"Thanks to the blood of Christ

[Elijah John]

A preacher on TBN said yesterday,

Thanks to the blood of Christ, his Father becomes our Father.

Didn't Jesus teach his listeners to call God " our Father" even before "the blood" was part of the equation?

So is it really "Thanks to the blood of Christ" that God is Father? Or is God "Father" whether or not Jesus died to "pay for" our sins?

Are we children of God through faith that this is so? Or only because we are adopted by virtue of the "blood of Christ"?

[ttruscott]

A preacher on TBN said yesterday,

Thanks to the blood of Christ, his Father becomes our Father.

Didn't Jesus teach his listeners to call God " our Father" even before "the blood" was part of the equation?

So is it really "Thanks to the blood of Christ" that God is Father? Or is God "Father" whether or not Jesus died to "pay for" our sins?

Are we children of God through faith that this is so? Or only because we are adopted by virtue of the "blood of Christ"?

Saving faith is faith in Christ's promise to be our saviour which includes the methodology of how He fulfills His role as saviour. The blood is merely a dramatic allusion to His death.

[brianbbs67]

We are all children of God. His breath animates us according to Genesis 6.

IMG_0878 by brianbbs67, on Flickr

[Checkpoint]

We are all children of God. His breath animates us according to Genesis 6.

We are all God's "offspring" by creation, Acts 17:26-31; that is what Jesus called "born of the flesh".

To become God's children we need to be "born of the Spirit". John 3:1-8; John 1:11-13.

[Elijah John]

To become God's children we need to be "born of the Spirit". John 3:1-8; John 1:11-13.

That is not what Jesus teaches, in the Lord's prayer at least. No mention of being "born of the Spirit" in that prayer, no mention of "the blood" making us children of God in that prayer, nor in the Sermon as a whole. Nowhere in Matthew, Mark or Luke, for that matter.

Yet Jesus teaches his listeners to call God "Father", even without teaching them to be "born again".

Did Jesus reserve his "born again" teaching for John's audience only?

Or were "Matthew, Mark and Luke" not paying attention?

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

It's almost as if you think Jesus should have died and resurrected and then preached.

We are born to our parents but no child becomes a son or daughter until they earn it. There is always the base biological relationship but that really isn't worth much when the will gets written for the inheritance.

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

It's almost as if you think Jesus should have died and resurrected and then preached.

We are born to our parents but no child becomes a son or daughter until they earn it. There is always the base biological relationship but that really isn't worth much when the will gets written for the inheritance.

And of course with God it is much deeper. We are spiritually not of God. God is good and we are not. So when we accept the blood of Christ we are adopted into God's family. Now we will get a share in the inheritance.

[ttruscott]

Did Jesus reserve his "born again" teaching for John's audience only?

Jesus provides an answer when asked about his use of parables:Matt 13:10-17 The disciples came to him and asked, "Why do you speak to the people in parables?" He replied,

"The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. Whoever has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. This is why I speak to them in parables: Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand."...implying that HIS audience was restricted and secrets were kept. Parables only teach the people of the kingdom, the good seed Matt 13:36-37.

Luke 9:44 "Listen carefully to what I am about to tell you: The Son of Man is going to be betrayed into the hands of men." 45 But they did not understand what this meant. It was hidden from them, so that they did not grasp it, and they were afraid to ask him about it. ...and sometimes they just did not understand what He was teaching them; it did not fit their preconceived notions of reality and religion.

John 6:65 Then Jesus said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to Me unless the Father has granted it to him.� 66 From that time on, many of His disciples turned back and no longer walked with Him. which tells us that even when they hear the truth from their GOD and not just religious reminders to "be a good boy," some who were dedicated to Him will leave Him and scorn that truth as a self aggrandizing lie.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

It's almost as if you think Jesus should have died and resurrected and then preached.

We are born to our parents but no child becomes a son or daughter until they earn it. There is always the base biological relationship but that really isn't worth much when the will gets written for the inheritance.

And of course with God it is much deeper. We are spiritually not of God. God is good and we are not. So when we accept the blood of Christ we are adopted into God's family. Now we will get a share in the inheritance.

We do not "earn it" but receive it as a gift.

That is not because "we accept the blood of Christ" but because we accept and receive Christ himself with all that that means.

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

It's almost as if you think Jesus should have died and resurrected and then preached.

We are born to our parents but no child becomes a son or daughter until they earn it. There is always the base biological relationship but that really isn't worth much when the will gets written for the inheritance.

And of course with God it is much deeper. We are spiritually not of God. God is good and we are not. So when we accept the blood of Christ we are adopted into God's family. Now we will get a share in the inheritance.

We do not "earn it" but receive it as a gift.

That is not because "we accept the blood of Christ" but because we accept and receive Christ himself with all that that means.

Jesus taught his listeners to address God as "Father" even before the formulation of Pauline blood theology that his listeners at the time had no idea about, nor any awareness of.

To "recieve Christ" in the Synoptics seems to have meant simply to listen to Jesus' preaching and put his teachings into action, thus building one's life upon a solid foundation.

I think conventional, orthodox Trinitarian Christians view everything with a Pauline, and Johannine lens, projecting backwards. Is it any wonder why Evangelicals tend to advise new converts to begin their Bible study indoctrination with the Gospel of John, instead of letting the Synoptic Gospels (and the "Old" Testament for that matter) speak for itself?