First and Last Adam

[Skyangel]

The bible talks about the first and last Adam in 1 Cor 15:45

Christianity teaches that the first man named Adam was the first literal man ever created by God on planet earth.
If the first Adam mentioned in Genesis is the first literal man on planet earth then is the last Adam also a literal man who is the literal last man on planet earth?


If so, why is mankind still on planet earth?

If not, why do people teach and believe that the first Adam mentioned in Genesis is the first literal man on earth?

The "voice" in Revelation 1:11 said He is the first and the last.
"Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last:"

Does that mean the first Adam is also Jesus?

[DeBunkem]

According to the legend, the first Adam was married and produced offspring. Could this be part of the reason that the "Last Adam" is believed by some societies to have a secret lineage as well?

[Skyangel]

Does that mean the first Adam is also Jesus?

Since we're in the theology subforum and the bible is considered authoratative here, then guess we got to go with Adam being the first man on the planet.

But Jesus is portrayed as sinless, whereas Adam is not. So though they may fulfill parallel roles, Adam cannot be stated as being literally Jesus.

That all depends on the perception.
These scriptures say he can.

Isaiah 41:4 Who hath wrought and done [it], calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I [am] he.

Isaiah 48:12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I [am] he; I [am] the first, I also [am] the last.

Rev 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last:

Rev 1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

Matt 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last:

Luke 13:30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

1 Cor 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.




What is Adam ( man )? A soul without a spirit or a spirit without a soul or a spirit in a soul?
Was the first Adam a human being with the Spirit of God in him?
Was the last Adam also a human being with the Spirit of God in him ?

Is Jesus/Adam the first and last human being on earth or is God the first and last human being on planet earth and all the human beings in between the first and last as well?

The answer is no.
Only 1 Cor 15:45 is related to Adam and Jesus and the other passages are about First and Last. You are trying to iterpret the other passages with your misunderstanding of 1 Cor. 15:45.
When Paul writes of the New Adam he is using Adam as humanity. The first Adam was the first Human(metaphorical) and represents humans while the Last Adam or New Adam represents the New humanity being raised in Christ.
Paul is using an allegory.

Matt 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last:

Luke 13:30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

These two passages are about ranking and not Adam of Jesus.

The others are about first and last but are not specified so it could mean first light, first being, or even the first anything and the last everything and Adam and Jesus are not part of the context.

Obviously 1 Cor 15:45 is related to Adam and Jesus and the other passages are about First and Last. However Jesus is also the first and last. They fit together in the bigger picture.


I agree that Adam represents humanity. I see the the first Adam representing the earthy or physical fleshly part of all humans, past present and future while the Last Adam or New Adam represents the Spiritual part of humanity or the Spirit inside the flesh. They make one man with two different aspects to that man. They are not two separate human beings but are a Spirit in the flesh and the flesh in the Spirit.
" I in the Father and the Father in me." ( John 14:10-11, John 14:20 )
" I in them and thou in me" ( John 17:23)

Matt 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last:

Luke 13:30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

I can understand how these two passages are also about ranking but when you consider the second Adam is inside the first Adam then the second has a higher ranking in the heart and mind of man when mankind is led by the Spirit but the first has a higher ranking in ones life, heart and mind when you are led by the flesh.
The first and last can also represent life and death. Life ends in death and death ends in life. It is a continual cycle.

First and last in the context of the whole bible can refer to acts, deeds, mankind, kings, the state of man, labourers, errors, rank, authority, days, beginning and end, life and death, soul and spirit, God.
All of them are specified in the context.

The first and last in the context of the whole bible represent God who is the first and last of everything. Each mention of first and last in the parables is specified by the parables as to what it is referring and it usually refers to mankind.
If it refers to light or anything else in the parables then the parables say so. However Jesus is also the Light of the world.

Light also represents revelation, wisdom, understanding.

[Skyangel]

According to the legend, the first Adam was married and produced offspring. Could this be part of the reason that the "Last Adam" is believed by some societies to have a secret lineage as well?

People will obviously believe any legend they want to believe and interpret it in their own minds the way they do. However, logically Adam represents all mankind of the past present and future so the Last Adam in any sense of being a last physical man on earth cannot have had any offspring yet since he has not been born yet. Too many women are still carrying babies in their wombs so I know the last man on earth has not been born yet.

Physical people produce physical offspring. The bible clearly states the last Adam is not physical but spiritual. The spiritual offspring of Adam (gods ) are inside the physical offspring of Adam (mankind).

Spirit begets spirit, flesh begets flesh. Nothing secret about it.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

God in the flesh begets gods in the flesh
I am a child of God. ( Son/Daughter of God )
I am a child of man. (Son/Daughter of man )
The child of man dies
The child of God lives for ever.

[inviere1644]

What these statements mean is not a literal person, but all of humanity. We are the

source of our own success and rise to greatness and ultimately our own destruction

and demise. We are our own beginning and our own end.

[ahigherway]

According to the legend, the first Adam was married and produced offspring. Could this be part of the reason that the "Last Adam" is believed by some societies to have a secret lineage as well?

People will obviously believe any legend they want to believe and interpret it in their own minds the way they do. However, logically Adam represents all mankind of the past present and future so the Last Adam in any sense of being a last physical man on earth cannot have had any offspring yet since he has not been born yet. Too many women are still carrying babies in their wombs so I know the last man on earth has not been born yet.

Physical people produce physical offspring. The bible clearly states the last Adam is not physical but spiritual. The spiritual offspring of Adam (gods ) are inside the physical offspring of Adam (mankind).

Spirit begets spirit, flesh begets flesh. Nothing secret about it.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

God in the flesh begets gods in the flesh
I am a child of God. ( Son/Daughter of God )
I am a child of man. (Son/Daughter of man )
The child of man dies
The child of God lives for ever.

Hi Skyangel!
I think the "secret lineage" which DeBunkem mentioned, is ALL mankind. This would truly be a secret, since the church is busy telling us who is in, and who is out. And according to who you ask, the "in" and "out" crowds always change!

I think that if Adam #1 had a global effect on mankind, then so too must Adam #2 have a global effect; this seems "just" and "right."

That of course would mean that all men have been justified by God...

Blessings,
brian

[Skyangel]

Hi Skyangel!
I think the "secret lineage" which DeBunkem mentioned, is ALL mankind. This would truly be a secret, since the church is busy telling us who is in, and who is out. And according to who you ask, the "in" and "out" crowds always change!

I think that if Adam #1 had a global effect on mankind, then so too must Adam #2 have a global effect; this seems "just" and "right."

That of course would mean that all men have been justified by God...

Blessings,
brian

If all are justified then why do people still need to repent and believe in Jesus?
Justification is conditional, not automatic.
If all are justified why does Jesus say to many " Sorry I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity"? Matt 7:21-23

[ahigherway]

Hi Skyangel!
I think the "secret lineage" which DeBunkem mentioned, is ALL mankind. This would truly be a secret, since the church is busy telling us who is in, and who is out. And according to who you ask, the "in" and "out" crowds always change!

I think that if Adam #1 had a global effect on mankind, then so too must Adam #2 have a global effect; this seems "just" and "right."

That of course would mean that all men have been justified by God...

Blessings,
brian

If all are justified then why do people still need to repent and believe in Jesus?
Justification is conditional, not automatic.
If all are justified why does Jesus say to many " Sorry I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity"? Matt 7:21-23

IMO, the justification is automatic, just as being made a sinner was automatic.
On another thread, I posed the question to you: if a man is deceived, how can he know that he is deceived? He cannot, because he doesn't know it. Just like a sheep can be lost, but doesn't realize it.
We all have an Old Adam nature in us, which is dead, and which we all sometimes choose to heed to. I think this is the one that Jesus will reject.
But man is terribly blind. He is deceived so easily, and falls so easily. In order to improve himself, he must be helped from above.

Blessings,
brian

[Skyangel]

IMO, the justification is automatic, just as being made a sinner was automatic.
On another thread, I posed the question to you: if a man is deceived, how can he know that he is deceived? He cannot, because he doesn't know it. Just like a sheep can be lost, but doesn't realize it.
We all have an Old Adam nature in us, which is dead, and which we all sometimes choose to heed to. I think this is the one that Jesus will reject.
But man is terribly blind. He is deceived so easily, and falls so easily. In order to improve himself, he must be helped from above.

Blessings,
brian

Being made a sinner is not any more automatic than being made a saint is automatic. It is a choice to be a sinner or a saint. If it was not a choice then no one would need to choose Truth in order to be saved from deception. If it was automatic, no choice would be needed.

Anyone who has been deceived or is in the process of being deceived can learn to recognize a deception when they are faced with it in the same way any person can learn to recognize that a magicians tricks are nothing but an illusion and not any kind of miracles or magic which are caused by the waving of a magic wand or by saying magic words.
Too many people perceive the bible stories as some kind of "book of magic" and try to do the incantations "In the name of Jesus" or " In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost" to produce magic tricks called miracles in the religious world and they get dissappointed when their "magic words" don't work and don't "poof" things into existence as their "faith" ( or delusions ) tells them they should.

Any Magician knows there are "secrets" behind the "curtain" which the average spectator cannot see. However anyone who really wants to know the secrets can find them out by doing the relevant research.
Nothing is what it appears to be in the land of illusions and deceptions.

It is true that we all have an Old Adam nature in us, which is also called sin and also called the devil in the bible. This nature is not dead unless we crucify it within ourselves or allow others to crucify it for us. Those who sometimes choose to heed it are sometimes following the devil, following sin, following evil inside themselves during the times the heed that temptation and fall for it. I know this is the nature that Jesus rejected and set an example for us to do likewise.
I agree that the carnal natural man ( Adam 1 inside all people ) is terribly blind. I agree that carnal nature is deceived easily, and falls easily. The carnal nature can never improve itself because it is what created it to be and it is perfectly evil since it was created to be that way and will never change. That is why we need to learn to crucify it within ourselves and overcome it in the same way Jesus did and does and always will do through the Spirit of God who is also in us. The Spirit of God or the spiritual nature ( Adam 2) is the help from above which can easily overcome Adam 1 as easily as light overcomes darkness yet still allows darkness to exist. The knowledge of God in mankind is like the light and the darkness which makes one day being the same as the knowledge of good and evil being the same knowledge. We can't have one without the other. Without Truth there would be no lies and without lies there would be no Truth. The secret to success is to know the difference between them and to overcome the deception with Truth in the same way light overcomes darkness.
When that happens, people "wake up" from their "sleep" or "rise from the dead" and come out of the "grave" ( whited sepulchre ) which is themselves.

Only Truth can make people free from deception in the same way only light can dispel darkness.