Why isn't the standing still of the sun and the moon not recorded by other cultures?

[Compassionist]

I am quoting from Joshua 10: 12 - 14, the Bible (English Standard Version)

"At that time Joshua spoke to the Lord in the day when the Lord gave the Amorites over to the sons of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel,

Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
and moon, in the Valley of Aijalon.”
And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped,
until the nation took vengeance on their enemies.

Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day. There has been no day like it before or since, when the Lord heeded the voice of a man, for the Lord fought for Israel."

Why isn't the standing still of the sun and the moon not recorded by other cultures that had invented writing?

The event described in Joshua 10:12–14, where the sun and moon are said to have stood still to allow the Israelites more time to defeat their enemies, would - if taken literally - constitute a global astronomical phenomenon. If the Earth’s rotation truly stopped or slowed (which is what "the sun stood still" would physically mean), it would have had catastrophic global consequences, including massive earthquakes, tsunamis, and changes in atmospheric motion due to sudden deceleration.

Such an event could not have gone unnoticed by other civilisations and would have been recorded by other literate cultures that kept astronomical or historical records.

At the time (around 13th to 15th century BCE, depending on the dating of the conquest narratives), several advanced civilisations with writing and astronomical records existed, including:

Egyptians
Babylonians
Chinese (Shang Dynasty)
Minoans/Mycenaeans
Sumerians
Indus Valley remnants

Yet none of these cultures, despite their meticulous sky observations, record a day when the sun and moon stood still or behaved abnormally. I conclude that this is because the Bible is lying about the Biblical God making the sun and the moon stand still.

[1213]

Thanks for your response! Apologists usually ignore this question or handwave it away on faith, so I appreciate your input here.

Your welcome. Unfortunately, I think in the end this will remain a matter of belief anyway. So, not much reason to debate about this, when it is not possible to prove what happened thousands of years ago.

You’re trying to make the dating of Joshua unfalsifiable, which doesn’t provide any support for your case. We cannot know when the was first told orally, but the scholarly consensus...

And if we can't know when it was first time told, it is not possible to say is it younger than some other story. Consensus sounds nice, but to me it is pointless, because consensus can be wrong.

Carbon dating of text fragments...

I don't trust radiometric dating, because it requires certain assumptions usually that can be wrong.

...Do you know how the canon was determined? It was through a very late (3rd century CE) and ideologically driven process.

What was the ideology driving the process?

Have you studied Biblical Hebrew? You can clearly tell that the way it was written (and therefore spoken) varies from the earliest writings to the latest ones from the second temple period.

Even if something would be written in more modern style than the original text, like for example Bible translation from modern day and King James version, the original story can be much older and essentially the same. Also, it is possible that our idea of what could have been the earliest style can be wrong. I don't think style tells reliably much about when the original story was first told.

...we still wouldn’t have certainty as to what happened without outside evidence!

I can accept we don't have certainty. But, if we don't have certainty, why should I believe things went as you claim?

[Compassionist]

[Replying to 1213 in post #10]

Thank you for your kind words and for engaging so thoughtfully.

I think there is too much assumption. I can't say something is not true just on basis of assumptions.

That’s a fair concern. But dating texts and artifacts isn’t based on guesswork - it’s based on multiple independent lines of evidence that converge: stratigraphy, carbon dating, king lists, linguistic evolution, and cross-referenced artifacts. When all these methods point to consistent timeframes, we’re not dealing with assumptions but corroborated empirical inference.

By contrast, a literal miracle - the sun standing still - would require overturning everything we know about celestial mechanics. Such an event would have caused global chaos (massive tsunamis, atmospheric upheaval, extinction events) and would have been recorded by every literate civilization on Earth. None did.

I don’t think people would have made up the sun stood still story, if it did not really happen.

History shows people often did record miraculous stories sincerely believed to be true. Ancient authors lacked our understanding of astronomy and physics, so poetic or theological descriptions were taken literally by later generations. The “sun stood still” passage reads like an ancient battle myth - a symbolic way of saying “God gave us time to win.”

Even if it happened, it would not necessarily mean God made it happen.

That’s true - but the issue is whether it happened at all. The evidence suggests it did not. Belief alone, without corroborating data, cannot carry the same weight as convergent physical evidence.

In short, science doesn’t claim absolute certainty - it claims best-supported probability. The “sun stood still” story is a fictitious story - not a historical or astronomical event. Mine is an evidence-based worldview. Yours is a faith-based worldview. There are lots of other religions on Earth and lots of believers of those religions. Faith can't be the arbiter of truth. Evidence is the arbiter of truth.

[Haven]

It is interesting that the Toltec or Aztec myths have similar idea of sun not moving.

"The present era for the Aztecs was that of the 5th and final sun, Tonatiuh. The god had been born from the sacrifice of Nanahuatzin who threw himself into a fire at Teotihuacan and thus became the new sun. There was an immediate problem that Tonatiuh could or would not set himself in motion across the sky without a blood sacrifice. Now stepped in Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, for the Aztecs the planet Venus as the menacing morning star. He angrily threw his atl-atl dart at Tonatiuh in order to set him on his orbit, but the sun retaliated by throwing a dart right back. This missile hit Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli right in the forehead, instantly transforming him into stone and the god Itztlacoliuhqui, a deity associated with ice and cold. The rest of the gods realised that only a sacrifice would set the sun in motion and so Quetzalcoatl removed their hearts for that purpose. The offering worked and Tonatiuh was on his way."
https://www.worldhistory.org/Tonatiuh/

Also Japanese have similar idea:

"Amaterasu, known as the goddess of the sun, is one of the principal deities in the Shinto pantheon... ...One of the most famous myths involving Amaterasu is the tale of her retreat into the Heavenly Rock Cave, known as Ama-no-Iwato. In this myth, Amaterasu withdraws into the cave out of anger and despair, retreating from the world after a conflict with her brother, Susanoo, the storm god... ...The impact of her absence is catastrophic; without her light, the world descends into darkness and chaos. Crops fail, and the inhabitants suffer. This myth underscores the vital connection between the sun and life, as Amaterasu’s withdrawal symbolizes the loss of hope and nourishment. To restore balance, the other gods devise a plan to coax her out. They hold a festival outside the cave, celebrating her and creating a mirror that reflects her beauty. Intrigued by the commotion, Amaterasu eventually emerges, bringing light back to the world.
https://japanese.mythologyworldwide.com ... -and-life/

According to this site, there are many similar myths about sun being still.
https://sacred-texts.com/astro/slaa/slaa10.htm

Thanks for your response!

Is it okay if I ask how this is relevant to the specific claim made in Joshua 10? Pointing out that other cultures have myths of the sun standing still doesn’t provide evidence for the Biblical claim (just as me pointing out Scottish unicorn myths doesn’t make my claim of riding a unicorn this morning any more likely).

If anything, it shows that human beings often create myths about the sun, and raises the probability that Joshua 10 is one of those myths (which would support the skeptical hypothesis, rather than your brand of Biblical inerrantism).

[RBD]

I am quoting from Joshua 10: 12 - 14, the Bible (English Standard Version)

"At that time Joshua spoke to the Lord in the day when the Lord gave the Amorites over to the sons of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel,

Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
and moon, in the Valley of Aijalon.”
And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped,
until the nation took vengeance on their enemies.

Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day. There has been no day like it before or since, when the Lord heeded the voice of a man, for the Lord fought for Israel."

Why isn't the standing still of the sun and the moon not recorded by other cultures that had invented writing?

The event described in Joshua 10:12–14, where the sun and moon are said to have stood still to allow the Israelites more time to defeat their enemies, would - if taken literally - constitute a global astronomical phenomenon. If the Earth’s rotation truly stopped or slowed (which is what "the sun stood still" would physically mean), it would have had catastrophic global consequences, including massive earthquakes, tsunamis, and changes in atmospheric motion due to sudden deceleration.

Such an event could not have gone unnoticed by other civilisations and would have been recorded by other literate cultures that kept astronomical or historical records.

At the time (around 13th to 15th century BCE, depending on the dating of the conquest narratives), several advanced civilisations with writing and astronomical records existed, including:

Egyptians
Babylonians
Chinese (Shang Dynasty)
Minoans/Mycenaeans
Sumerians
Indus Valley remnants

Yet none of these cultures, despite their meticulous sky observations, record a day when the sun and moon stood still or behaved abnormally. I conclude that this is because the Bible is lying about the Biblical God making the sun and the moon stand still.

It's appears to be a credible challenge, that I had not thought of. But first, just to test your own credibility:

The Greeks recorded in their 202nd Olympiad, of a total solar eclipse at noon, during the time of a full moon, where the stars shone over all the land for several hours. Which is the one recorded during Jesus' crucifixion from the 6th to the 9th hour of the day.

Do you now believe that astronomically impossible event?

[1213]

Is it okay if I ask how this is relevant to the specific claim made in Joshua 10?

In the opening post it was said "Why isn't the standing still of the sun and the moon not recorded by other cultures that had invented writing?".

My point was only to show that other cultures had a similar idea. Doesn't necessary mean it happened, but I think it is wrong to say other cultures don't have the same idea.

[1213]

...Mine is an evidence-based worldview....

Sorry, I think that is an assumption based world view. There is no direct evidence supporting your world view, only the assumption that some interpretations of what can be observed are true.

[Compassionist]

...Mine is an evidence-based worldview....

Sorry, I think that is an assumption based world view. There is no direct evidence supporting your world view, only the assumption that some interpretations of what can be observed are true.

Yes, there is evidence that humans evolved and were not created as described in the Bible. There is zero evidence that the stories in the Bible are true. If you can provide evidence for the various stories in the Bible, e.g. Adam and Eve's creation by God and eviction from Eden, Jesus being conceived without sex, the various miracles in the Old and New Testaments, then please do.

1. Genetic Evidence

a. Shared DNA with Other Primates

Humans share ~98.8% of DNA with chimpanzees and ~96% with gorillas.
The similarities are not random — they appear in **the same genes, in the same order**, including identical “mistakes” (pseudogenes, broken viral sequences, etc.), which indicate **common ancestry** rather than separate creation.

b. Endogenous Retroviruses (ERVs)

About 8% of human DNA consists of fossilized viral DNA from ancient infections passed to offspring.
Humans and other primates share identical ERVs in the same chromosomal locations, meaning these viral insertions happened before our species diverged — impossible if each species were separately created.

c. Chromosome 2 Fusion

* Humans have 23 pairs of chromosomes, while apes have 24 pairs.
* Human chromosome 2 is a direct fusion of two ape chromosomes - it contains two centromeres and telomere sequences in the middle instead of at the ends.
* This fusion event is visible under a microscope and confirmed by DNA sequencing - a smoking gun for common ancestry.

2. Fossil Evidence

The fossil record shows a gradual, chronological transition from ape-like ancestors to modern Homo sapiens, with intermediate species bridging the gaps.

| Species | Approx. Age (million years ago) | Key Traits
| ------------------------------------- | ------------------------------- | ------------------------------------------------
| Sahelanthropus tchadensis | 7 | Early bipedal traits, small brain
| Australopithecus afarensis (“Lucy”) | 3.2 | Fully bipedal, still ape-like skull
| Homo habilis | 2.4–1.4 | Tool use, larger brain
| Homo erectus | 1.9–0.1 | Global spread, fire use, modern body proportions
| Homo neanderthalensis | 0.4–0.04 | Large brains, complex culture
| Homo sapiens | 0.3–present | Symbolic art, language, abstract thought

These fossils show a clear evolutionary sequence - not sudden appearance.

3. Anatomical Evidence

Human anatomy retains numerous vestiges of our evolutionary past:

Tailbone (coccyx) - remnant of a tail used by ancestors.
Appendix - reduced from a large fermentation chamber in herbivorous ancestors.
Wisdom teeth - relic of larger jaws used for coarse vegetation.
Goosebumps - inherited from fur-raising in other mammals.
Embryonic gill arches and tail - appear during human development but regress before birth.

These make no sense under special creation but are entirely expected under evolution.

4. Geological and Radiometric Dating

Radiometric dating (e.g., uranium-lead, potassium-argon) shows that the Earth is 4.54 billion years old, not 6,000–10,000 years as Genesis implies.
Fossils of early humans are found in rock layers millions of years old, consistent across continents and dating methods.
No human fossils are found in the same layers as dinosaurs — proving the biblical timeline false.

5. Geographic and Genetic Distribution

Human genetic diversity decreases with distance from Africa, consistent with an African origin about 315,000 years ago.
All humans today descend from a population of perhaps 10,000–20,000 early Homo sapiens in Africa - confirmed by mitochondrial DNA and Y-chromosome studies.

6. Archaeological and Cultural Evidence

Stone tools, art, burial sites, and symbolic artifacts appear gradually in the record.
There is no sign of a sudden “creation” event - instead, complexity accumulates step by step over hundreds of thousands of years.

7. Consensus of Science

Virtually every scientific organization on Earth — including the National Academy of Sciences (U.S.), Royal Society (U.K.), AAAS, and UNESCO - affirms that evolution is an established fact supported by massive evidence.
The Genesis creation story, by contrast, originated in an ancient Near Eastern context that reflected mythic cosmology — not empirical observation.

Summary

| Genesis Model | Evolutionary Model
| ----------------------------------------------- | --------------------------------------------------------
| Adam and Eve created instantly ~6,000 years ago | *Homo sapiens* evolved gradually over ~300,000 years
| All species created separately | All life shares common ancestry
| No death before sin | Fossil record shows life and death for billions of years
| Global flood explains fossils | Fossils formed gradually through geological processes

[Compassionist]

[Replying to RBD in post #14]

Thank you for your reply.

First, it’s important not to conflate claims with evidence.
I am not asking anyone to believe in my authority or opinion - I am asking whether a global physical event (the sun and moon standing still) would have left verifiable, cross-cultural evidence if it truly happened.

1. On the “Eclipse at the Crucifixion”

There is no record by Greek astronomers of a total solar eclipse lasting several hours during a full moon.
By definition, a solar eclipse cannot occur during a full moon, because the Moon must be between the Earth and the Sun (new-moon phase) for an eclipse to happen.
Ancient Greek, Roman, Egyptian, Chinese, and Babylonian astronomers - all expert sky-watchers - left no record of such an event.

The story of “darkness from the sixth to the ninth hour” at the crucifixion is not an astronomical observation, but a theological motif found in the Gospels. It uses symbolic darkness to represent divine grief or judgment - a literary device common in ancient texts.

So, no, I do not believe an “astronomically impossible event” literally happened, because there is no physical evidence for it and it contradicts established astronomy.

2. Returning to Joshua 10

My point about Joshua 10 remains:
If the sun and moon literally stood still, the Earth would have had to stop rotating - producing continent-wide earthquakes, tsunamis, and atmospheric chaos.
No civilisation with written astronomy - Egyptian, Babylonian, Chinese, or otherwise - records any such event.

If it were local rather than global, then the text is not describing a physical miracle at all but a mythic exaggeration. Either way, the literal reading collapses.

3. The Broader Issue

Invoking one unverified miracle (a three-hour eclipse during a full moon) to defend another (a 24-hour suspension of Earth’s rotation) does not increase credibility - it compounds the problem.
Two unsupported claims don’t make a fact.

Reliable truth claims are those that leave independent, consistent evidence that can be tested from multiple sources. The events of Joshua 10 and the crucifixion darkness fail that test.

[JehovahsWitness]

This same question was asked by Compassionist back on 21st of March 2017, this is what I posted in reply ....

The sun appears to rise in the east and set in the west. This illusion is created by the real movement Earth's axial rotation.

Exactly! So we speak of the sun as doing something when it really isn't doing at all , it is as you rightly said an "illusion" in other words something that is not physically happening as we describe but does as you say "appear" to be that way. ie the sun "appears"to be moving up and down from a human perspective. If we speak in such terms today,even though we know it is not literally true, why could Joshua not do the same?

For the sun and the moon to appear to stand still, the Earth's axial rotation would have to stop which would cause people and other animals, structures, bodies of water, etc. to be flung out into space due to inertia.

Illustions don't work that way. the whole point of an illusion is that one cannot "trust" their eyes to be conveying a physical reality. Your point is like saying, the only way for the magician to have his assistant's feet and legs sticking out of one half of the box and her head and hands in another direction is to dislocate her spine! er... well yes, if he really did saw her in half. But we all know he did not, only that it was an illustion and he APPEARED to. How people perform trick, I cannot say, but I can say that they don't kill their assistants so their spines are almost certainly not severed in two.

HOW Joshua was given the impression that the sun wasn't moving we cannot say for sure, but it almost certainly wasn't by stopping the earth from rotating although if there is a God an omnipotent God that certainly wouldn't be beyond his capabilities (to do so would seem a bit like overkill to me, no pun intended)...



JW



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[Compassionist]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #19]

Thank you for your reply.

If Joshua’s “sun stood still” episode were merely a visual illusion, then the text itself is misleading.
Joshua 10:13 doesn’t say “it appeared as if the sun stood still.” It explicitly states:

“The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day.”

The author presents it as a physical, cosmic event, not a metaphor. The passage even insists:

“There has been no day like it before or since.”

That makes it clear the writer thought something unprecedented actually happened - not just an optical effect.

1. Illusion theory doesn’t fit the description

Illusions require an observer, but the passage describes a real extension of daylight that allowed Israel to continue fighting.
A local illusion could not physically prolong daylight for an entire army in the open.
If it were only Joshua’s private vision, the text would not claim that “the nation took vengeance on their enemies until the sun stood still.” The narrative treats it as a shared reality.

2. Literal reading contradicts astronomy

If the Earth’s rotation had stopped, the inertia would have produced planet-wide cataclysms - tsunamis, atmospheric devastation, and the instant death of nearly all life.
No such event is recorded in any contemporary civilisation with written astronomy (Egyptian, Babylonian, Chinese, etc.).

If an omnipotent God “stopped the Earth gently,” that still leaves the problem of an undetectable global suspension of natural law that only one small tribe noticed - an event with cosmic consequences, yet no cosmic evidence.

3. Mythic or poetic reading fits the evidence best

The simplest explanation is that this is mythic hyperbole - a poetic way of saying “God gave us victory.”
Ancient Near Eastern battle literature often uses cosmic imagery (e.g., “the stars fought from heaven” in Judges 5:20).

Understanding it as poetic does not require believing that the Earth literally paused or that everyone experienced a miraculous illusion at once.

4. Conclusion

Either the event was literal (and physically impossible without catastrophic consequences)
Or it was a mythological event (and not a record of real astronomy).

Both options refute a literalist claim that the Bible gives scientifically accurate history.
The evidence - or rather the lack of it - points to a mythological narrative, not a global miracle.