Once saved

[Menotu]

Is this true?
My grandfather is a retired minister (and an abusive father and husband I should point out). He taught his church that the concept of 'once saved always saved' is true. Many in the city I grew up in attended that church - and many still do even though he's no longer preaching.
Is the concept of 'once saved always saved' true? It is, as I understand it (I didn't attend his church) is once Jesus saves you from your sin, nothing you can do past blasphemy can prohibit you from getting in to heaven. It seems it was a 'once forgiven all future sin will be forgiven'.

I wonder if it's worth mentioning that many members of this church appear to be anything but Christian; from abusers, to adulterers to thieves - with the exception of murderers, most all of them continue to run the course of continued sinners (and not the "we've all sinned" type but the 'I sinned yesterday and will sin tomorrow" type.)

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by Menotu]

Well it's not a biblical teaching...Jesus said one has to endure to the end to be saved. As one of Jehovah's Witnesses I do believe we are saved from a life of sin, separated from the True and living God, but if we do not maintain our faith we risk turning back to what Paul called the "weak and beggerly things" of this world.

Remeber, warned Jesus, the wife of Lot.


JW




RELATED POSTS

If we are all imperfect and bound to sin, does that mean that God is obliged out of fairness to automatically save everyone, irrespective of their actions and choices?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 451#893451

Does exercising faith in Jesus involve "sin and morality"?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 463#893463

[onewithhim]

Is this true?
My grandfather is a retired minister (and an abusive father and husband I should point out). He taught his church that the concept of 'once saved always saved' is true. Many in the city I grew up in attended that church - and many still do even though he's no longer preaching.
Is the concept of 'once saved always saved' true? It is, as I understand it (I didn't attend his church) is once Jesus saves you from your sin, nothing you can do past blasphemy can prohibit you from getting in to heaven. It seems it was a 'once forgiven all future sin will be forgiven'.

I wonder if it's worth mentioning that many members of this church appear to be anything but Christian; from abusers, to adulterers to thieves - with the exception of murderers, most all of them continue to run the course of continued sinners (and not the "we've all sinned" type but the 'I sinned yesterday and will sin tomorrow" type.)

Those actions of the church members are to be expected with a doctrine like that. It is absolutely not true. If it were true, people could do what they want and not have to think about repercussions. Where they get this idea, I can't imagine. It's got to be some man's idea to draw people to his church. Now everybody in Christendom teaches it. The easy Christian life! It's funny---Jesus said we would have to put up with some pretty troublesome things along the way to life. (Matthew 7:13,14 and 21-23) And we have to continue to obey what the Father says through him. Continue! That means we have to be at it constantly and never stop.

"Indeed, you who were once alienated and enemies because your minds were on the works that were wicked, he has now reconciled by means of that one's fleshly body through his death, in order to present you holy and unblemished and open to no accusation before him---provided, of course, that you CONTINUE in the faith, established on the foundation and steadfast, not being SHIFTED AWAY from the hope of that good news that you heard." (Colossians 1:21-23)

So we CAN be shifted away from the hope if we discontinue our obedience to the principles and laws of God. There is nothing in the Scriptures that indicates that we are "always saved" no matter what we do.

See also Hebrews 10:26-31.



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[Menotu]

[Replying to post 3 by onewithhim]

It is absolutely not true. If it were true, people could do what they want and not have to think about repercussions.

I thought this as well. It's rather convenient TBH. But why is it not true? What in the bible points this to being false?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 4 by Menotu]

Did you read my entire post?

[Menotu]

[Replying to post 4 by Menotu]

Did you read my entire post?

I did
I didn't see anything where you explained your POV as to why it's specifically not true.

There is nothing in the Scriptures that indicates that we are "always saved" no matter what we do.

This would seem to indicate there is something in scripture that says you're, for lack of a better phrase, not always saved, yes? Or are we to assume because there's nothing there, that will suffice?
Unless I'm missing something. Admittedly having the flu, I am a bit...disconnected... today

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 4 by Menotu]

Did you read my entire post?

I did
I didn't see anything where you explained your POV as to why it's specifically not true.

There is nothing in the Scriptures that indicates that we are "always saved" no matter what we do.

This would seem to indicate there is something in scripture that says you're, for lack of a better phrase, not always saved, yes? Or are we to assume because there's nothing there, that will suffice?
Unless I'm missing something. Admittedly having the flu, I am a bit...disconnected... today

You didn't see half of my post. I showed you what Colossians 1:21-23 says about having to CONTINUE on the path to life and not be SHIFTED AWAY....showing that it is possible ,after you have believed in Jesus and walked for awhile with him, to shift away off that path to life. I also referred you to Hebrews 10:26-31. There are many more points to consider, but didn't you get anything out of those Scriptural citings?


.

[Menotu]

[Replying to post 4 by Menotu]

Did you read my entire post?

I did
I didn't see anything where you explained your POV as to why it's specifically not true.

There is nothing in the Scriptures that indicates that we are "always saved" no matter what we do.

This would seem to indicate there is something in scripture that says you're, for lack of a better phrase, not always saved, yes? Or are we to assume because there's nothing there, that will suffice?
Unless I'm missing something. Admittedly having the flu, I am a bit...disconnected... today

You didn't see half of my post. I showed you what Colossians 1:21-23 says about having to CONTINUE on the path to life and not be SHIFTED AWAY....showing that it is possible ,after you have believed in Jesus and walked for awhile with him, to shift away off that path to life. I also referred you to Hebrews 10:26-31. There are many more points to consider, but didn't you get anything out of those Scriptural citings?


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I saw those, but I was asking you to say what it means in your own words, not simply citing verses. But thanks anyway.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 3 by onewithhim]

Those actions of the church members are to be expected with a doctrine like that. It is absolutely not true. If it were true, people could do what they want and not have to think about repercussions. Where they get this idea, I can't imagine. It's got to be some man's idea to draw people to his church.Now everybody in Christendom teaches it. The easy Christian life! d'oh!

Come on, onewithhim, please be more thoughtful and careful in what you say!

I agree with most of your post, but cannot overlook what I have bolded.

It is a gross over-generalisation that is therefore untrue and unfair.

[2timothy316]

OSAS might be the worst teaching ever imagined. Perhaps it's only equal is, "When anyone else does it, it's illegal, but when I do it, it's not."