Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God

[McCulloch]

True Christians (that hold to the beliefs and teaching of Jesus and the first century congregation) worship exactly the same God as the Jews. YHWH (Yaweh or in English "Jehovah").

Questions for debate:

1. Did Jews and Jesus worship exactly the same God?
2. Did Jews and the first century Christians worship exactly the same God?
3. Did the first century congregation worship exactly the same God as most modern Christians?
4. Do Jews and most modern Christians worship exactly the same God?
5. [bonus question] Is the god of Islam the same God or a different one?

[Murad]

It is a fact that the Jews reject God because they reject Jesus who is God. End of debate.

How authentic do you believe the Gospels are?
Oral tradition handed down for over thirty-five years; then written in such detail; in such vivid language......... One could only imagine the whole NT is a concoction; a fabrication.
The Old Testament makes no mention that the Messiah would be 'God'.
You shouldn't tell a Jew how to interpret their scripture.

It was a pastoral council. Moreover, it has nothing whatsoever to do with the simple fact that the Jews deny Jesus is God.

Yes & you cant blame them... i mean common dont be so close minded.
The trinity isnt mentioned anywhere in the OT(also not mentioned in the NT); the God that is potrayed as "angry; ruthless that saved his children out of egypt" cannot be Jesus whom ran away from King herod......
All the concoctions such as "Original Sin; Atonement; Divine Sonship" have absolutely no place in Judaism.
You cant blame the Jews for not wanting to believe man made pseudo doctrines.

The Old Covenant stopped with the coming of Jesus Christ. Indeed, for Jesus Himself says, "For if you had believed Moses, you would have believed Me, because he wrote about Me." Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of the Old Testament Prophesies. The Jews reject this. "Who is a liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is anti-Christ who denieth the Father and the Son." (1 John 2:22)

Quoting from the New Testament is like quoting out of the Quran; it has no authority in Judaism.
Thus you are not making any point.

Truly, Christians were made the children of Abraham , as Paul says, by our faith in Jesus Christ. Consequently, the Jews by their faithlessness have ceased to be His seed.

Paul also calls the Mosaic law a "curse" that christ "redeemed" us from; Jews see the law as a life-style & a gift to self-betterment.
Again; quoting from Paul has much authority as quoting from the NT when discussing Jewish Theology.....

[Ann]

Murad,

Please note the title of the OP, in fine, "Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God." It is my proven position that such a statement is totally illogical. Now, who would be so boldly foolish as to try and argue against fact?

You're giving me reasons/excuses why Jews don't worship the same God as Christians, and that's exactly my point! It's simple logic.

To reiterate: Christians worship Jesus as God. Jews reject Jesus as God. Therefore Jews do not worship Jesus. Therefore Jews do not worship exactly the same God as Christians. Think about it.

Nothing more need be said on the subject.

Ann

[cnorman18]

Murad,

Please note the title of the OP, in fine, "Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God." It is my proven position that such a statement is totally illogical. Now, who would be so boldly foolish as to try and argue against fact?

You're giving me reasons/excuses why Jews don't worship the same God as Christians, and that's exactly my point! It's simple logic.

To reiterate: Christians worship Jesus as God. Jews reject Jesus as God. Therefore Jews do not worship Jesus. Therefore Jews do not worship exactly the same God as Christians. Think about it.

Nothing more need be said on the subject.

Ann

On that one point, semantics aside, you are correct; we don't worship the same God with the same understanding, at any rate. But you have gone rather far beyond that in your posts and said a great many other things about Jews, some of which are, as I have shown, at variance with the official teachings of your own Church and could be called good examples of the kind of misunderstandings. ignorance, and disrespect that the Vatican and at least three Popes have recommended should be done away with.

Think about it....

[Cathar1950]

Murad,

Please note the title of the OP, in fine, "Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God." It is my proven position that such a statement is totally illogical. Now, who would be so boldly foolish as to try and argue against fact?

You're giving me reasons/excuses why Jews don't worship the same God as Christians, and that's exactly my point! It's simple logic.

To reiterate: Christians worship Jesus as God. Jews reject Jesus as God. Therefore Jews do not worship Jesus. Therefore Jews do not worship exactly the same God as Christians. Think about it.

Nothing more need be said on the subject.

Ann

Actually it is more like Jews worship God/El/Yahweh and Christians worship Jesus as God so it is the Christians that worship another god they cal Jesus. Despite Paul's poor analogies and confusion he is introducing a different god and it was Paul that had a different Jesus and different gospel which those from James were trying to correct.
Paul saw Jesus as an æons which are the various emanations of the superior God not a Yahweh or the OT god. Your position is more Gnostic the orthodox as you are saying the Jewish god is a demon or as the Gnostic called it a Demiurge.

[Ann]

Murad,

Please note the title of the OP, in fine, "Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God." It is my proven position that such a statement is totally illogical. Now, who would be so boldly foolish as to try and argue against fact?

You're giving me reasons/excuses why Jews don't worship the same God as Christians, and that's exactly my point! It's simple logic.

To reiterate: Christians worship Jesus as God. Jews reject Jesus as God. Therefore Jews do not worship Jesus. Therefore Jews do not worship exactly the same God as Christians. Think about it.

Nothing more need be said on the subject.

Ann

On that one point, semantics aside, you are correct; we don't worship the same God with the same understanding, at any rate. But you have gone rather far beyond that in your posts and said a great many other things about Jews, some of which are, as I have shown, at variance with the official teachings of your own Church and could be called good examples of the kind of misunderstandings. ignorance, and disrespect that the Vatican and at least three Popes have recommended should be done away with.

Think about it....

To respond to your criticisms that I said a great many other things about Jews would require me to take this specific OP way off the point of discussion. I do not wish to distort the OP with non-related matters.

However, to concisely respond to this off subject matter I will say to you this: understand that the official teachings of the Church are to be found in its dogmas and not in sermons, pastoral guidance, etc. There is not a single dogma of the Church which states that the Old Law is still valid. On the contrary, the Church infallibly teaches that “Jesus made void the Law…the Old Law has been abolished� (Pope Benedict XIV).

[Cathar1950]

Murad,

Please note the title of the OP, in fine, "Jews and True Christians worship exactly the same God." It is my proven position that such a statement is totally illogical. Now, who would be so boldly foolish as to try and argue against fact?

You're giving me reasons/excuses why Jews don't worship the same God as Christians, and that's exactly my point! It's simple logic.

To reiterate: Christians worship Jesus as God. Jews reject Jesus as God. Therefore Jews do not worship Jesus. Therefore Jews do not worship exactly the same God as Christians. Think about it.

Nothing more need be said on the subject.

Ann

On that one point, semantics aside, you are correct; we don't worship the same God with the same understanding, at any rate. But you have gone rather far beyond that in your posts and said a great many other things about Jews, some of which are, as I have shown, at variance with the official teachings of your own Church and could be called good examples of the kind of misunderstandings. ignorance, and disrespect that the Vatican and at least three Popes have recommended should be done away with.

Think about it....

To respond to your criticisms that I said a great many other things about Jews would require me to take this specific OP way off the point of discussion. I do not wish to distort the OP with non-related matters.

However, to concisely respond to this off subject matter I will say to you this: understand that the official teachings of the Church are to be found in its dogmas and not in sermons, pastoral guidance, etc. There is not a single dogma of the Church which states that the Old Law is still valid. On the contrary, the Church infallibly teaches that “Jesus made void the Law…the Old Law has been abolished� (Pope Benedict XIV).

Of course the author of Matthew would disagree with the Pope.
Another good question might be; Do Christians all worship the same Jesus?
When the OT says Yahweh is one they mean it in the context of there being a number of Yahwehs such as the Yahweh of Jerusalem or the Yahweh of Shiloh, and not there is only one god
It would like having the Church of Jesus Christ, the first church of Jesus and a number of churches with Jesus' name in it and saying there is only one Jesus.