes from the heart. Taqiyya comes from the tongue only, and to deceive others in the name of Islâm will not shake the muslim’s faith because it does not come from the heart. This opinion comes from ibn Abbas, renowned by Sunnis as one of the most trusted narrators. He went on to say: “al-Taqiyya is the uttering of the tongue, while the heart is comfortable with faith.�

[Ilias Ahmad]

Taqiyya is hiding your religion for the purpose of escaping persecution. This is a doctrine exclusive to Shi'aism and has nothing to do with Orthodox Sunni Islam. Our Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa salam) said that never to worship idols or false gods, even if you are being burned alive.

The only time when it is allowed to lie or deceive in Islam is during war. Our Prophet (sallallahu alaihi wa salam) said war is deception. This is the only example when it is moral to lie or deceive.