Fornication. What really is the problem with it?

[OnceConvinced]

In another thread I was talking about sexual urges and how our inherent human nature kicks in when it comes to sex. Automatically the Christian I was debating with assumed I was talking about some form of infidelity and that infidelity had serious consequences. I agreed. However fornication is far more than just adultry. Fornication includes any type of pre-marital sex too.

So if two consenting, SINGLE adults decide ot have premarital sex and they use protection, what really is the problem with it? Why is it so wrong and what are the ramifications. And please don't bother with the answer "Because God says it's wrong". Let's try to apply some reasoning and logic to this.

Why is it so sinful?

What are the ramifications of doing it?

If there are ramifications just how serious are they and how likely are they to occur?

[OnceConvinced]

IMO, no. It's when there is unintended consequences where the people involved are unwilling or unable to take care of the child that is wrong. The act itself is not wrong. It is not willing to act responsible for the consequences that is.

Although the bible seems to condemn the act.

[OnceConvinced]

Deleted. Edited and added as a new post.

[OnceConvinced]

I do not believe that sex before marriage is wrong so long as the two consenting parties involved are responsible and mature enough to handle the possible outcomes:

Sex in many cases does not just come with the physical risks, such as unwanted pregnancies, STD's, yeast and urinary tract infections, it also comes with the emotional risk. Two people do not just meet and have sex. Generally an emotional attachment is formed before hand, due to one or both parties needing a sense of trust. Now, of course this does not include one-night stands due to substance interference (such as with alcohol). This sense of trust that comes with giving yourself to another person is something that leaves one feeling extremely vulnerable. If or when that relationship has ended, sex makes it an even more difficult break -up. Not to mention the emotional toll it would put on the potential child, should the birthcontrol fail. Whether the child is kept or put up for adoption, there would be emotional consequences to the child that never had a choice in the matter. You would need to consider this as well. I will not even attempt to express the issues facing foster children or children of single parents, not to mention the tax burden that these children of foster care and single parents pose. And while yes, these children can overcome such emotional obstacles, it is not by any means easy. Is our thirty-minute pleasure worth risking a child's well-being?

I do not believe that these outcomes would qualify a law against premarital sex, by any means. However, as previously stated, the two adults must really weigh the consequences. They are not the only two people involved, because there is the potential for life when having intercourse. I think this is a very socially responsible approach to pre-marital sex.

If protection is used, this need not become a major issue. But even if precautions failed, really what is the difference between pre-marital sex and marital sex? The same issues come up. You still might have emotional issues and there is no gaurantee any child is going to get the care they need. There is no gaurantee that the married couple will remain together either.

It seems that the issue here isn't really about sex, it's about considering the consequences of one's actions and how it might affect a person's future. However this is an issue with many things in life. Ramifications are always there when we choose an action. So why should pre-marital sex be singled out any more than anything else?

[Defender of Truth]

Why would you say cheating on a test is wrong?

What has that got to do with two consenting single adults choosing to have sex?

I'll explain. How it relates is I'm inquiring of your standard of morality; how you determine things to be right or wrong. Therefore I'm asking you why something is wrong. I'm determing what sort of evidence you're looking for.


(edit for clarification)

[OnceConvinced]

Why would you say cheating on a test is wrong?

What has that got to do with two consenting single adults choosing to have sex?

I'll explain. How it relates is I'm inquiring of your standard of morality; how you determine things to be right or wrong. Therefore I'm asking you why something is wrong. I'm determing what sort of evidence you're looking for.


(edit for clarification)

Sorry I typed that reply before I saw your other posts. I tried to get into edit it, but then starting having network issues. My standard of morality is not based on "Because God said so". It used to be. It used to be enough. But not anymore.

I asked that people use reasoning and logic to explain the "why". Saying "Because God said so" just doesn't cut it. It's quite obvious why cheating is wrong, however it's not obvious why pre-marital sex is wrong. Please explain using logic and reasoning why pre-marital sex is wrong/immoral.

There are many people on this site who do not recognise the bible as being the word of God so are not willing to accept it just because God supposedly said it. However if you wish to offer some bible verses which explain what is wrong with it (apart from the fact that it angers God and will result in him burning us in Hell), then please do.

[Defender of Truth]

It's quite obvious why cheating is wrong,

Please, humor me. I honestly don't know what your answer is. I saw McCulloch's reply, and I didn't quite buy it.

You say that cheating is wrong. I'm asking what the standard of morality is.

There are many people on this site who do not recognise the bible as being the word of God so are not willing to accept it just because God supposedly said it. However if you wish to offer some bible verses which explain what is wrong with it (apart from the fact that it angers God and will result in him burning us in Hell), then please do.

I wish not to do so. I desire to hear your evidence that cheating is wrong, and from that draw my conclusions on what type of evidence you're looking for that premarital sex is wrong.

[Goat]

One name

Bristol Palin

Never heard of her. But I did look it up on Wikipedia. I don't see your point though.

Bristol Palin's mother was a governor that push 'abstinence only' for education purposes. Because she was ignorant about birth control, and how to be responsible, she got pregnant.

It is not the act itself, but the act without being responsible that is wrong.

[OnceConvinced]

It's quite obvious why cheating is wrong,

Please, humor me. I honestly don't know what your answer is. I saw McCulloch's reply, and I didn't quite buy it.

You say that cheating is wrong. I'm asking what the standard of morality is.

It is wrong because a test is to determine one's knowledge on something or whether one can be entrusted with certain tasks. If one cheats, then they may be entrusted to perform tasks which they do not have the ability to do. This could have serious ramifications.

Not only that but the person who cheated gains benefits that they don't deserve, while others who work hard and fail get nothing. It's all about being fair to everyone and ensuring that everyone gets the same opportunities. A cheat wishes to find away around this and get something for nothing.

[OnceConvinced]

One name

Bristol Palin

Never heard of her. But I did look it up on Wikipedia. I don't see your point though.

Bristol Palin's mother was a governor that push 'abstinence only' for education purposes. Because she was ignorant about birth control, and how to be responsible, she got pregnant.

It is not the act itself, but the act without being responsible that is wrong.

Fair enough. It's like anything you do, isn't it? One needs to consider the possible ramifications of one's actions.

It seems to me though that the bible condemns simply just the act.

[Goat]

One name

Bristol Palin

Never heard of her. But I did look it up on Wikipedia. I don't see your point though.

Bristol Palin's mother was a governor that push 'abstinence only' for education purposes. Because she was ignorant about birth control, and how to be responsible, she got pregnant.

It is not the act itself, but the act without being responsible that is wrong.

Fair enough. It's like anything you do, isn't it? One needs to consider the possible ramifications of one's actions.

It seems to me though that the bible condemns simply just the act.

The bible doesn't say why it condemns the act.

And we really can't ask the people who wrote it.