When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?
If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.
We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.
Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29
Paradise on Earth
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3301I answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3302You always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3303You criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
Thayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
The Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
You accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3304onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3305It is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3306The link provide another description of the OSB, but didn't you accused that KJV, NKJV and others followed the Vulgate? Now you go with it.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:55 pmIt is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a variety of sources, including the New King James Version (NKJV) and the Septuagint. While translators strive to be faithful to the original text, translations are interpretations. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3307[/quote] It doesn't matter if the KJV followed the Vulgate. We are talking about paraphrasing. The KJV doesn't paraphrase. It tries to stick to the earliest sentence structure, be it the Vulgate or something else. You yourself follow paraphrased versions.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pmThe link provide another description of the OSB, but didn't you accused that KJV, NKJV and others followed the Vulgate? Now you go with it.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:55 pmIt is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3308It doesn't matter if the KJV followed the Vulgate. We are talking about paraphrasing. The KJV doesn't paraphrase. It tries to stick to the earliest sentence structure, be it the Vulgate or something else. You yourself follow paraphrased versions.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun Mar 09, 2025 7:15 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pmThe link provide another description of the OSB, but didn't you accused that KJV, NKJV and others followed the Vulgate? Now you go with it.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:55 pmIt is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pmI never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.Rxlx wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2025 8:14 am [Replying to onewithhim in post #1]
Maybe if you could read and understand the Bible you would know that today's Earth is definitely not going to be a paradise this side of Judgment Day.
Today's Earth is 70% water covered, 10% desert, 10% icy mountain and just 10% fertile land.
At CReation GOD made Earth as 100% dry land.
In the Days of Peleg He caused the crust to lift an dsink to separate the Babelites into their new nations.
After Judgment Day this dirty old Earth will be burned up and a new pure one made that will be as warm and fertile as The Garden of Eden.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
[/quote]
Good, so John 1:1 in KJV is the truth. As you say, it doesn't paraphrase, you can dig to its original Bible words in Hebrew and Greek.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3309onewithhim answers:Capbook wrote: ↑Mon Mar 10, 2025 3:08 amGood, so John 1:1 in KJV is the truth. As you say, it doesn't paraphrase, you can dig to its original Bible words in Hebrew and Greek.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun Mar 09, 2025 7:15 pmIt doesn't matter if the KJV followed the Vulgate. We are talking about paraphrasing. The KJV doesn't paraphrase. It tries to stick to the earliest sentence structure, be it the Vulgate or something else. You yourself follow paraphrased versions.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pmThe link provide another description of the OSB, but didn't you accused that KJV, NKJV and others followed the Vulgate? Now you go with it.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:55 pmIt is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 amIf your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)onewithhim wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2025 12:26 pm
I never suggested that the earth would be a paradise this side of Judgment Day. How can you say that the earth was once 100% dry land? That's not what Science or the Bible say. The earth is not "a dirty old earth." It is still beautiful in most places, and has the ability to renew itself from pollution, and evil men who are destroying the planet will be removed. (Psalm 37:10) This very earth will be made a "pure new one" with all evil people gone. That was God's original purpose and it will be fulfilled. (Ecclesiastes 1:4; Isaiah 55:11) His will was that mankind should live on a beautiful earth and take care of it. That will has not changed. (Genesis: 1:26,28; 2:14) This very earth will remain forever. The earth and the present heavens do not deserve to be destroyed.
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
No. We are talking about paraphrasing, not about whether it's the truth or not. The KJV didn't paraphrase, the translators simply got a word wrong in this verse.
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Re: Paradise on Earth
Post #3310I noticed that OSB rendering of 2 Pet 3:13 is a bit different from known word for word translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Mar 11, 2025 11:48 amonewithhim answers:Capbook wrote: ↑Mon Mar 10, 2025 3:08 amGood, so John 1:1 in KJV is the truth. As you say, it doesn't paraphrase, you can dig to its original Bible words in Hebrew and Greek.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sun Mar 09, 2025 7:15 pmIt doesn't matter if the KJV followed the Vulgate. We are talking about paraphrasing. The KJV doesn't paraphrase. It tries to stick to the earliest sentence structure, be it the Vulgate or something else. You yourself follow paraphrased versions.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 10:14 pmThe link provide another description of the OSB, but didn't you accused that KJV, NKJV and others followed the Vulgate? Now you go with it.onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:55 pmIt is not considered a paraphrased translation.Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 9:41 pmonewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 8:31 pmCapbook wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 1:15 amYou always quote paraphrase translations that used words other than the original Bible words in Hebrew or Greek that would quite misled the reader. You cannot find the Bible root words and its meaning in thought for thought translations.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmI answered that in my last posting above. You went right by that and asked the same question again. The earth will be brought back to its pristine condition after the beginning of the thousand year reign of Christ. No need for its destruction. It will be like new. 2Peter is symbolic, meaning that the wickedness in the earth will be [revealed. That is one definition of "lyo." A footnote in the NASB says that it means "discovered" in two early manuscripts. So "destroyed" is not necessarily the meaning Peter meant to convey. All the evil will be shown clearly and will be done away with. Not the earth and universe, but the ungodly PEOPLE. (Chapter 3 verse 7.)Capbook wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 2:33 am
If your last statement is true, why did John saw a new heaven and new earth, and God said "I make all things new." (Rev 21:1,5)
And besides 2Pet 3:12 says, heavens being on fire shall be "dissolved", in Greek "lyo" which Bible lexicons one defintion as to destroy, demolish (John 2:19) same Greek word used and same Strong#G3089.00]dissolved, G3089[/color] and G2532 the elements G4747 shall melt G5080 with fervent heat?
It's interesting that at Psalm 46:6 it speaks of the earth "melting." This happened long ago when God was backing up his people in an altercation. It says: "The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted."(KJV) Is this literal? I guess not. The earth is still here. The same can be said for Peter's passage about the earth being burnt up. It's not literal.
The Orthodox Study Bible says this about 2Peter 3:13: "Not other heavens and earth, but the same ones transfigured for the better. For a beautiful prophetic description of the new heaven and earth, see Isaiah 65:17-25; Revelation 21,22."
ABP render 2 Peter 3:12 with Strong#G2741 of the word "being destroyed by fire" can never be a symbolic text, in Greek "καυσόω kausoō" as it means burn up, to suffer with feverish burning etc.
And the next text mentioned the new heavens and a new earth.
The Orthodox Study Bible (OSB) is a translation of the Bible that's based on a literal translation of the original Greek, but it's not a word-for-word translation. Translations are interpretations, and Christians often read multiple versions of the Bible to understand a passage. https://www.google.com/search?q=is+orth ... e&ie=UTF-8
2Pe 3:12 expecting G4328 and G2532 hastening G4692 the G3588 arrival G3952 of the G3588 G3588 day of God, G2316 G2250 by G1223 which G3739 the heavens G3772 being set on fire G4448 shall be loosed, G3089 and G2532 the elements G4747 being destroyed by fire G2741 shall melt away? G5080
G2741 (Thayer)
καυσόω kausoō
Thayer Definition:
1) to burn up, set fire to
2) to suffer with feverish burning, be parched with fever
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.No, not universe, universe is huge, only earth and heavens which the Bible mentioned being destroyed defined by lexicon.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou criticize whatever Bible I use, and I refer to many, including the NASB which I could be wrong, but I believe you said you prefer. The new heavens and new earth will be these same heavens and earth but just cleaned up and put back to the original state. There is no reason at all for the entire universe to be destroyed. Can you agree to that?
Deny Thayer? I'll give Mounce. Strong#G2741 defined as to be on fire, burn intensely.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThayer's definition leaves something to be desired. Talk about BIAS. I have already commented on the phrase "destroyed by fire." Some mss. say "revealed" or "discovered." That is quite different than "destroyed."
καυσόω
kausoō
2x: to be on fire, burn intenselyThis what I've said that paraphrase translations used words other than the original Bible words. But yes, the same "burnt earth and heavens" that God said I'll make all things new.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmThe Orthodox Study Bible nails it: "the new heavens and new earth are the same ones, just transfigured for the better." That's it in a nutshell.
Yes, but to this response you used the "Orthodox Study Bible" a paraphrase translation.onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Mar 07, 2025 12:58 pmYou accuse me of always using paraphrased versions, but that is not true. Neither the KJV or the NASB are paraphrased, and neither are the New American Bible, the Revised Standard Version, the American Standard Version, and many others. Most Bible versions are not "paraphrased" versions. An example of a paraphrased version would be the Living Bible.
No. We are talking about paraphrasing, not about whether it's the truth or not. The KJV didn't paraphrase, the translators simply got a word wrong in this verse.
OSB's "the same ones" wording did not exist in Greek and in Strong Concordance. See below.
(ASV) But, according to his promise, we look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
(ESV) But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
(TS2009) But according to His promise we wait for a renewed heavens and a renewed earth Isa 65:17, Isa 66:22 in which righteousness dwells.
(NASB) But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.
(NASB+) But according G2596 to His R1 promise G1862 we are looking G4328 for G4328 R2 new G2537 heavens G3772 and a new G2537 earth G1093 , R3 in which G3739 righteousness G1343 dwells G2730 .