"Take my word for it, or his, or this book"

[Zzyzx]

Most of us probably know better than to believe everything said or written. If someone tells us they can fly by flapping their arms, our response is likely disbelief and a request that they ‘show me’. If they refuse to demonstrate or fail in flapping, we regard their claim as false. Agreed?

If a person claims to have come back to life after being dead for days none of us are likely to believe the claim unless it could be verified. Right?

If someone writes that fifty years ago a long-dead person came back to life and flew away into the sky, what would be your / our likely reaction? Would we be convinced if they say ‘many saw him’?

What would it take to convince us that the tale was true?

[OneJack]

You have made statements with are in direct contradiction with the testimonies of the Prophets, Moses and the eyewitness companions of Christ. --> For verbatim PROOF (copy paste quotations) of OneJack's testimonies that contradict those of the Prophets and Eyewitness companions of Christ in the Flesh CLICK HERE

How can I share with others what God asked us to do if I will not use my own words? Who among God's messengers did not use his personal words in bringing God's messages to the people?

RELATED LINKS

Should we believe testimonies that contradict or undermine those of Moses, the biblical Prophets and the eyewitness testimonies of the Apostles of Christ?
viewtopic.php?p=1187546#p1187546

Should all encounters with spirits claiming to be Christ be BELIEVED?
viewtopic.php?p=1187526#p1187526

How did Jesus read the testimony of the Prophet Isaiah if all scripture had been "lost"?
viewtopic.php?p=1187547#p1187547

Did I not tell you that you have nothing to take, be it from the bible or today’s revelations from the Lord, except for the knowledge that there is God, who truly exists? Then you have to come and call on the Lord so that He can shepherd and guide you to your salvation and eternal life, which the bible and today's revelations of the Lord, per se, can’t give you.

[OneJack]

[Replying to tam in post #354]

The truth IS Christ.

"I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life."

Kindly clarify to us, did you hear the above [verbatim as you quoted] from the mouth of the 'still small voice' within you?

"Still small voice" is not the name of a person. Still small voice is a description of a quiet voice.

Not shouting. Quiet.

Whatever, he is an entity, not just a voice, since you call him your Lord. Seems you forgot that there is only one Lord, who is the one true God.

To your question - Christ is Himself the Truth.

The 'still small voice' within you is not God, is he? Therefore, does the truth reside in the 'still small voice' within you, who is absolutely not God?

I trust the Christ, the Son of God,

How did you know the 'still small voice' within you is the Son of God, as you claimed? What exactly did the 'still small voice' tell you about himself, verbatim?

because He is the One to whom God said to listen and He is the One to whom God led me.

How did God say that to you? What exactly did God utter to you, verbatim, in this regard?

"This is my Son, my Chosen One. Listen to Him."

Have you heard this [audibly] from the Lord God Almighty, who said [to you], 'Listen to the 'still small voice?' Or have you just read this from the bible and adapted it to yourself and the 'still small voice' within you?

He is the Holy One of God. The Chosen One of God (Messiah). The Word of God. The Son of God. He says Himself that He is God's Son, and God said to listen to His Son.

Who [audibly] said these things to you, the 'still small voice' within you? If not, to whom have you heard these things from?

He has never lied to me. I hear the truth in His words. He has kept His promises (those that can happen now), and I know He will keep promises for things yet to come.

He gave His life for me (and not just me of course) - so that I (and my household) may live.

I owe Him my life (in every sense of the word.)

You owe your life to God alone, not to the 'still small voice' within you, which is not God, don't you? The Lord God is the One who created us all, not the 'still small voice' within you, which is not God. Don't be deceived in this regard, tam. By the way, are you reciting passages in the bible, or are you telling me you heard these things from the 'still small voice' within you?

"Small and still" is a description of a sound.

He is the one whom you claim as the Son of God, isn't he?

God does dwell within the person speaking though - that person is His Son, His Chosen One (Messiah - Chosen One of JAH).

Therefore, the 'still small voice' within you, which you claim as the Son of God, is actually not the Son of God, who was the dwelling place of God in His incarnation. The Son of God was the man who was born of Mary, and who served as the physical vessel of the Almighty God in coming in the flesh during the time of the apostles.

The Father is indeed in Him and He is in the Father.

What is this, a double talk? You have just said, 'God does dwell within the person speaking though - that person is His Son, His Chosen One (Messiah - Chosen One of JAH),' yet now you're saying the Father is indeed in him and he is in the Father?' How can the Father today be in the 'still small voice' within you when the Son of God is long gone, and his role is done with, too? What did the 'still small voice' within you tell you about himself? Is he a spirit, or is he a human being?

Christ is also in us (whom he chooses) and we are in Him. That does not mean that we and Christ are the same person.

On that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you are in Me, and I am in you. John 14:20

See also John 15:4, 6:56; 14:21-23

Sorry, but you are now expressing your opinion on biblical passages about Christ.

[OneJack]

Should all encounters with spirits claiming to be Christ be BELIEVED?
viewtopic.php?p=1187526#p1187526

If the one who has the encounter/s with God insists that he must be believed in with what he espouses, then he is not worthy to be the messenger of the Lord God. But if he only testifies to the Lord Jesus Christ alone and calls on all to put their trust and belief only in Him (Jesus), he is a true messenger of the Lord Jesus.

What if a person is driving on a Boulevard and a SPIRIT directly speaks to them or a child or another human starts speaking the words communicated to him from the SPIRIT world , should we believe the SPIRIT is Jesus because he says "I am Jesus" or "I am Almighty God speaking to you"? In other words... should all SPIRITS be BELIEVED if they say "I am God"?

"When he [THE DEVIL#] speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie" - JESUS CHRIST

#The Devil is an unseens spirit that can communicate (and even speak through) humans

RELATED LINKS


How does Satan manipulate innocent people into believing they are having supernatural encounters with Jesus Christ
viewtopic.php?p=1187545#p1187545

The Lord taught us to ask the one who claims he is Jesus or the Almighty God if He is the Lord God who created the heavens and earth, and all things.

[OneJack]

... if the testimonies are in direct contradiction to what is written in the bible, both the bible and those said testimonies can be set aside ...

Would that not result in truth being "set aside" because it contradicts what is false? Or are you saying it is IMPOSSIBLE to identify what is true without direct supernatural contact with the spirit world (in the sense of hearing voices or a spirit communicating through a human such as a 14 year old child)?

You have made statements with are in direct contradiction with the testimonies of the Prophets, Moses and the eyewitness companions of Christ.

So, according to your statement, analysis of your testimonies is futile, we have but to reject both your (contradictory) statement AND the statements of Moses and the inspired Prophets that Jesus in the flesh quoted... and wait for a spirit to contact us ? Correct?


JW



RELATED LINKS

Should we believe testimonies that contradict or undermine those of Moses, the biblical Prophets and the eyewitness testimonies of the Apostles of Christ?
viewtopic.php?p=1187546#p1187546

Should all encounters with spirits claiming to be Christ be BELIEVED?
viewtopic.php?p=1187526#p1187526

Did Jesus advise awaiting voices from the spirit realm to identify if a testimony is from God or not?
viewtopic.php?p=1187607#p1187607

That is a false notion about the truth, which only resides in the real and forever living Christ Jesus; hence, setting aside both the testimonies and the biblical inputs is the solution, and then come to and call on the Lord for the truth being ferreted out in the biblical inputs and the testimonies of some.

[OneJack]

if the testimonies are in direct contradiction to what is written in the bible, both the bible and those said testimonies can be set aside and come right away to the Lord Jesus for the truth, call on Him, and listen to and follow Him when He responds.

JESUS CHRIST consistently directed people back to the written Scriptures as the standard by which teachings, traditions, claims, and testimonies were to be evaluated. At no time is he recorded as advising that when in doubt testimonies (both good and bad) should be "set aside" awaiting a supernatural direction from the spirit world. On the contrary he constantly held the already existing written scripture as the authority. Here are some verbatim examples ...

• * In disputes with religious leaders, Jesus repeatedly appealed to Scripture with phrases like:
  
  * “Have you not read…?” (e.g. Matthew 12:3, 12:5; 19:4; 21:16; 22:31)
  
  * “It is written…” (Matthew 4:4, 4:7, 4:10)
  
  * Jesus taught that Scripture could not be broken:
  
  * “The Scripture cannot be broken.” (John 10:35)
  
  * In the temptation narrative, every satanic claim or suggestion was answered by Christ with written Scripture:
  
  * “It is written…” (Matthew 4:1–11)
  
  * After His resurrection, Jesus corrected misunderstanding by appealing to the Scriptures:
  
  * “O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!” (Luke 24:25)
  * He then explained “in all the Scriptures the things concerning Himself.” (Luke 24:27)
  
  * Jesus rebuked error by saying:
  
  * “You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God.” (Matthew 22:29)
  
  * In CHRIST'S ILLUSTRATION of the rich man and Lazarus, Abraham says:
  
  * “They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.” (Luke 16:29)

Also notable in its absence, is any response were Jesus undermined confidence in already existing written scripture by pointing out that his audience had NOT personally witnessed Moses or the Prophets nor had they had direct verbal communication with the spirit world

You've not witnessed Moses, nor have you heard anything yet from God.

On the contrary, taken together, the testimony of the eyewitness Apostles of Christ in the flesh presents this principle: When teachings, traditions, testimonies, or spiritual claims conflicted with the bible*, Christ and the apostolic witness directed people back to Scripture as the governing standard of truth.

*NOTE The term "the bible" is the relatively modern term that refers to the collection of "scripture"

RELATED LINKS

Should we believe testimonies that contradict or undermine those of Moses, the biblical Prophets and the eyewitness testimonies of the Apostles of Christ?
viewtopic.php?p=1187546#p1187546

Was the Hebrew bible "lost" when Jesus was on earth in the flesh?
viewtopic.php?p=1187547#p1187547

This is a false doctrine from a denomination, which says, verbatim, 'JESUS CHRIST consistently directed people back to the written Scriptures as the standard by which teachings, traditions, claims, and testimonies were to be evaluated.' The Lord reminded His listeners of the words that God had spoken and were written in the scriptures. The Lord is not telling them to go to the scriptures to know what is true, whether about God or anything related to the salvation and eternal life of people's souls. All of us have to come to the Lord for the truth, as simple as that.

[JehovahsWitness]

... The Lord reminded His listeners of the words that God had spoken and were written in the scriptures.

Are you here stating that it is TRUE that the "the words that God had spoken' ... were written in the scriptures"?

The Lord Jesus definitely told us that He did not command Moses to write any scriptures.

The bible itself contains no record of God's declaration that the scriptures are the 'Words of God.'

[JehovahsWitness]

How should one respond when being reprimanded for including one's own "personal words" in a post when sharing Christ's message ?
viewtopic.php?p=1187649#p1187649

How can I share with others what God asked us to do if I will not use my own words? Who among God's messengers did not use his personal words in bringing God's messages to the people?

My personal words, which I use now in conversing with you, are nothing but to understand what I'm saying.

Also see

Did Jesus advise awaiting voices from the spirit realm to identify if a testimony is from God or not?
viewtopic.php?p=1187607#p1187607

How should one respond when being reprimanded for including one's own "personal words" in a post when sharing Christ's message ?
viewtopic.php?p=1187649#p1187649

[JehovahsWitness]

Should all encounters with spirits claiming to be Christ be BELIEVED?
viewtopic.php?p=1187526#p1187526

If the one who has the encounter/s with God insists that he must be believed in with what he espouses, then he is not worthy to be the messenger of the Lord God. But if he only testifies to the Lord Jesus Christ alone and calls on all to put their trust and belief only in Him (Jesus), he is a true messenger of the Lord Jesus.

What if a person is driving on a Boulevard and a SPIRIT directly speaks to them or a child or another human starts speaking the words communicated to him from the SPIRIT world , should we believe the SPIRIT is Jesus because he says "I am Jesus" or "I am Almighty God speaking to you"? In other words... should all SPIRITS be BELIEVED if they say "I am God"?

"When he [THE DEVIL#] speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie" - JESUS CHRIST

#The Devil is an unseens spirit that can communicate (and even speak through) humans

RELATED LINKS


How does Satan manipulate innocent people into believing they are having supernatural encounters with Jesus Christ
viewtopic.php?p=1187545#p1187545

The Lord taught us to ask the one who claims he is Jesus or the Almighty God if He is

What good would asking that be ? If it were the Devil, would he not lie since (according to the verbatim words of Jesus when he was in the Flesh) the devil " is a liar"? In short if someone were to ask the Devil "are you really Jesus ?" or "Are you really the Lord God who created the heavens and earth, and all things." OBVIOUSLY the Devil will say "I am" because the Devil is a LIAR

"When he [THE DEVIL#] speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie" - JESUS CHRIST

MATTHEW 24:24-26

For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will perform great signs and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones. 25 Look! I have forewarned you. 26 Therefore, if people say to you, ‘Look! He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; ‘Look! He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it - JESUS CHRIST

[William]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #368]

What good would asking that be ? If it were the Devil, would he not lie since (according to the verbatim words of Jesus when he was in the Flesh) the devil " is a liar"? In short if someone were to ask the Devil "are you really Jesus ?" or "Are you really the Lord God who created the heavens and earth, and all things." OBVIOUSLY the Devil will say "I am" because the Devil is a LIAR

If demonic deception is so pervasive and powerful that it can simulate God, Jesus, near-death experiences, biblical visions, prophetic utterances, and even the apparent resurrection appearances - then the Bible itself becomes unreliable. How does anyone know that the authors weren't deceived? How does anyone know that the "God" who spoke to them wasn't a demon impersonating divinity?

The JW framework, intended to safeguard a particular reading of Scripture, ultimately undermines the very authority of Scripture. It replaces a trustworthy God with an omnipotent deceiver who has no boundaries. And once that door is opened, nothing is sacred - not the Bible, not the Watchtower, not even the hope of resurrection.

So the honest question becomes: why trust any divine revelation at all? The JW answer has no answer. And that's the quiet crisis their system cannot survive.

Yet Again.

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to tam in post #355]

There were a couple of things I want to run by you.

Do you think that anyone who doesn't hear an actual voice in their mind which identifies itself as Christ, and experiencing The Christ in the way you claim to, are not true followers of Christ?

I don't really make that call, William.

I was taught to test the message. I might put my Lord's words and commands up so that the other person could test what they believe or do against Him and His word. The rest is not up to me.

When you say to another "this is not the Christ I hear" when they witness their own way of communing with The Christ Voice, are you saying that they are somehow wrong and deceived or are you saying something else?

Do you have an example?


Peace again.