Christianity...

[mcbr4481]

I always see arguments on here for what is christianity and what is not, to me theres only a couple of major things that must be agreed upon.....

1. The trinity.. I think it is pretty neccisary that a christian understands the father, the son and the holy spirit. This includes the divinity of Jesus..

2. Salvation is by Grace alone through faith in Jesus Christ.

3. The Bible is the inspired unfalable word of God.

I believe that the second one is the main one that one must understand to be a christian. if you have any thoughts on this please reply...

[katiej49]

Thank you Katiej49, it gets real distressing with all the people on here wanting to call everyone a christian. I like to think of people as christians when they have accepted the Bibles take on salvation, "by grace you have been saved through fath...not of works". thats why I don't believe catholics are biblicaly saved because they believe faith + Works = Salvation. where as the bible teaches Faith+0= salvation. I dont believe we are the judge of mankind but i think the bible is and we can know what it tells us...

but the bible also teaches that works are also important.

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not any works? can faith save him?...
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works." -James 2:14, 17-18

"And I saw the dead, small and great stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works." -Rev 20:12-13

just a little more thrown in to add to the discussion.

[/quote]


works are important. but the issue is do you work FOR salvation or BECAUSE of salvation? do you earn it...or do you work because you cant help it because you love God.

[McCulloch]

thats why I don't believe catholics are biblicaly saved because they believe faith + Works = Salvation.

I have spoken to many Catholic teachers. Do you have any evidence to support the idea that they teach salvation by works and faith rather than faith and grace?

[Fisherking]

Thank you Katiej49, it gets real distressing with all the people on here wanting to call everyone a christian. I like to think of people as christians when they have accepted the Bibles take on salvation, "by grace you have been saved through fath...not of works". thats why I don't believe catholics are biblicaly saved because they believe faith + Works = Salvation. where as the bible teaches Faith+0= salvation. I dont believe we are the judge of mankind but i think the bible is and we can know what it tells us...

If you are saying salvation is not attained through the keeping of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, I agree. Faith-works=no faith though. Just saying one has faith does not mean one does. Faith and works go hand in hand. We show our faith by our works or it is not faith.

James 2
14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.



Would you agree?

[Goat]

Thank you Katiej49, it gets real distressing with all the people on here wanting to call everyone a christian. I like to think of people as christians when they have accepted the Bibles take on salvation, "by grace you have been saved through fath...not of works". thats why I don't believe catholics are biblicaly saved because they believe faith + Works = Salvation. where as the bible teaches Faith+0= salvation. I dont believe we are the judge of mankind but i think the bible is and we can know what it tells us...

but the bible also teaches that works are also important.

"What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not any works? can faith save him?...
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works." -James 2:14, 17-18

"And I saw the dead, small and great stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works." -Rev 20:12-13

just a little more thrown in to add to the discussion.

works are important. but the issue is do you work FOR salvation or BECAUSE of salvation? do you earn it...or do you work because you cant help it because you love God.[/quote]

According to james, works are needed FOR salvation. He wrote his letter to correct what he saw as flaws in Pauls theology.

[arayhay]

I always see arguments on here for what is Christianity and what is not, .

Are we looking for a theological or a sociological, anthropological, historical definition of Christianity? If the latter, then a Christian is one who identifies himself or herself as a Christian, just as a Hindu is one who identifies himself or herself as a Hindu.
If theological, then one might be best to look to the Bible for a definition.

the disciples were first called Christians in Antioch.

A Christian, according to the Bible is a disciple of Jesus Christ.

they called THEMSELVES disciples some 280 times. count em

[McCulloch]

they called THEMSELVES disciples some 280 times. count em

And your point it ...

[arayhay]

they called THEMSELVES disciples some 280 times. count em

And your point it ...

my POINT IS NOT THAT DULL, THEY NEVER CALLED THEMSELVES christians. not even in acts 15.

[McCulloch]

they called THEMSELVES disciples some 280 times. count em

And your point it ...

my POINT IS NOT THAT DULL, THEY NEVER CALLED THEMSELVES christians. not even in acts 15.

And from that you conclude what?

1. Modern disciples should not use the label "Christian"?
2. the word Christian cannot be defined by Christians?
3. the word Christian is biblically meaningless?
4. Modern believers should count their word usage and only use Christian once for each 280 times they use the word disciple?
5. The Disciples of Christ is the one truly biblical denomination?

[Cathar1950]

The Ebonite, which, I consider Christian, disagrees with every one of the three.
Maybe they are not Christian just disciples or followers of Jesus the /man/king/prophet.

[mcbr4481]

In response to one earlier, James is not implying that works are neccisary for salvation. He is saying that if you have faith you will have works. It is clear throughout the new testiment that your salvation is 100 percent reliant upon faith in Jesus Christ. However James is point out to many false converts who think there saved, that if they don't have the works they probably dont have the faith. Its not just james that says this, Matthew 7 says "You will know them by their fruit" If someone has faith that is realy and has really been "born again" they will have works and will have fruit, but works are not part of salvation they are a reflextion of your faith..

Hope that clears that up...