Should An Islamic Mosque Be Built At Ground Zero?

[WinePusher]

In New York City, there is a contreversy on whether or not to construct a Mosque near the grounds of the 9/11 attack. This is completly outraegous and infuriating because no one seems to be able to answer the question Why There? Why build a Islamic mosque at the site of a place that was destroyed by Islamic Jihadists? I'm sure there are plently of other land space where a mosque can be built, but why have these Muslims decided to build it so close to Ground Zero? Are they oblivious to the fact that at that area, thousands of americans were killed by Muslim Jihadists?

Should a mosque be built at ground zero?

[otseng]

You are a Muslim hater.

Oh, the irony in the last two sentances. You're one of the bigger evangelists here.

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[McCulloch]

The only reason why he wants the mosque there is because he thinks it will promote healing and unity. He is doing it specifically because of the fact that the 9/11 towers were brought down by people who followed the Islamic faith. He is foolish and wrong. It has not promoted any type of healing and it has done a disservice to the Muslim community. This mosque has done nothing to make Americans more accepting of Muslims, in fact it has done the exact opposite.

Yes, we wouldn't want to allow anyone to take measures to promote healing and unity.

I NEVER SAID THAT. I said that this Mosque does not promote healing and unity, it has done the exact opposite.

So the essence of the problem is that you and he have a difference of opinion. He thinks that it will promote healing and unity. You think that it will do the opposite. At this point in time, you both have very different opinions on this. Now, how is it that you believe that our governments should act when there is a difference of opinion on a religious matter? Should a government (local or state) prohibit the building of a religious meeting place because someone who does not share the faith of the people building the mosque, church, chapel, cathedral or temple thinks that the local population might object? Think of the precedent.

The Catholic convent that was going to be built near a Holocaust concentration camp was not representative of the extremist version of Catholic that some of the Nazis followed, yet the Pope still had enough human decency to move it away. I guess Muslims have no shame.

Now who is being sarcastic?

[WinePusher]

I NEVER SAID THAT. I said that this Mosque does not promote healing and unity, it has done the exact opposite.

So the essence of the problem is that you and he have a difference of opinion. He thinks that it will promote healing and unity. You think that it will do the opposite. At this point in time, you both have very different opinions on this.

No, it's not a matter of opinion. The reaction to the Mosque has been positive, it has been negative. The majority of American people and YNew York City residents view the Mosque as inappropriate thus the shameful Imam has not achieved his desired goal of bringing about peace and unity. Instead, he has brought about divison and hatred.

Now, how is it that you believe that our governments should act when there is a difference of opinion on a religious matter? Should a government (local or state) prohibit the building of a religious meeting place because someone who does not share the faith of the people building the mosque, church, chapel, cathedral or temple thinks that the local population might object?

No. I never suggested anything along these lines. You can go back and read the 80+ pages of debate if you don't believe me.

The Catholic convent that was going to be built near a Holocaust concentration camp was not representative of the extremist version of Catholic that some of the Nazis followed, yet the Pope still had enough human decency to move it away. I guess Muslims have no shame.

Now who is being sarcastic?

Not me. I brought up a very serious point that refuted your argument regarding Wahabi Islam and whaddya know, you just ignored it.

[Danmark]

I NEVER SAID THAT. I said that this Mosque does not promote healing and unity, it has done the exact opposite.

So the essence of the problem is that you and he have a difference of opinion. He thinks that it will promote healing and unity. You think that it will do the opposite. At this point in time, you both have very different opinions on this.

No, it's not a matter of opinion. The reaction to the Mosque has been positive, it has been negative. The majority of American people and YNew York City residents view the Mosque as inappropriate thus the shameful Imam has not achieved his desired goal of bringing about peace and unity. Instead, he has brought about divison and hatred.

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

It may indeed have been a miscalculation on their part. Perhaps they underestimated the hurt and anger or intolerance of their Christian brothers. But don't the Christians and others who have taken offense have some responsibility to understand the good motives involved?

Why is it the fault of he who has good motives when the intolerant take offense?
The difference of opinion is clear. Some thought building the Mosque would have a good effect. Some thought the opposite. Each had his opinion.

What is wrong with trying to do good? If others interpret good intentions as evil acts, do you think it right to blame the one with the good intention? Perhaps the one who misinterprets or projects evil intent should consider blaming himself.

[WinePusher]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

[East of Eden]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

Exactly, it would be like the Japanese erecting a Shinto temple at Pearl Harbor, and saying the US had it coming. That statement should have forever disqualified Rauf from being involved in a Ground Zero mosque. Of course we sometimes see similar statements from the left, so I see why they're not upset.

[Danmark]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

I certainly agree that not only moderate, but all mainstream Muslims should condemn all acts of terror. As I wrote steps in another subtopic Muslims need to convince the extremists to end these acts. One Muslim act of terror or criminal act does more to injure their cause than any amount of his preaching can undo.

But American citizens, whatever their religion or belief system should not be cowed by the religious majority. More Christians should speak up against the folly and evil extremism represented by, for example, the Westboro Baptist Church.

[East of Eden]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

I certainly agree that not only moderate, but all mainstream Muslims should condemn all acts of terror. As I wrote steps in another subtopic Muslims need to convince the extremists to end these acts. One Muslim act of terror or criminal act does more to injure their cause than any amount of his preaching can undo.

The problem is it isn't just a tiny minority that hold extreme views, the real moderates seem to have been intimidated into silence.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages ... -polls.htm

But American citizens, whatever their religion or belief system should not be cowed by the religious majority. More Christians should speak up against the folly and evil extremism represented by, for example, the Westboro Baptist Church.

You're changing the subject, and in an irrelevant way. There is no equivalency between Westboro, a tiny group (mostly related) condemned by all Christians I know of who have never hurt a fly and a religious group that have committed 15,000 terror attacks since 9/11 and just yesterday beheaded an innocent man on the streets of London and burned 100 cars in Sweden. Westboro doing any of that?

[Danmark]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

I certainly agree that not only moderate, but all mainstream Muslims should condemn all acts of terror. As I wrote steps in another subtopic Muslims need to convince the extremists to end these acts. One Muslim act of terror or criminal act does more to injure their cause than any amount of his preaching can undo.

The problem is it isn't just a tiny minority that hold extreme views, the real moderates seem to have been intimidated into silence.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages ... -polls.htm

But American citizens, whatever their religion or belief system should not be cowed by the religious majority. More Christians should speak up against the folly and evil extremism represented by, for example, the Westboro Baptist Church.

You're changing the subject, and in an irrelevant way. There is no equivalency between Westboro, a tiny group (mostly related) condemned by all Christians I know of who have never hurt a fly and a religious group that have committed 15,000 terror attacks since 9/11 and just yesterday beheaded an innocent man on the streets of London and burned 100 cars in Sweden. Westboro doing any of that?

As I've indicated, I am no fan or apologist for Islam, or any religion. It is hardly changing the subject to suggest that Christianity be judged by the same standard they use to judge Islam.

The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also.
_ Mark Twain

I believe that Islam is going thru a phase that Christianity went thru Centuries ago. Christians were no less terrorists and holy, violent Crusaders than some Muslims are today. And Christian terrorism has not gone away. It still exists, tho' mainly in a less violent form. The large segment of Christianity that condemns homosexuality as a sin, continues to injure people by its intolerance. When the Bachmanns and others advocate and perform their unethical and cruel and damaging 'therapy' on young people to try to change their nature to fit the personal convictions of the majority, the violence they do to the psyche of these children should not be ignored.

I am simply suggesting that the admonition of Jesus, to first take the log out of your own eye, be observed.

[East of Eden]

It is good of you to agree the desired goal of the Mosque builders was to bring about 'peace and unity.'

Yea, I thought that was his goal. If he was genuine and sincere about it he would have backed off when the American people expressed their indignation towards this abomidable Mosque. He is not a moderate, he is a radical and his statements have exposed him. A real moderate would have condemned Hamas is an agent of terrorism, which he didn't. A real moderate would not have said that the United States is an accesary to terrorism or that Bin Laden is made in America, which he did.

I certainly agree that not only moderate, but all mainstream Muslims should condemn all acts of terror. As I wrote steps in another subtopic Muslims need to convince the extremists to end these acts. One Muslim act of terror or criminal act does more to injure their cause than any amount of his preaching can undo.

The problem is it isn't just a tiny minority that hold extreme views, the real moderates seem to have been intimidated into silence.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages ... -polls.htm

But American citizens, whatever their religion or belief system should not be cowed by the religious majority. More Christians should speak up against the folly and evil extremism represented by, for example, the Westboro Baptist Church.

You're changing the subject, and in an irrelevant way. There is no equivalency between Westboro, a tiny group (mostly related) condemned by all Christians I know of who have never hurt a fly and a religious group that have committed 15,000 terror attacks since 9/11 and just yesterday beheaded an innocent man on the streets of London and burned 100 cars in Sweden. Westboro doing any of that?

As I've indicated, I am no fan or apologist for Islam, or any religion. It is hardly changing the subject to suggest that Christianity be judged by the same standard they use to judge Islam.

Fine, where are these thousands of Christian terror attacks that make you feel it is an equivalent situation with Islam? It would be like me saying atheism also needs to be judged by the same standard, they aren't doing such crimes, these days.

I believe that Islam is going thru a phase that Christianity went thru Centuries ago. Christians were no less terrorists and holy, violent Crusaders than some Muslims are today.

The Crusades were arguably a counter offensive against Muslim expansion, and in no way comparable with what happened in London or Sweden yesterday. You're really reaching if you have to go back to such a gray area centuries ago, especially since Jesus never harmed anyone. The Jihadists are following the word and deed of the 'prophet'.

And Christian terrorism has not gone away. It still exists, tho' mainly in a less violent form. The large segment of Christianity that condemns homosexuality as a sin, continues to injure people by its intolerance. When the Bachmanns and others advocate and perform their unethical and cruel and damaging 'therapy' on young people to try to change their nature to fit the personal convictions of the majority, the violence they do to the psyche of these children should not be ignored.

Complete nonsense, I care about what people do, not what they say and think. If someone wants to undergo such therapy, what business is it of yours? I also believe in the traditional Christian teaching that homosexual activity is a sin, and it is insulting not to mention irrational to equate such beliefs with Islamic terror. Maybe you want to put the Pope on a terror watch list?