The Roman Crucifixion

[placebofactor]

The Crucifixion:
I wrote the following some 25 years ago. I do not recall the name of the doctor who did the research concerning the human body when put through the torture of crucifixion. But I remember how it moved me. We read casually about the punishment and crucifixion, not fully getting the impact and degree of suffering.

The Persians between 539 B.C. and 335 B.C. were the inventors of the Crucifixion. They tied their victims to a single stake and left them there to die a slow and agonizing death. Eventually, around 100 B.C., the Romans picked up on this form of torture and death, then brought it to a new level of pain and eventual death. The word ‘excruciating’ did not exist until Christ was crucified. Excruciating interpreted means, “Pain out of the cross.”

Jesus' suffering began in earnest at Gethsemane. It was the day before the Jewish Passover, in early April of 31 A.D. Luke 22:44, “And being in agony he (Jesus) prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood.” because blood may have been mixed with his sweat, he would have been under great physiological stress.

He was then blindfolded and then taken to the high priest’s palace where he was falsely accused of blasphemy, spit on, and beaten. He was then taken to Pilate, and here was Pilate’s offer to the people.
Matthew 27:17, “Who will you that I release unto you? Barabbas or Jesus which is called Christ? And the crowd answered “Barabbas.” They also cried out, “Let his blood be on us, and on our children.”

Barabbas means “son of the Father.” The people called for the “son of God, so they called for Barabbas. The Roman soldiers mocked him, stripped him, put a scarlet robe on him, then made a crown of thorns and placed it on his head. The thorns that grow in that area are two inches in length. The soldiers would have pressed the thorns down on his head cutting deeply into the flesh. They then bowed down mocking him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!”

Isaiah gives further details concerning Jesus' punishment. Isaiah 53:3, He was despised, rejected,” --- Verse 4, “Surely he hath born our griefs and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten”--- wounded, bruised, and “with his stripes” we are healed.”

The Roman whip consists of three braided pieces of rawhide, attached to a round wooden handle, the last 12 inches were not braided. At the ends of the three lashes were tied pieces of sheep bone and iron lead balls. The iron balls would cause deep contusions in the skin tissue, and the bone would cause deep lacerations in the skin, tendons, and muscles under the skin.

The victim was tied to a post, and the Roman soldier doing the lashing would whip the upper back and work their way down the legs. He would move to the other side and repeat his work. When finished, there would be deep cuts and trauma to the back and legs. The blood loss would be significant, causing a significant drop in his blood pressure. Normally 39 lashes were required by law, but the Romans were not obligated to Jewish law, and depending on their mood no count was necessary.

The crossbeam Jesus carried is estimated to weigh 75 to 100 lbs. When they arrived where the sentence was to be carried out, the crossbeam was nailed to the vertical beam that lay on the ground. He was then laid down on top of the vertical beam his arms in a horizontal position before being nailed to it. The nails used were about 6” long and ¼ inch square. They were driven into the wrist just below the carpal bones, considered part of the hand back then. The nails crushed the median nerve and carpal tunnel causing a great deal of excruciating pain. Then the feet were nailed down into the vertical beam. But before they were nailed down, the knees would have to be bent to bring the feet down flat on the beam. The driven nail would crush the medial plantar nerve causing great pain throughout his body.

When finished, the vertical beam was lifted and set in place. When this happened, the weight of Jesus' body would be pulled downward, placing a great deal of pressure on the elbow and shoulder joints, as well as the nails in his feet being driven up into the bones of the feet. It is estimated that the load on his elbow and shoulder joints was between 150 to 200 lbs. on each arm. This would cause the bones of his joints to separate, lengthening his arms six inches. What prevented the arms from tearing off were the tendons and muscles.

In this position, breathing out was much more difficult than breathing in. To exhale, the Lord had to push down on the nails holding his feet to the beam to raise himself. Each time he would make this move, the open flesh on his back would rub up and down on the beam.

Eventually, in his condition, the blood became filled with carbon dioxide causing him to suffocate. Also, from the loss of blood, he would become very thirsty as his tongue would cleave to the roof of his mouth. Due to the loss of blood, he would go into bulimic shock and eventually die of heart failure.

The Roman guard then plunged a spear into the right side of his heart causing blood and water to come out through the wound, proving that he was dead. If he had been alive, they would have broken both of his legs.
So, the next time you look at, or speak of the man hanging from the cross, understand fully what he suffered for every one of us. Also, have you ever considered how the Lord feels when we fail him in words, deeds, motives, and love?

[JehovahsWitness]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

[Capbook]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

[onewithhim]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

[placebofactor]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

It makes no difference what it was, it's the weight in question. 200 to 300 lbs, 15 feet in length, carried over rough terrain, by a 140 to 150 Lb. man, who had been beaten, was thirsty, and bleeding, carried 1/2 mile. I don't think so. Now a crossbeam, 6 foot, weight 40 or 60 lbs. Yes, that's reasonable.

[onewithhim]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

It makes no difference what it was, it's the weight in question. 200 to 300 lbs, 15 feet in length, carried over rough terrain, by a 140 to 150 Lb. man, who had been beaten, was thirsty, and bleeding, carried 1/2 mile. I don't think so. Now a crossbeam, 6 foot, weight 40 or 60 lbs. Yes, that's reasonable.

Jesus was a strong man with the ability to bench press more pounds than you speak of, I would bet on it. 140 to 150 lb man?? You think he was a little weakling. I don't.

[placebofactor]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

It makes no difference what it was, it's the weight in question. 200 to 300 lbs, 15 feet in length, carried over rough terrain, by a 140 to 150 Lb. man, who had been beaten, was thirsty, and bleeding, carried 1/2 mile. I don't think so. Now a crossbeam, 6 foot, weight 40 or 60 lbs. Yes, that's reasonable.

Jesus was a strong man with the ability to bench press more pounds than you speak of, I would bet on it. 140 to 150 lb man?? You think he was a little weakling. I don't.

Yes, but in the article My God, My God there were Witnesses who claimed Jesus was so weak and out of it he was speaking to his Father. So, carrying the cross he was strong, on the cross he was weak. Hmmmm, I don't think so.

[JehovahsWitness]

Yes, but in the article My God, My God there were Witnesses who claimed Jesus was so weak and out of it he was speaking to his Father. ....

Which article are you refering to? Are you referring to Watchtower* article?


* "The Watchtower," is the official publication of Jehovah's Witnesses

[onewithhim]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

It makes no difference what it was, it's the weight in question. 200 to 300 lbs, 15 feet in length, carried over rough terrain, by a 140 to 150 Lb. man, who had been beaten, was thirsty, and bleeding, carried 1/2 mile. I don't think so. Now a crossbeam, 6 foot, weight 40 or 60 lbs. Yes, that's reasonable.

Jesus was a strong man with the ability to bench press more pounds than you speak of, I would bet on it. 140 to 150 lb man?? You think he was a little weakling. I don't.

Yes, but in the article My God, My God there were Witnesses who claimed Jesus was so weak and out of it he was speaking to his Father. So, carrying the cross he was strong, on the cross he was weak. Hmmmm, I don't think so.

I don't believe anyone of JWs thinks Jesus was a weakling. He did become weakened after his torturous night of abuse, as any strong man would. He was in unbelievable pain, and yes he probably was crying out to his Father. Have you ever read anywhere what a crucifixion is like? It's too horrible for anyone to imagine. Any strong man would collapse under the treatment of the Romans.

Carrying a "cross-bar" of the "cross" would have been relatively a piece of cake. Carrying the whole pole would mean needing help, which he needed.

[placebofactor]

Deuteronomy 21:22, "If a man committed a sin worthy of death, and he is put to death, and thou hang him on a tree: his body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but you shall in any wise bury him that day; that your land be not defiled, which the LORD the God giveth thee for an inheritance."

EZRA 6:11 - King James Version

Also I have made a decree, that whosoever shall alter this word, let timber [Aramaic ’a‘, corresponding to the Hebrew term ‛ets, ] be pulled down from his house, and being set up, let him be hanged thereon; and let his house be made a dunghill for this

Source STRONGS #6086 : https://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebib ... .htm#S6086

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Okay....

You're welcome.



RELATED POSTS

Could Jesus have carried a full length beam of wood strong enough to hold his weight in execution?
viewtopic.php?p=1162816#p1162816

Does the Hebrew word `ets have to refer to a literal tree?
viewtopic.php?p=1164454#p1164454

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH

Greek Septuagint of Ezra 6:11, which Bible lexicon defined "timber" in Greek "xulon" and one of the definition is "a cross" etc.

Ezr 6:11 And G2532  from G575  me G1473  was rendered G5087  a decree, G1106  that G3754  every G3956  man G444  who G3739  ever G302  changes G236 G3588  this word G4487 G3778  [4shall be demolished G2507  1 the timber G3586  2of G1537 G3588  3his house], G3614 G1473  and G2532  a stake being straight up G3718.1  he shall be pitched G4078  upon G1909  it, G1473  and G2532 G3588  his house G3624 G1473  will be G1510.8.3  for G1519  ravaging. G1282.2 

G3586 (Thayer)
ξύλον xulon
Thayer Definition:
1) wood
1a) that which is made of wood
1a1) as a beam from which any one is suspended, a gibbet, a cross
1a2) a log or timber with holes in which the feet, hands, neck of prisoners were inserted and fastened with thongs
1a3) a fetter, or shackle for the feet
1a4) a cudgel, stick, staff
2) a tree

Your own Thayer definition says also that "xylon" could be a beam, a log or timber, even a tree.

It makes no difference what it was, it's the weight in question. 200 to 300 lbs, 15 feet in length, carried over rough terrain, by a 140 to 150 Lb. man, who had been beaten, was thirsty, and bleeding, carried 1/2 mile. I don't think so. Now a crossbeam, 6 foot, weight 40 or 60 lbs. Yes, that's reasonable.

Jesus was a strong man with the ability to bench press more pounds than you speak of, I would bet on it. 140 to 150 lb man?? You think he was a little weakling. I don't.

Yes, but in the article My God, My God there were Witnesses who claimed Jesus was so weak and out of it he was speaking to his Father. So, carrying the cross he was strong, on the cross he was weak. Hmmmm, I don't think so.

You rote, "I don't believe anyone of JWs thinks Jesus was a weakling."

Never said he was a weakling, I said he was weak from his beatings.

You wrote, "He did become weakened after his torturous night of abuse, as any strong man would. He was in unbelievable pain,"

Correct.

You wrote, "and yes he probably was crying out to his Father."

"Why would he cry out to the Father? His Father sent him, he came of his own free will, he knew he was going to die, and he knew the only way to save, or to redeem mankind was to die for all men. Tead this verse carefully, it tells the whole story.

John 10:17-18, Jesus is speaking to the Jews when he says to them, "My Father loves me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man takes it (his life) from me, but I lay it down of myself, I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again."

It is impossible to put it in words plainer than that. Jesus emphatically expresses the absolute willingness to die for us. And as he hung from the cross, conscience, he was aware that his life was his own.
This was the highest act Jesus could show and give for the love of his Father. It was to lay down his life for his sheep at the Father's "command."

You wrote, "Have you ever read anywhere what a crucifixion is like? It's too horrible for anyone to imagine. Any strong man would collapse under the treatment of the Romans."

Yes, I posted an article on the pain Jesus must have suffered, I forgot what the title was. Most likely "The crucifixion." It should be on the first or second page of articles.

There is nothing in the Bible that indicates Jesus was a strong man either. Somewhere in the scriptures, it tells us he was no different in stature than another Jewish man.

Carrying a "cross-bar" of the "cross" would have been relatively a piece of cake. Carrying the whole pole would mean needing help, which he needed.

I had written before. when I went through boot camp in the Marines, four of us had to pick up a 400 lb. log and carry it 100 yards. Three of us could have done it, two very strong 300 lb. men may have been able to do it, maybe. but not one man, now way! Not 300, or 200. As I stated before, my nephew is a Witness, he is also a builder. I phoned him and asked him how much a 15-foot pole 12" in width would weigh. i did not tell him why I needed the info. He figured it out and said 650 Lbs. Then I asked him about a 9" pole 15 long, he came up with, depending on the wood, 200 to 300 lbs. The wood in the area of Jerusalem is mostly Cedar or Fir, not heavy but certainly not light. When I told him why I needed the info, he agreed with me that one man, any man could not have carried that much weight over rough terrain 1/2 mile.

So, I conclude, Jesus carried the crossbeam that weighed between 40 and 80 pounds, depending on its length.

[JehovahsWitness]

I had written before.

All This has been refuted.

HOW HEAVY WAS THE STAUROS?




We cannot possibly know exactly but to make a rough approximation see below :

LENGTH : According to a 2018 study [1] a mans overhead reach can be calculate at 1.40×h+11.22; so a 6ft (183cm) man would have a maximum reach of about 8.5 feet. Obviously this is from feet to fingertips but jesus was probably attached by his wrists which were certainly not fully extended (if the victim was stretched to this maximum and suspended he would die in minutes), so even allowing for a very tall man, only about 8 feet of exposed wood would be necessary to execute with maximum economy of material¤. If one third its length needed to be imbedded into the ground for stability, a 12 foot pole, imbedded 4 feet into the ground would leave more than enough wood exposed to nail a 6 ft man* and a sign.

* Jesus may well have been several inches short of 6ft.

¤ NOTE The Romans were extremely efficient and there is no reason to think they would have wasted time and resources suspending the execution victim 2.5 off the ground, if the end could be achieve with less. From the moment the victim was off the ground, even if it were a matter of inches , the inevitable would have been achieved.

DIMENSIONS According to the website elitetrimworks.com the loadbearing capacity in pounds of a wooden column 6'inches in diameter is 4,000 lbs


source : https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wood ... _1834.html

Following the above engineering chart a wooden post 6x6 inches (15cm) should be able to support 1800 lbs (18 kips) in weight so there is no doubt at all that a pole /beam of 6x6 inches could easily support the weight of an adult male

MATERIAL

The Romans would have used any suitable wood locally available for their executions. Archaeologist Vassilios Tzaferis' famous 1968 heel bone excavation, dating from first century Jerusalem [2], established that olive wood was used at the time and would of course have been abundant in the region.

The website "The wood database" [3] lists European Olivewood (Olea europaea) as weighing an average of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot (980 kg per cubic meter) when dried. Using Olivewood as an example, we can do the following calculations.


CALCULATION

A 12 foot pole of olivewood, with a circumference of 15 cm would give us a volume of 2.36 cubic feet (about 3 cubic feet for a beam). So at a weight of 61.2 lbs per cubic foot, the stauros would have weighed approximately 140 to 185 lbs depending on its shape.

VARIANTS

Or course lighter woods (the lightest of which is cedar) is also a possibility :

CEDAR 20-23 Ibs/ m3 (×3) = 60-69 Ibs
CYPRESS 32 Ibs/ m3 (x3) = 98 Ibs

Is it reasonable to believe that the Romans would have chosen one of the ultra heavy woods available? If dragging the stauros through the streets was part of the humiliation ritual , serving as a warning to others, its unlikely the Romans would have chosen a wood too heavy for a man to actually move. And since the purpose was to execute the victim on a wood that, in the desired proportions, would support his weight , no additional value would have been added by choosing an ultra heavy wood better suited for construction or defensive purposes

CONCLUSION Depending in the actual dimensions and material used, a full length stauros could have weighed anything from 60 to 185 pounds. Choosing a medium of the two extemes (60+185/2) we come to a conservative guess of just over 100 Ibs. (122.5)

[1] https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.117 ... %97h+33.34.

[2]https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinaki ... ent-world/

[3] https://www.wood-database.com/olive/#:~ ... 07.7%25%2C

FURTHER READING

Now if crucified with his hands above his head, we would need at least another 18” more than his height. So, 5’6” + 18” = 7 feet. Above his hands was a sign, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” Now let's add one foot for the posted sign. Now we have the 7 + 1 = 8 foot. A pole would have to be placed into the ground at least 4’ for it to stand upright, especially with the weight of a man nailed to it. So now we would have at a minimum a 12-foot post.

"... if it was six inches (15 centimeters) in diameter and twelve feet (3.6 meters) long, it probably weighed little more than a hundred pounds (45 kilograms).—Mark 15:21." Vol II p. 825

Emphasis MINE

To learn more please go to other posts related to
THE RANSOM SACRIFICE , THE EXECUTION OF CHRIST and ... MEMORIAL OF CHRIST'S DEATH