Is There Really a Hell?

[Richard Aberdeen]

According to astrophysicist Neil DeGrasse Tyson, there is a certain type of black hole located within dark voids in the universe, where there is no light for many light years in every direction. This type of black hole, according to Tyson, contains an inner "sea of fire", left over from the stars it long ago consumed. According to NASA, the Encyclopedia Britannica and the late Stephen Hawking, among many other scientists, a black hole is a "bottomless pit" that theoretically digs forever.

The Bible says that hell is located in "outer darkness" Matthew 8:12 and is a "bottomless pit" Revelation 9:11, containing a "lake of fire" Revelation 20:14. Many people long questioned how something containing a lake of fire could be located in outer darkness and even more difficult to believe, be a bottomless pit, from which no one can escape. Now we know. Jesus says in Luke 16:26, that no human can pass from heaven to hades or from hades to heaven. Those who mock the Bible invariably, eventually end up eating crow. . .or worse.

Many question whether a loving God would cast someone forever into hell. Such folks rarely pause to consider what our sins cost God, in the sacrifice of his only begotten son. We hear reports of parents weeping at the bedside of their child who has cancer or has been in a horrific accident, crying "if only I could take my child's place!" We have no idea how God must have felt when his only son was nailed to a Roman cross and, we likely never will even begin to grasp what our sins cost God Almighty.

There is great reward for accepting forgiveness for our sins from Jesus. And there is a great penalty for refusing to do so.

[OneJack]

Yes, Ezek 28:12-19, while initially addressing the King of Tyre, is interpreted as symbolic account of Satan’s fall, referencing his previous state as a blameless, anointed cherub was in Eden, the garden of God.
Ezek 28:13 – The phrase “in Eden” the garden of God, is a key indicator that the passage is not simply about a human ruler.
Ezek 28:14 – And the description of the subject as an “anointed cherub” further points to a heavenly being, not a king. As fallen angels has the power to transform themselves to what they are not, this point to Satan OneJack.
If not, was the King of Tyre recorded in the Bible or taught by your spirit as was in Eden? OneJack?

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack don't take the easy way out and say, "It's a metaphor." That's a back door excuse. If it's a metaphor, please tell us what "being in the garden of God represents in your metaphor, what being covered in every precious stone represents; what the "tabrets and pipes that were prepared for him represent; what the anointed cherub represents; what having been set on the Holy Mountain of God represents; what walking up and down in the midst of the stones of fire represents; what being perfect in his ways represents; -----------. Please explain to us what they mean, using the Bible of course

Using the Bible alone, it is evident that the Lord God did not elaborate what He meant to say to the ruler of Tyre symbolically or metaphorically, why ask me for the meaning of it when I’m not the Lord God who described the ruler of Tyre in such manner?

Sure, the Lord elaborated: He tells us the serpent was in the Garden of God in heaven, that he was covered in the riches of heaven, he was the anointed cherub, and stood before the throne of God, that he was perfect in his ways, until iniquity (pride) festered from him. Isaiah tells us about his pride; his beauty corrupted his wisdom.

That was God's description to the ruler of Tyre, not to a real cherub, wasn't it?

Isaiah 14:13, He said to the Lord, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt MY throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, --- - I will be like the Most High."

This is another verse that does not refer to God's description of the ruler of Tyre, but to warnings to the king of Babylon. Why are you guys fond of adding your opinions to the alleged copies of copies of the utterances of the Lord God in the days of old?

[OneJack]

[Replying to Mr E in post #50]

In Ezekiel 28, Ezekiel is speaking directly to this physical King-- vs 1-10.

What a play on words here, Mr. E. Let's see if there is truth in what you're whining at here skewedly in the following verses, to wit:

1.The word of the Lord came to me:
2 “Son of man, say to the ruler of Tyre, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says:
‘In the pride of your heart you say, “I am a god; I sit on the throne of a god in the heart of the seas.”
But you are a mere mortal and not a god, though you think you are as wise as a god.
3 Are you wiser than Daniel? Is no secret hidden from you?
4 By your wisdom and understanding you have gained wealth for yourself and amassed gold and silver
in your treasuries.
5 By your great skill in trading you have increased your wealth, and because of your wealth
your heart has grown proud.
6 “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: “‘Because you think you are wise,
as wise as a god,
7 I am going to bring foreigners against you, the most ruthless of nations; they will draw their swords against your beauty and wisdom
and pierce your shining splendor.
8 They will bring you down to the pit, and you will die a violent death in the heart of the seas.
9 Will you then say, “I am a god,” in the presence of those who kill you?
You will be but a mortal, not a god, in the hands of those who slay you.
10 You will die the death of the uncircumcised at the hands of foreigners.
I have spoken, declares the Sovereign Lord.’”

Ezekiel was not speaking to the ruler of Tyre in verses 1 to 10 above; rather, the Lord was speaking to Ezekiel, commanding him to tell the ruler of Tyre the narratives He had spoken to him (Ezekiel). Where did you get the idea of a cosmic sense, addressing no longer the human king, but the spirit of this (with Baal) King? Why add opinions to alleged copies of copies of God's utterance to Ezekiel in this context?

Then in the following verses, Ezekiel speaks in a more cosmic sense, addressing no longer the human king, but the spirit of this (with Baal) King... pointing out that it's the same spirit that fell from heaven that is present in this King. He's obviously speaking past the King, and referencing the satanic spiritual power that motivates him to do the evil things he does.

You're fabricating your own notion here that is full of lies. Why would you insinuate Ezekiel spoke in a more cosmic sense when the Lord was the one speaking to Ezekiel about the things that the Lord wanted Ezekiel to tell the ruler of Tyre?

11 The word of the Lord came to me:
12 “Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says:
‘You were the seal of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone adorned you: carnelian, chrysolite and emerald, topaz, onyx and jasper,
lapis lazuli, turquoise and beryl. Your settings and mountings[c] were made of gold; on the day you were created they were prepared.
14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub, for so I ordained you. You were on the holy mount of God; you walked among the fiery stones.
15 You were blameless in your ways from the day you were created till wickedness was found in you.
16 Through your widespread trade you were filled with violence, and you sinned. So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God, and I
expelled you, guardian cherub, from among the fiery stones.

[Capbook]

The second death is not for the flesh but for the spirit; hence, the death penalty for the spirit, which will be the eternal punishment and gnashing of the teeth.

May we know who do you believe who these verses referred to OneJack?
The one who was in Eden, called the anointed cherub, who were blameless until unrighteousness was found in him.

The Ruler of Tyre.

Yes, Ezek 28:12-19, while initially addressing the King of Tyre, is interpreted as symbolic account of Satan’s fall, referencing his previous state as a blameless, anointed cherub was in Eden, the garden of God.
Ezek 28:13 – The phrase “in Eden” the garden of God, is a key indicator that the passage is not simply about a human ruler.
Ezek 28:14 – And the description of the subject as an “anointed cherub” further points to a heavenly being, not a king. As fallen angels has the power to transform themselves to what they are not, this point to Satan OneJack.
If not, was the King of Tyre recorded in the Bible or taught by your spirit as was in Eden? OneJack?

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

[OneJack]

May we know who do you believe who these verses referred to OneJack?
The one who was in Eden, called the anointed cherub, who were blameless until unrighteousness was found in him.

The Ruler of Tyre.

Yes, Ezek 28:12-19, while initially addressing the King of Tyre, is interpreted as symbolic account of Satan’s fall, referencing his previous state as a blameless, anointed cherub was in Eden, the garden of God.
Ezek 28:13 – The phrase “in Eden” the garden of God, is a key indicator that the passage is not simply about a human ruler.
Ezek 28:14 – And the description of the subject as an “anointed cherub” further points to a heavenly being, not a king. As fallen angels has the power to transform themselves to what they are not, this point to Satan OneJack.
If not, was the King of Tyre recorded in the Bible or taught by your spirit as was in Eden? OneJack?

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

I think you have to settle your issue with God Himself; He was the one who commanded Ezekiel to tell that to the ruler of Tyre.

[Capbook]

The Ruler of Tyre.

Yes, Ezek 28:12-19, while initially addressing the King of Tyre, is interpreted as symbolic account of Satan’s fall, referencing his previous state as a blameless, anointed cherub was in Eden, the garden of God.
Ezek 28:13 – The phrase “in Eden” the garden of God, is a key indicator that the passage is not simply about a human ruler.
Ezek 28:14 – And the description of the subject as an “anointed cherub” further points to a heavenly being, not a king. As fallen angels has the power to transform themselves to what they are not, this point to Satan OneJack.
If not, was the King of Tyre recorded in the Bible or taught by your spirit as was in Eden? OneJack?

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

I think you have to settle your issue with God Himself; He was the one who commanded Ezekiel to tell that to the ruler of Tyre.

No, I think it is you that have an issue against God's word OneJack, The mentioned word is "cherub" the angelic being, you don't agree, you insist "cherub' as human.

[OneJack]

Yes, Ezek 28:12-19, while initially addressing the King of Tyre, is interpreted as symbolic account of Satan’s fall, referencing his previous state as a blameless, anointed cherub was in Eden, the garden of God.
Ezek 28:13 – The phrase “in Eden” the garden of God, is a key indicator that the passage is not simply about a human ruler.
Ezek 28:14 – And the description of the subject as an “anointed cherub” further points to a heavenly being, not a king. As fallen angels has the power to transform themselves to what they are not, this point to Satan OneJack.
If not, was the King of Tyre recorded in the Bible or taught by your spirit as was in Eden? OneJack?

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

I think you have to settle your issue with God Himself; He was the one who commanded Ezekiel to tell that to the ruler of Tyre.

No, I think it is you that have an issue against God's word OneJack, The mentioned word is "cherub" the angelic being, you don't agree, you insist "cherub' as human.

The issue is that those narratives were God's description to the ruler of Tyre, which you seem to divert to someone else in the spirit realm. Who, then, is going against God's description to the ruler of Tyre?

[Capbook]

It’s a metaphor or, as you’ve said, symbolic. Why add your personal opinion to the narrative of the symbolic description of the Lord to the ruler of Tyre?

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

I think you have to settle your issue with God Himself; He was the one who commanded Ezekiel to tell that to the ruler of Tyre.

No, I think it is you that have an issue against God's word OneJack, The mentioned word is "cherub" the angelic being, you don't agree, you insist "cherub' as human.

The issue is that those narratives were God's description to the ruler of Tyre, which you seem to divert to someone else in the spirit realm. Who, then, is going against God's description to the ruler of Tyre?

Ok, can you define what "cherub" means OneJack?
That's what described the ruler of Tyre.

[OneJack]

OneJack, the word "cherub" which bears Strong#3742, in Hebrew "כּרוּב kerûb" defined by BibleLexicon as - an angelic being, etc.
Do you believe the King of Tyre as an angelic being?
This proves that even angelic beings will suffer destruction and will turn to ashes as what God said, by the lake of fire, the second death, in hell or Gehenna. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 

Eze 28:16  "By the R1abundanceH7230 of your tradeH7404 N1You were internallyH8432 R2filledH4390 with violenceH2555, And you sinnedH2398; Therefore I have castH2490c you as profaneH2490c From the mountainH2022 of GodH430. And I have destroyedH6 you, O N2coveringH5526a cherubH3742, From the midstH8432 of the stonesH68 of fireH784. 

H3742 (Brown, Driver, Briggs Lexicon)
כּרוּב kerûb
BDB Definition:
1) cherub, cherubim (plural)
1a) an angelic being

I think you have to settle your issue with God Himself; He was the one who commanded Ezekiel to tell that to the ruler of Tyre.

No, I think it is you that have an issue against God's word OneJack, The mentioned word is "cherub" the angelic being, you don't agree, you insist "cherub' as human.

The issue is that those narratives were God's description to the ruler of Tyre, which you seem to divert to someone else in the spirit realm. Who, then, is going against God's description to the ruler of Tyre?

Ok, can you define what "cherub" means OneJack?
That's what described the ruler of Tyre.

What for, Capbook? Focus yourself only to what is essential to your salvation.

[Mr E]

[Replying to OneJack in post #52]

You're fabricating your own notion here that is full of lies.

You've crossed a line here Jack, and made yourself irrelevant. It's exactly what folks do when they have no defensible position.

Have a nice day.

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #52]

You're fabricating your own notion here that is full of lies.

You've crossed a line here Jack, and made yourself irrelevant. It's exactly what folks do when they have no defensible position.

Have a nice day.

Here is your notion full of lies, to wit:

Then in the following verses, Ezekiel speaks in a more cosmic sense, addressing no longer the human king, but the spirit of this (with Baal) King... pointing out that it's the same spirit that fell from heaven that is present in this King. He's obviously speaking past the King, and referencing the satanic spiritual power that motivates him to do the evil things he does.