every tear

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Athetotheist
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every tear

Post #1

Post by Athetotheist »

"He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”
(Rev. 21:4)

Imagine yourself in heaven after the end of this world, where the throngs of the saved have been gathered to sing praises to Jesus for eternity.....

.....but someone you loved very deeply and dearly in this life is not there. That someone was loving, kind, humble and generous, but was just never convinced of the Jesus story......

.....so now you're in heaven forever and your dear one is not, and sometimes you stand alone at the edge of heaven looking out into the abyss and remembering.

As long as you remember, can every tear be wiped from your eyes? How? Must an act of divine amnesia be worked upon you to remove the sorrow from your heart by removing the loved one from your mind? Are you to simply put your memory and your love away in the eternal rejoicing? If so, is the eternal bliss still genuine?
"There is more room for a god in science than there is for no god in religious faith."
--Phil Plate

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Re: every tear

Post #31

Post by Athetotheist »

[Replying to marke in post #29]
Yes, the scriptures are totally and irrefutably accurate.

Revelation 21:4
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
Then the questions I raised still stand.
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Re: every tear

Post #32

Post by POI »

marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:05 pm Christians in heaven will find God has not only forgiven them of all their sins but will remove all remaining remorse and sadness for having committed those sins.
Then just allow all into Heaven. If God is required to change you, then it makes little sense not to just allow all into Heaven.
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:

"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."

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Re: every tear

Post #33

Post by marke »

Athetotheist wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:06 pm [Replying to marke in post #29]
Yes, the scriptures are totally and irrefutably accurate.

Revelation 21:4
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
Then the questions I raised still stand.
Marke: Are you questioning whether the scripture is accurate? If not, then what are you asking?

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Re: every tear

Post #34

Post by marke »

POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:28 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:05 pm Christians in heaven will find God has not only forgiven them of all their sins but will remove all remaining remorse and sadness for having committed those sins.
Then just allow all into Heaven. If God is required to change you, then it makes little sense not to just allow all into Heaven.

Marke: God saves sinners His way, not some other way.

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Re: every tear

Post #35

Post by POI »

marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:12 pm
POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:28 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:05 pm Christians in heaven will find God has not only forgiven them of all their sins but will remove all remaining remorse and sadness for having committed those sins.
Then just allow all into Heaven. If God is required to change you, then it makes little sense not to just allow all into Heaven.

Marke: God saves sinners His way, not some other way.
This response addresses nothing I said. If God forgives all sin, and God also has to change you, then it makes no sense not to accept all. And as the OP-er asked, is your lack of further sorrow really genuine if God has to "remove" your tears? The answer is NO!
Last edited by POI on Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:

"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."

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Re: every tear

Post #36

Post by Athetotheist »

[Replying to marke in post #33]
Are you questioning whether the scripture is accurate? If not, then what are you asking?
I'm asking the questions at the end of my OP.
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Re: every tear

Post #37

Post by marke »

POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:26 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:12 pm
POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:28 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:05 pm Christians in heaven will find God has not only forgiven them of all their sins but will remove all remaining remorse and sadness for having committed those sins.
Then just allow all into Heaven. If God is required to change you, then it makes little sense not to just allow all into Heaven.

Marke: God saves sinners His way, not some other way.
This response addresses nothing I said. If God forgives all sin, and God also has to change you, then it makes no sense not to accept all. And as the OP-er asked, is your lack of further sorrow really genuine if God has to "remove" your tears? The answer is NO!

Marke: I do not believe your argument is valid or reasonable.

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Re: every tear

Post #38

Post by POI »

marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 7:59 pm
POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:26 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 5:12 pm
POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:28 pm
marke wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 2:05 pm Christians in heaven will find God has not only forgiven them of all their sins but will remove all remaining remorse and sadness for having committed those sins.
Then just allow all into Heaven. If God is required to change you, then it makes little sense not to just allow all into Heaven.

Marke: God saves sinners His way, not some other way.
This response addresses nothing I said. If God forgives all sin, and God also has to change you, then it makes no sense not to accept all. And as the OP-er asked, is your lack of further sorrow really genuine if God has to "remove" your tears? The answer is NO!

Marke: I do not believe your argument is valid or reasonable.
'Nu-huh' is not an acceptable debate response tactic. You need to sight your reason(s) in which you believe my argument is not sound.
In case anyone is wondering... The avatar quote states the following:

"I asked God for a bike, but I know God doesn't work that way. So I stole a bike and asked for forgiveness."

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Re: every tear

Post #39

Post by 1213 »

Athetotheist wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 1:22 pm It isn't about someone wanting separation from God. It's about someone simply not being convinced that Jesus is the way to God, or not believing in God at all.

It's unfair and self-righteous to assume that others want to be evil just because they don't believe what you believe.
I don't believe anyone goes to hell because they didn't believe God is real, or that Jesus is the way. If people go to hell, it is because they are not righteous. And the judgment goes by this:

...This is the judgment, that the light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil. For everyone who does evil hates the light, and doesn’t come to the light, lest his works would be exposed. But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his works may be revealed, that they have been done in God.”
John 3:16-21
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Matt. 25:46
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
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Old version can be read from here:
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Re: every tear

Post #40

Post by 1213 »

POI wrote: Sun Mar 23, 2025 11:51 am Since Heaven is complete bliss, this is logically impossible. You cannot mourn, at all, ever, if you are present in a place of complete bliss. Hence, is your memory wiped by this God, or are you transformed by this God, or other? Please pick one?
By the way, where do you get the idea of bliss?

I don't think memory needs to be wiped by God. It is possible that people who end up Heaven already understand why things are good the way they are and that there is no need to mourn.
My new book can be read freely from here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view

Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html

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