Why can't everyone understand the Bible?

[2timothy316]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

[bjs1]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

I disagree with this premise. I have found that most people agree on what it is that the Bible says the majority of the time. There are a variety of tertiary issue – such as the role of women specifically in church leadership – that are murky in the scriptures. People often exaggerate the importance of some texts while suppressing the importance of others in order to come to a disagreement. However, in most areas most people agree on what the Bible teaches.

No they don't. It is taught in the churches that Jesus is God, and there are those who say no, he is the SON of God.

99% of self-described Christians subscribe to creeds that say the Son of God is God. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the only significant group that disagrees with this, and they make up less than ½ of 1% of Christians. So it seems fair to say that most people do agree.

If you wish to prove me wrong it should be easy. Just name any significant group of Christians - say, any group making up more than 1% of Christians - who says that the Bible does not teach that Jesus is God.

It is a belief that there is a literal fiery hell, yet some do not believe this sacrilege.

Again, virtually all Christian groups say that hell is real. They may disagree on the nuance here – is “fire” literal or symbolic – but they agree on the substance of the idea.

Some people believe that the "soul" lives on when you die. Others do not believe this.

Once more, virtually all Christians believe in the “soul” that does not die when the body dies.

I have mentioned this before, but if I were part of the 1% who read the Bible and came up with a completely different understanding than 99% of people who read the Bible then I would be deeply concerned. I am at least humble enough to admit that if I am in a room of 1,000 people, I am not one of the only 10 people smart enough to figure out what the scriptures say. It is far more likely that I was the one in error.

However, it is clear that most people do agree on what the Bible says, at least in substance if not in every minor detail.

This is because "the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through." (2Corinthians 4:4) Satan is hard at work, fooling people into believing lies. We must pray for understanding, and we must pray to the right God. (Psalm 83:18, KJV)

May I assume that you are not so arrogant as to think that you are part of a tiny elite who is somehow immune to the Enemy’s tricks?

[Capbook]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

The answer is because the Word of God was written in parables.

Matthew 13:34–35 (KJV 1900)
All these things spake Jesus (The Word of God) unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them: 35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

The entire Old Testament is a historical parable, meaning, that it all literally took place as its written, but is using the historical record to conceal his spiritual truth. This is why most Christians think that they agree on what the Bible says, because they can all read and comprehend the historical record (Christian or not). But the doctrines they develop, while thinking they all agree on what the Bible says, could not be further apart, like free will vs election, once saved always saved vs loss of salvation, who Jesus is, the role of women, hell, the tribulation, etc.

God specifically wrote the Bible to cause confusion among those who think they are children of God, yet never were.

Matthew 13:10–16 (KJV 1900)
And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. 13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. 14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: 15 For this people’s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them. 16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

This truth of parables is the most widely neglected truth among "Christians", which is precisely why debates arise from looking at the Bible as a plainly written document. But this was by design.

Proverbs 25:2 (KJV 1900)
It is the glory of God to conceal a thing (a WORD):
But the honour of kings (the true children of God) is to search out a matter(a WORD).

I agree of the verses you quoted but one of your statement may I rephrase; from confusion to non-understanding.
You say, "God specifically wrote the Bible to cause confusion (non-understanding) among those who think they are children of God, yet never were".
As 1 Corinthians 14:33 says;
For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.(KJV)

Peace.

[JehovahsWitness]

This is because "the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through." (2Corinthians 4:4) Satan is hard at work, fooling people into believing lies. We must pray for understanding, and we must pray to the right God. (Psalm 83:18, KJV)

May I assume that you are not so arrogant as to think that you are part of a tiny elite who is somehow immune to the Enemy’s tricks?

Its not arrogant to believe Jesus came to set us free from Satan's lies. Nor is it "arrogant" to believe Jesus promise of illumination has affected us personally ?

JOHN 8:12

Jesus spoke again to them, saying: “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will by no means walk in darkness, but will possess the light of life.”

[Waterfall]

[Replying to JehovahsWitness in post #63]

Namaskaram...

Do you understand this...

But when the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together. And one of them, a lawyer, asked him a question to test him. “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Let us inspire our brothers and sisters...







Your friend forever

Waterfall

[Eddie Ramos]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

The answer is because the Word of God was written in parables.

Matthew 13:34–35 (KJV 1900)
All these things spake Jesus (The Word of God) unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them: 35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

The entire Old Testament is a historical parable, meaning, that it all literally took place as its written, but is using the historical record to conceal his spiritual truth. This is why most Christians think that they agree on what the Bible says, because they can all read and comprehend the historical record (Christian or not). But the doctrines they develop, while thinking they all agree on what the Bible says, could not be further apart, like free will vs election, once saved always saved vs loss of salvation, who Jesus is, the role of women, hell, the tribulation, etc.

God specifically wrote the Bible to cause confusion among those who think they are children of God, yet never were.

Matthew 13:10–16 (KJV 1900)
And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? 11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. 12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. 13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. 14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive: 15 For this people’s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them. 16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.

This truth of parables is the most widely neglected truth among "Christians", which is precisely why debates arise from looking at the Bible as a plainly written document. But this was by design.

Proverbs 25:2 (KJV 1900)
It is the glory of God to conceal a thing (a WORD):
But the honour of kings (the true children of God) is to search out a matter(a WORD).

I agree of the verses you quoted but one of your statement may I rephrase; from confusion to non-understanding.
You say, "God specifically wrote the Bible to cause confusion (non-understanding) among those who think they are children of God, yet never were".
As 1 Corinthians 14:33 says;
For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.(KJV)

Peace.

Thank you for taking the time to respond. Now, with the KJV, we have to be careful how we understand what we read because of the type of language that was used back then. Because of this, some words don't mean what they mean today. For example, the word, "conversation" has nothing to do with speaking in the KJV, but rather means "conduct or behavior".

Galatians 1:13 (KJV 1900)
For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews’ religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:


1 Timothy 3:15 (KJV 1900)
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself (same Old English word "conversation") in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

The same holds true for many other words, including the word "confusion" found in 1 Cor 14:33. Our modern day word "confusion" is defined as "not understanding", just as you suggested, however, that's not what it means in the verse you quoted. To know this all we have to do is look up the Greek word in the Bible and see where else and how else God uses this same word, and that will give us our definition.

1 Corinthians 14:33 (KJV 1900)
For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

The first thing we can notice, before we even look this word up elsewhere, is that God is contrasting "confusion" with "peace". And the opposite of peace has nothing to do with not understanding something, but has everything to do with chaos, tumults and war. This Greek word is Strong's G181 and is also used here:

Luke 21:9 (KJV 1900)
But when ye shall hear of wars and commotions(confusion), be not terrified: for these things must first come to pass; but the end is not by and by.

2 Corinthians 6:4–5 (KJV 1900)
But in all things approving ourselves as the ministers of God, in much patience, in afflictions, in necessities, in distresses, 5 In stripes, in imprisonments, in tumults (confusion), in labours, in watchings, in fastings;

So, even if you rephrase my statement from "confusion" to "non understanding", it still means the same thing, so in this we are in agreement. Just not in the scripture you used to support your correction.

Thank you again for taking the time to reply and to search the scriptures.

[onewithhim]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

Yes. II Corinthians 4:4

"In whom the God of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them." (KJV)

Most of the world is blinded by Satan, and a person must approach the only true God, the Father of Jesus, to learn what is the truth. (Psalm 83:18, KJV; John 17:3)

[onewithhim]

Ok. So why don't people accept what the Bible says? Why do trinity believers still say the Bible supports the trinity? Is this the God's fault for not being more clear?

God didn't write the Bible, men did. If there is a God, it isn't responsible for what men wrote. Odd that women weren't involved huh?

Tcg

There were books written about women, and they were portrayed as wise and faithful to God.

[onewithhim]

Peace to you,

[Replying to tam in post #37]

The trinity cannot be reasoned with. There is no reasonable explanation, and that's why the Church calls it a "mystery."

I do not think that is why it is called a mystery. You have been in enough trinity debates I am sure, to know that people present scriptures to back their position. Just as you do to back yours. That doesn't mean those scriptures are being used or understood properly, and in both cases, you and they have to ignore scriptures and reasoning that speaks against your understanding.

I do not ignore any scriptures, unlike the trinitarians. I will and have discussed every passage that comes up in a discussion. Give me a verse and I will say why it might be a bad translation or it is being misunderstood. Trinitarians do not do that. They ignore scriptures and change the line of thinking to something else, or just object without saying exactly why.

[onewithhim]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

[Replying to tam in post #37]

The trinity cannot be reasoned with. There is no reasonable explanation, and that's why the Church calls it a "mystery."

I do not think that is why it is called a mystery. You have been in enough trinity debates I am sure, to know that people present scriptures to back their position. Just as you do to back yours. That doesn't mean those scriptures are being used or understood properly, and in both cases, you and they have to ignore scriptures and reasoning that speaks against your understanding.

We have not "ignored scriptures" in any sense of the word. Everything we believe can be backed up solidly by all scriptures. Trinitarians will say the same, but their arguments can be dismantled easily.

The same thing can be said of you when it comes to the 'two hope' doctrine. And the backing for "Jesus is Michael" is even more scarce than the backing for "Jesus is God".

The problem is that they refuse to look at what we are explaining. We will look at any argument they put on and comment on it. I can't get most trinitarians to do the same with the scriptures I present.

Yes I have noticed that many (not all) people commenting on your threads do not respond to the direct verses you present.

The fact that they call it a mystery shows that they cannot understand the doctrine. The RCC itself said in their Catholic encyclopedia that there is no clear doctrine of the trinity in the Bible.

So where is the clear doctrine that Christ is Michael? Where is the clear doctrine that there are two hopes/destinies/kinds of Christians - wherein some are brothers of Christ, and some are the Church, but most are not?

(I think mystery officially means something that has to be revealed, rather than something that cannot be understood.)

They said that the doctrine wasn't a part of their worship until after the 4th century, and then there isn't really any scripture that speaks of the trinity except possibly Matthew 28:19. That scripture doesn't say anything about them being equal, so the trinity can't be proven by that verse.

When was the "Jesus is Michael" doctrine part of anyone's worship?
When was the "two hopes/destinations for two different kinds of Christians doctrine" a part of anyone's worship?



Peace again to you.

Those two subjects will forever be a disagreement between us.

No, not forever.

I guess there's no point in discussing anything further.

She says as she continues to discuss it (<-please take that in the friendly, lighthearted manner in which it is intended)

You believe that there is someone that is equal to Christ and has privileges that Jesus Christ has and should be mentioned in what Jesus had to say in Matthew chapter 24.

I believe no such thing. You think this about me because of things YOU attribute to Michael, but I do not make the same interpretations that you make. Of course at this point, you are just defending the doctrine of Christ being Michael, the same as a person who believes that [Jesus] is God is defend that doctrine... but it is all interpretation. The fact remains that Christ did not teach that He is God anymore than He taught that He is Micheal.

Why isn't it Michael who comes with his chosen ones at Armageddon? It says in Daniel that he will "stand up" for his people and the Great Tribulation will happen after that. There is no mention of a Michael doing that in what Jesus explained in Matthew 24.

It says in Daniel that Michael 'stands up'. Meaning that he takes some kind of action, but what that action is is not spelled out in Daniel.

So where is Michael in all of this? If he is a separate being and also "the great Prince," where is he in that scenario? And there must be TWO great Princes? You do not give Jesus enough credit.

Michael is ONE OF the chief princes. There are others: the prince of Greece, the prince of Persia, etc. Christ, however, is Prince OF princes. Also: King of kings. Lord of lords.

I have seen a translation where it says that Michael is the FIRST of the princes, not "one of the princes." It can be easily mistranslated. When Michael stands up, it is evident what he does. He does exactly what Jesus says he will do at the end of the age. It can be read in the first couple of verses at Daniel 12.

If Michael is under Christ, where is he in the passages of Matthew 24? He is not mentioned, which he surely should be if he's such a great prince. But he is not. Jesus takes all the credit, which he is worthy to do. It's like Michael ceases to exist. Why is that if he is one of the princes?

[onewithhim]

Those that read the Bible, rarely do they agree on what the Bible's message actually is. Why is that? Why didn't God make the Bible easy to understand for everyone? The Bible holds the key to the answer to this question right?

I disagree with this premise. I have found that most people agree on what it is that the Bible says the majority of the time. There are a variety of tertiary issue – such as the role of women specifically in church leadership – that are murky in the scriptures. People often exaggerate the importance of some texts while suppressing the importance of others in order to come to a disagreement. However, in most areas most people agree on what the Bible teaches.

No they don't. It is taught in the churches that Jesus is God, and there are those who say no, he is the SON of God.

99% of self-described Christians subscribe to creeds that say the Son of God is God. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the only significant group that disagrees with this, and they make up less than ½ of 1% of Christians. So it seems fair to say that most people do agree.

If you wish to prove me wrong it should be easy. Just name any significant group of Christians - say, any group making up more than 1% of Christians - who says that the Bible does not teach that Jesus is God.

It is a belief that there is a literal fiery hell, yet some do not believe this sacrilege.

Again, virtually all Christian groups say that hell is real. They may disagree on the nuance here – is “fire” literal or symbolic – but they agree on the substance of the idea.

Some people believe that the "soul" lives on when you die. Others do not believe this.

Once more, virtually all Christians believe in the “soul” that does not die when the body dies.

I have mentioned this before, but if I were part of the 1% who read the Bible and came up with a completely different understanding than 99% of people who read the Bible then I would be deeply concerned. I am at least humble enough to admit that if I am in a room of 1,000 people, I am not one of the only 10 people smart enough to figure out what the scriptures say. It is far more likely that I was the one in error.

However, it is clear that most people do agree on what the Bible says, at least in substance if not in every minor detail.

This is because "the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through." (2Corinthians 4:4) Satan is hard at work, fooling people into believing lies. We must pray for understanding, and we must pray to the right God. (Psalm 83:18, KJV)

May I assume that you are not so arrogant as to think that you are part of a tiny elite who is somehow immune to the Enemy’s tricks?

Why would you think that I am inferring that I am immune to the Devil's tricks? Nobody is immune to them. We just learn how to stand up to him. (Ephesians 6:11-17)