Conservative reasons for increasing the minimum wage.

[DanieltheDragon]

First I would just like to get a few things out of the way. I am not a huge fan of the minimum wage. It is what it is and the current structure of our economy makes it a necessary component. The current amount of workforce dependent on minimum wage is actually pretty small. The impact of increasing the minimum wage will not end poverty and would likely increase some inflation.

1. I do not subscribe to the idea that increasing the minimum wage will prevent job growth. Although some do the jury is still out on this one however we have recent data from 13 states that recently increased their minimum wage.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/ ... eport-says

2. Minimum wage on inflation

http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers ... lation.asp

3. Increasing the minimum wage will also increase wages for those working close to the minimum wage.

http://www.hamiltonproject.org/papers/t ... n_workers/





With that out of the way I will move onto reasons why I think the minimum wage should be raised from a conservative backdrop.

A.) It will have a natural effect on reducing entitlement programs.
-----By increasing the minimum wage workers on the lower end of the wage spectrum will have less dependence on entitlement programs and safety nets. Lowering the burden on the tax payer.


B.) The government should not be in the business of subsidizing the workforce
-----Not all companies but some use entitlement programs to subsidize the salary of their workforce. Places like Wal-Mart are examples of this collecting millions in tax breaks and manipulating workforce hours to avoid providing health insurance. These employees end up depending on SNAP, Welfare, Medicaid/Medicare. By increasing the minimum wage this shifts the burden back on to the employer to pay for their employees wages.

C.) Maintaining the free market not destroying it.

The minimum wage is a baseline of employment. All business across all states must at least meet the federal minimum wage. An increase in the minimum wage will not suddenly change the paradigm on how we employ or pay people in this country. It will however maintain it. The minimum wage should rise and fall with inflation. Having fixed arbitrary regulations that are devoid from market impacts has more destructive force than taking the baseline and adjusting it accordingly to these market fluctuations. If inflation rises the baseline needs to rise with that inflation lest we render that baseline moot in the first place.

[bluethread]

A.) It will have a natural effect on reducing entitlement programs.
-----By increasing the minimum wage workers on the lower end of the wage spectrum will have less dependence on entitlement programs and safety nets. Lowering the burden on the tax payer.

You clearly underestimate the governments ability to expand entitlement programs and define poverty upwards.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 9 by WinePusher]

Why? What's wrong with the way our economy is structured?

It is not a true free market. It is more along the lines of Managed Capitalism. Certainly we have a significant amount of individual freedom within that confines it still doesn't change the fact that we are not in a true free market capitalist economy.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 9 by WinePusher]

You also present so called 'conservative' reasons to support the minimum wage that don't make much sense. How exactly does the minimum wage reduce entitlements when it creates unemployment among low skilled workers,

If you can show me the data where this has taken place I will have to revise my position.

[Paprika]

[Replying to post 9 by WinePusher]

Why? What's wrong with the way our economy is structured?

It is not a true free market. It is more along the lines of Managed Capitalism. Certainly we have a significant amount of individual freedom within that confines it still doesn't change the fact that we are not in a true free market capitalist economy.

And part of your solution is to maintain management/distortion by increasing minimum wage? That's rather counterproductive.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 14 by Paprika]

And part of your solution is to maintain management/distortion by increasing minimum wage? That's rather counterproductive.

It is the recognition that you are not going to remove the minimum wage. So it is not so much trying to increase distortion but minimize it. A wage that is dependent on inflation matches market fluctuations comparative to an unwavering wage that does not.

Unless of course you think you can remove the minimum wage right? oh wait

With momentum building at the federal and state level to increase hourly base pay, more than three-quarters of Americans (76%)

http://www.gallup.com/poll/165794/ameri ... -wage.aspx


sometimes you have to recognize when a battle is lost. I think a lot of people even recognize this distorts the market and simply don't care out of moral imperative. That is not a battle you can win.

it is a battle even lost among republicans

republicans are the least supportive of hiking the minimum wage to $9 but not tethering it to inflation, with 58% saying they would vote in favor and 39% against it.

An increase to the minimum wage is going to happen. That is a fact. So all arguments to remove it really are a moot point at this stage. So the alternative course of action is to find the best way to manage the policy in such a way as to minimize the distortion


1. You can reduce taxes on small businesses and the payroll tax. This can offset the cost to employers associated with payroll and labor.

2. Have the minimum tied to an inflation keeps arbitrary hikes that can distort markets from happening and paves the way for gradual adjustments whether they are higher or Lower instead of spikes that can be difficult for small businesses to adjust to.


I think it is short-sighted to dig your heels in and hope you will always have the votes to hold your ground. Demographics in America are shifting. It would be better to address this from a position of strength(majority in both houses) than weakness. Make this a non-issue for future campaigns and win the long game.

By not tying it to inflation it allows the issue to come back in cycles. It happened once when I was a teenager and it is happening again now. Each time the minimum got raised. Each time republicans had control of congress. Maybe just maybe making it a non issue is the best way going forward.

[FinalEnigma]

Why? What's wrong with the way our economy is structured?

How about the fact that minimum wage is not enough to live on? I've done the math for my state. I found the cheapest rent I could find, the cheapest, thrifty food plan, etc. and one minimum wage income cannot support a person. two minimum wage incomes cannot support a family. not even close.

Is it valid to have people working 60 hours a week at three jobs, barely able to feed their families, and praying they don't have any unexpected expenses that would totally destroy them financially?

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 16 by FinalEnigma]

The problem though is that there are welfare programs and food stamp programs that augment these wages. It is quite clear that people are willing to work for those wages so long as there are individuals willing to work at that wage scale wages will remain low.

[Jashwell]

[Replying to post 17 by DanieltheDragon]

Is minimum wage an argument against welfare (for those with jobs)?

If you need minimum wage + welfare, why not cut out the middle man and just up minimum wage to include the welfare you would get?

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 17 by DanieltheDragon]

Is minimum wage an argument against welfare (for those with jobs)?

If you need minimum wage + welfare, why not cut out the middle man and just up minimum wage to include the welfare you would get?

I think the converse of that is that of these supplemental programs were removed that people would be unable to work at those wages and would naturally demand more money.

I think the problem with setting an arbitrary minimum wage is that each local market functions rather differently and have varying costs of living. The federal wage should probably be the bare minimum and let individual economies set wages higher as need be.

That being said an increase adjusted to inflation should help reduce dependence on those programs.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 18 by Jashwell]

Is minimum wage an argument against welfare (for those with jobs)?

Yes I would think so but as wine pusher has highlighted to much of a sudden spike in minimum wage could create significant market distortions and leave people out of the job. So I think it goes back to a balance which is why I am more inclined to simply tying it with inflation. This would also avoid sudden spikes in wages and allow small businesses to adapt over time.