If you were Satan....

[Athetotheist]

I remember a TV preacher once asking his broadcast audience, "If you were Satan....." I don't remember the rest of the question, but I seem to remember that he was talking about prophecy and arguing that Satan was up to some diabolical mischief ("If you were Satan, isn't that what you would do?").

A lot of detail in Christian scripture about what is to happen before Jesus returns is tied to the activity of "Satan". The appearance of the "antichrist", in particular, is supposed to be part of Satan's last gambit before he goes down to utter defeat.

Since it was asked of me how I would react if I were Satan, I think it's fair for me to answer. I know that "Satan" is supposed to be a being of superhuman intelligence, but I can't help thinking that if such a being actually existed and if I were that being, I could do a lot better.

If I were "Satan", I would scrap the antichrist plan. If it's all laid out in the Bible, then everyone knows what to expect and you've lost the element of surprise. With that one simple deviation from the prophetic scenario, the whole thing would be gummed up. No antichrist, no mark of the beast, no abomination of desolation, no anything I was supposed to do as Satan to set the stage for the return of Jesus. And without those prophetic components in place, Jesus couldn't return to fulfill prophecy. And how could anyone stop me? I wouldn't be taking some action which could be prevented; I would be defeating prophecy by not taking action.

So let me pass the preacher's question on to you. If you were "Satan", what would you do----or not do----to thwart prophecy?

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #300]
More rumbling against Spidey than Jolly Jonah in his Daily Bugle!
But fine, here you go;

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #293

I questioned his Super Intelligence, whatever you meant by it.
And you do not have his greater wisdom, so how can you tell him how he has to act on it?

You keep talking about "Satan" as if you believe that he exists. I thought you didn't.

I wonder what Satan would say to this thread.
He must be a bible and endtimes expert.
Care to make a thread where only supernormal biblical beings are allowed to parcipate besides the OP?
Then again, it could be against forum rules to dissallow humans to partizipate.
Then again, what we could learn from them if they were to write in this very forum must be tempting for you too!
The Landover Baptist forum, each christmas time makes a thread where Jesus himself answers the questions of forum members.
So why wouldnt Satan talk to you here in this forum, especially since you allegedl found for him the means for winning endtimes.

If he is all knowing, would he really make a prophecy without knowing that Satan would try to thwart it by not acting on it?

Would he really be all-knowing if the prophecy didn't come true?

There are possible snenarios where this could be arranged, yes!
For example; He could have made a prophecy while knowing it would be thwarted.
Another possibility is, that the all knowing is not meant literally. Some oriental gurus and Tao masters too, call themselves all knowing and its not much more than a title.
Or Satan shielded himself with Iron while planning to not fullfill the prophecy. Gods magic cannot penetrate iron.
Et cetera

According to bible he is guilty of insurgence against "god", of talking Eve into eating fruit, of allegedly doing mischief since then . . .

If the prophecies weren't fulfilled, how much else could be counted on to be accurate?

Why would Satan thwarting some prophecy change Satans history?
This is a Non Sequitur.

If you again dislike my answers, please tell why and then please tell us which answers you would have liked.

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #301

There are possible snenarios where this could be arranged, yes!
For example; He could have made a prophecy while knowing it would be thwarted.
Another possibility is, that the all knowing is not meant literally. Some oriental gurus and Tao masters too, call themselves all knowing and its not much more than a title.
Or Satan shielded himself with Iron while planning to not fullfill the prophecy. Gods magic cannot penetrate iron.
Et cetera

Then he wouldn't be what the Christian Bible says he is.

Why would Satan thwarting some prophecy change Satans history?
This is a Non Sequitur.

If "Satan" could thwart prophecy, which is about the future, how would it matter if his history wouldn't be changed? That's a Red Herring.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #301

There are possible snenarios where this could be arranged, yes!
For example; He could have made a prophecy while knowing it would be thwarted.
Another possibility is, that the all knowing is not meant literally. Some oriental gurus and Tao masters too, call themselves all knowing and its not much more than a title.
Or Satan shielded himself with Iron while planning to not fullfill the prophecy. Gods magic cannot penetrate iron.
Et cetera

Then he wouldn't be what the Christian Bible says he is.

It is already against christian bible that prophecy can be thwarted.
See? You do not even like anwers that follow your own context.
Is this about what answers you like, if any, or about what, accordung to your assumed context, would most logically follow?

Why would Satan thwarting some prophecy change Satans history?
This is a Non Sequitur.

If "Satan" could thwart prophecy, which is about the future, how would it matter if his history wouldn't be changed? That's a Red Herring.

You are all over the raptured place.
You asked:

If "Satan's" part in prophecy weren't fulfilled, what could he be accused of doing? If he couldn't be accused, what could he be found guilty of? If he couldn't be found guilty, how could he be punished?

I answered:

According to bible he is guilty of insurgence against "god", of talking Eve into eating fruit, of allegedly doing mischief since then . . .

You askef then:

If the prophecies weren't fulfilled, how much else could be counted on to be accurate?

On that I anwered:

Why would Satan thwarting some prophecy change Satans history?
This is a Non Sequitur.

And now you answer:

If "Satan" could thwart prophecy, which is about the future, how would it matter if his history wouldn't be changed? That's a Red Herring.

You are moving goalposts.
You mostly never answer,but only give counter questions.
Your debatin stile is without logically followimg srtringence.

You imply first that Satan cannot be accused of his past sins.
You imply later that Satans history would be changed.
You imply next that his unchanged history would not matter.

And after all that you accuse me of Red Herring.

I dont know what to do about your OP question, since you not only despise my logically reasoned answers, but also counter them without being reasonable yourself in your answers to mine.

So what shoud I or anyone do here? What more?

I tried anything to answer reasonable on your OP..

Still you despise mine and other posters answers with logically not following counter questions, answers and fallacys.

You truly act like the atheist version of William Lane Craig!

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #303

If "Satan's" part in prophecy weren't fulfilled, what could he be accused of doing? If he couldn't be accused, what could he be found guilty of? If he couldn't be found guilty, how could he be punished?

If the prophecies weren't fulfilled, how much else could be counted on to be accurate?

If "Satan" could thwart prophecy, which is about the future, how would it matter if his history wouldn't be changed?

I was suggesting that the accusation against "Satan" was unreliable, not that his history had been changed.

You truly act like the atheist version of William Lane Craig!

This would hardly be the case since I'm not an atheist.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #303

If "Satan's" part in prophecy weren't fulfilled, what could he be accused of doing? If he couldn't be accused, what could he be found guilty of? If he couldn't be found guilty, how could he be punished?

If the prophecies weren't fulfilled, how much else could be counted on to be accurate?

If "Satan" could thwart prophecy, which is about the future, how would it matter if his history wouldn't be changed?

I was suggesting that the accusation against "Satan" was unreliable, not that his history had been changed.

I spent time to think good and hard about this. Your conclusion seems to be that Satan thwarting some prophecy would in your eyes turn god into a liar and that would make everything he wrote in the bible unreliable, including Satans Sins.
That your logic? Yeah or Nay?

You truly act like the atheist version of William Lane Craig!

This would hardly be the case since I'm not an atheist.

If Jesus could act as if he were the son of god wjthout being one, why should you not be able to copycat him and act like an atheist without being one?

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #305

I spent time to think good and hard about this. Your conclusion seems to be that Satan thwarting some prophecy would in your eyes turn god into a liar and that would make everything he wrote in the bible unreliable, including Satans Sins.
That your logic? Yeah or Nay?

What I'm postulating is that the very nature of the end-time prophecies about "Satan" make them potentially self-defeating. All "Satan" would have to do is----literally----nothing in order to make the prophecies false, and false prophecy isn't something true God would give.

If Jesus could act as if he were the son of god wjthout being one, why should you not be able to copycat him and act like an atheist without being one?

You don't have to be an atheist to question the Bible.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #305

I spent time to think good and hard about this. Your conclusion seems to be that Satan thwarting some prophecy would in your eyes turn god into a liar and that would make everything he wrote in the bible unreliable, including Satans Sins.
That your logic? Yeah or Nay?

What I'm postulating is that the very nature of the end-time prophecies about "Satan" make them potentially self-defeating. All "Satan" would have to do is----literally----nothing in order to make the prophecies false, and false prophecy isn't something true God would give.

Your logical following here is problematic 'cause it does not care for all kinds of complications that rather would arise on the way, but your conclusion is just not true. It is the Mangler Argument Fallacy.

If Jesus could act as if he were the son of god wjthout being one, why should you not be able to copycat him and act like an atheist without being one?

You don't have to be an atheist to question the Bible.

Has one to be an atheist to question the Book of Mormon then?

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to The Nice Centurion in post #307

Your logical following here is problematic 'cause it does not care for all kinds of complications that rather would arise on the way, but your conclusion is just not true. It is the Mangler Argument Fallacy.

You keep referring to the "Mangler Fallacy", but I'm not familiar with it. Could you specify what it means?

Has one to be an atheist to question the Book of Mormon then?

Certainly not, but I don't see what that has to do with it.

[The Nice Centurion]

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #308]
An original complication an inactive Satan would have to face is the fact that biblical prophecy can be interpreted in any way believers find convenient so that it is seen as fullfilled no matter what happens really!

Therefore an inactive Satan would surely cause no problem for Jesus. Jesus would build on the cognitive dissonance of pressupositionalist believers and hoax everything in a way to make it seem that everything got fullfilled.

(Satans involvemend would be explained away as metapher.)

That is a probable example of why it could be really rather impossible to thwart biblical prophecy.
How do you triumph over someone who will declare himself winner, no matter what happens.


Oh yes, and the best part: We can assume that it logically follows tha Satan knows all this. And therefore he sees the impossibility of winning by inactivity. Therefore the OP question isnt easy.

[Athetotheist]

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #308]
An original complication an inactive Satan would have to face is the fact that biblical prophecy can be interpreted in any way believers find convenient so that it is seen as fullfilled no matter what happens really!

Therefore an inactive Satan would surely cause no problem for Jesus. Jesus would build on the cognitive dissonance of pressupositionalist believers and hoax everything in a way to make it seem that everything got fullfilled.

(Satans involvemend would be explained away as metapher.)

That is a probable example of why it could be really rather impossible to thwart biblical prophecy.
How do you triumph over someone who will declare himself winner, no matter what happens.


Oh yes, and the best part: We can assume that it logically follows tha Satan knows all this. And therefore he sees the impossibility of winning by inactivity. Therefore the OP question isnt easy.

So you're suggesting that if "Satan" didn't do his thing, Jesus would just jump in and take over for him? That would make Jesus a deceiver and not the true savior he's supposed to be.

You criticize me for claiming to know what "Satan" would do, yet here you are presuming to know what Jesus would do.

Interpretation is an excuse only to a certain point. If you interpret everything so loosely that anything can fulfill prophecy, you don't have prophecy.