Obamacare...health care for everybody, really?

[dianaiad]

Some of you know that I have a problem; I haven't been all that shy. Frankly, it makes me mad as all get out.

Oh, not because I HAVE this condition, though frankly, I feel like I would have had better chances of winning the lottery.

I have Multiple Myeloma, stage II, 'high risk.'
It's an odd duck; cancer of the bone marrow. What makes it 'high risk,' is a chromosomal abnormality that doesn't mean good news for survival.

Now I'm actually blessed with great insurance, paid by my husband's retirement; Kaiser Permanente. Because of that, I had a doctor who saw that I was slightly anemic and sent me for some 'further tests.' Those 'further tests' ended up being a LOT of tests (including a bone marrow biopsy, which I recommend to the Spanish Inquisition, or the CIA...perhaps especially the CIA, since nobody could object to the government 'taking care of the prisoner's health') The verdict was, yup, I got this thing; 75% of my bone marrow was cancerous plasma cells.

The REALLY odd thing is that most people who have this don't find out until they have broken bones, kidney failure, dementia, liver failure....it's a nasty disease. Me? My bones are fine and so are my kidneys and liver.

No cracks about my mental capacity, please.

I'm in GREAT health...except for the dying of cancer part.

This Friday I'm going in for a bone marrow transplant. I'll be in the City of Hope for two to three weeks, while they destroy my immune system and then 'reset' it, in hopes that this will put me into a good, long term remission. There's a really good chance that it will work, despite the 'high risk' thing, because they caught it before it did any damage to my bones and organs. It has been borne upon me that this is EXTREMELY rare, that someone with as an aggressive form of this condition as mine is gets caught this early. OK, I'll take that.

After all, this disease mostly affects African American men over 65. I am about as lily white a redheaded blue eyed female as you can find. Why in the world would they even LOOK for something like this?

Now, why this longwinded introduction, she asks?
I'll tell you.

In the normal course of events (pre-Obamacare) I would get the transplant, have the rest of the stem cells (that were collected from me last week) frozen and kept in reserve for another one...which I'm almost guaranteed to need, and if that doesn't work, I'd do a third, using donor cells from one of my sisters. I hope. Neither my age nor my life condition would affect this, because, well, I have Kaiser and I would transfer that to a 'Senior Advantage' Kaiser membership next August. All done. Good thing, because I'm going to be taking extremely expensive medication (as in, $2000 per pill) for the rest of my life.

If I had NOT had good insurance, the City of Hope and the pharmaceutical companies that make the novel drugs for this have all sorts of programs: once you have Multiple Myeloma, you get the care. All you have to do is get to a facility that specializes in it.


I have been told, however, and I have since confirmed this, that if Obamacare gets through as written, this will no longer be true. For one thing, there will be no possibility of a donor transplant, (which is the only hope for an outright cure) the most effective medication won't be available , and it's highly possible that I won't be offered even the second transplant using my OWN stem cells. My prognosis, thanks to Obamacare, will go from a possible ten to fifteen years down to two or three....because the decisions for my health care won't be mine or my doctor's. They will be made by committees according to guidelines, which will include the idea that no matter what, people over 70 won't get that sort of treatment.

It doesn't matter what my doctor says, or what my insurance company now pays for; the government will regulate this.

I'm OK now. Things are getting paid for.

But what about next year, when Obamacare takes me over?

Now me, I'm an example, and of course this is hitting home hard for me....but I'm hardly unique. I have been talking to a great many MM patients from all over the world, and the ones from 'universal health care' nations, like Canada, Australia and Great Britain do not do well. They are sicker and die sooner, and many of them don't even know that there are novel agents that can treat them; because THEIR healthcare won't provide them.

Those of you who know me know that I don't LIKE Obamacare. Now you know why.

So.....here's the topic for debate (and I'll participate for the next three days...). If you wanted to fix health care in this nation, how would YOU do it? Obviously Obamacare isn't going to work.

Remember: the object is to make certain that:
1. Those who need health care GET it...the best available, not just the least expensive.
2. The decisions regarding health care should be made by the patient and the doctor, not by some faceless bureaucrat looking at cost/benefit charts.
3. Nobody has to go bankrupt because of health care expenses.
4. Healthcare is delivered efficiently, with no long waiting times.
5. Health professionals get paid enough to justify the student loans, and have autonomy.
6. So do patients, in their ability to choose who provides them health care.


Obamacare does NONE of the above, btw.

Go.

[dianaiad]

Umm...
First, I am not accusing you of anything. Period.
I do not believe you and I don't believe anyone telling very personal stories on the web injecting names of real companies in the stories. Some good half of reviews on the internet are not real reviews, so why should we listen without reservations?

Second, I have no idea where you got an idea that paid posts in social media are somehow against laws. Plenty of people do it on tweeter openly, for example; why is this forum any different?

However, all these are totally different topics...

P.S.: If you really go to a hospital this week, good luck and "may the force be with you".
P.P.S.: a couple months ago met a pretty girl at hospice. In two weeks she died. Cancer sucks.

yes you are accusing me of something. If you don't believe me, that means you think I'm lying.

And yes, people give reviews of companies they like on social media. However, if they receive any compensation for that, they MUST disclose that. If they receive compensation, they may not misrepresent the product, or make untrue claims.

I would point out here that nothing I wrote could possibly be construed as a plug for any company; simply mentioning one is not a recommendation..

And yes, cancer sucks.
But why should you care?

You wouldn't believe I had it if you sat with me during chemotherapy. You would accuse the nurses of giving me saline solution in order to mess with your head.

Which raises a question; a couple of them, actually:

First, what level of proof would you accept that I'm not lying?
Second, what maggot do you have in your head that makes you think I am? I mean....REALLY?
Third...how about addressing the questions raised in the OP? You know, the ones regarding how you would fix the healthcare system if Obamacare gets scrapped?

btw, I am willing to provide proof to you, within reason. I won't give you my SS number or my medical records, but if you want to call the City of Hope next week and ask if I'm a patient there so that you can talk to me, you can do that. Dunno what you would consider sufficient proof.


I was thinking of posting a picture of me, but you probably would accuse me of posting a fake picture of someone else, or photoshopping it or something.

[Philbert]

dianaiad, I'm sorry members are making this a personal attack thread.

I guess you knew what was likely to happen when you posted your story on a forum so I suppose we can't claim to be surprised, but still, sheesh, what a bunch of pathetic gibberish is being added here.

Luckily, ObamaCare offers full coverage on Internet induced insanity, so we all should be receiving the treatment we need soon.

[100%atheist]

Third...how about addressing the questions raised in the OP? You know, the ones regarding how you would fix the healthcare system if Obamacare gets scrapped?

I am generally okay with the Affordable Care Act. If it is dismantled, I would suggest a new system that would get rid of private insurance companies altogether.

btw, I am willing to provide proof to you, within reason. I won't give you my SS number or my medical records, but if you want to call the City of Hope next week and ask if I'm a patient there so that you can talk to me, you can do that. Dunno what you would consider sufficient proof.

I could do it but:
1) I doubt hospitals provide ANY information on patients including the fact of their hospitalization to people without proper identification and legitimate reasons to know about the patient;
2) I do not know you. Who should I ask for? And even if I have name, how would I know that the person with that name is you?
3) I don't really care if you are telling truth or not because your personal stories (truthful or else) amount to nothing more than emotional pleading aimed to support your position.
4) I am not ready to disclose who I am to a stranger like you.

I was thinking of posting a picture of me, but you probably would accuse me of posting a fake picture of someone else, or photoshopping it or something.

I would not accuse you of that, but whether I believe you or not, your personal information is irrelevant to the topic (to any topic).

[100%atheist]

But the most telling information in all of this is the poll result which states roughly, " fund Obamacare and watch it fail" It has zero votes. I think that the reason for this is the often stated conclusion that the Republican party is most worried about the eventual success of a program that might shine a bright light on the single individual that they have spent five years attempting to destroy.

I think the reason for this is that with 5 possible answers and 10 votes (at the time I looked at it), we are at 28.5% statistical probability that one answer receives zero votes.


You can check me if you like:
P = [(10+4-1)!/(10!(4-1)!)]/[(10+5-1)!/(10!(5-1)!)]

[dianaiad]

Third...how about addressing the questions raised in the OP? You know, the ones regarding how you would fix the healthcare system if Obamacare gets scrapped?

I am generally okay with the Affordable Care Act. If it is dismantled, I would suggest a new system that would get rid of private insurance companies altogether.

btw, I am willing to provide proof to you, within reason. I won't give you my SS number or my medical records, but if you want to call the City of Hope next week and ask if I'm a patient there so that you can talk to me, you can do that. Dunno what you would consider sufficient proof.

I could do it but:
1) I doubt hospitals provide ANY information on patients including the fact of their hospitalization to people without proper identification and legitimate reasons to know about the patient;

There's another set of 'facts' that you believe you know.........and you don't. It's a phone system. Ask for my name and if I'm not there, they'll tell you. If I am, they will and then find out if I want to talk to you. I won't. This is strictly an 'am I there?" verification thing. Since I'm neither a rock star nor a politician, nobody is going to care about keeping my presence private. Obviously I don't.

2) I do not know you. Who should I ask for? And even if I have name, how would I know that the person with that name is you?

You are a statistician. How likely is it that someone with my name, who is not me, would be admitted to the bone marrow transplant unit of the City of Hope when I claim to be? Oh, and before you get all 'you could make this up and claim to be someone you are not) my name IS known here on the forum. Several people know what it is, and have known for quite some time. I'll gladly PM my name to you, and after checking, you can do the research and confirm that I am who I claim to be.

Again, as a statistician you know what the odds are against such an elaborate ruse and plot. As a person of reason (though I'm having some doubts about that one) you should certainly realize that I've been upfront about the fact that I'm having health problems since the beginning of this, and that establishing this as a wholesale scam just to get a good word in for the City of Hope to YOU is, well.....conspiracy theory on the level of Idaho survivalist 'end of day' folks. No moon landing folks. Flat earthers. Bush bombed the twin towers personally believers.

Now in one way, I understand your attitude: when I talk about the difference between 'knowledge' and 'belief,' I am very much the same way; you know, the fact that we don't KNOW that the sun is shining right now.....we only KNOW that it was shining 8 minutes ago, and we have FAITH that it's shining right now. We show that faith by behaving as if it actually were, making plans for the next few minutes in the faith that the sun is shining and the light of it will reach us in 8 minutes.

However, that's a discussion of definitions; what you are doing here is beyond silliness, actually.

3) I don't really care if you are telling truth or not because your personal stories (truthful or else) amount to nothing more than emotional pleading aimed to support your position.
4) I am not ready to disclose who I am to a stranger like you.

As for my personal stories, of course I tell them to make a point, emotional or otherwise. That's what stories are for.

But you, bub, put up or shut up. I'll PM you my name, you can confirm that with someone here, or do some internet research, and you call the City of Hope and ask to speak to me. Tomorrow late afternoon would be best, since I'll be getting treatments of some sort or other Saturday, Sunday and Monday (chemo and stem cell infusions). I'll even talk to you if you tell me who you are, but you certainly don't have to do that in order to confirm that I am there.

Hey. I'll do better than that. I'll give you my e-mail address. That alone will show you that, while I don't blast my identity on billboards, I don't keep it a deep dark secret.

Come to think of it, I think I joked about my name here on this forum several months (a year or more? I forget) ago. Something about my mother getting nervous about naming me after a pagan goddess of the hunt, then making my middle name very Christian to compensate?

Whatever, you'll feel better about the accuracy of finding out my identity if YOU do the research to confirm it, paranoid conspiracist that you are.

I was thinking of posting a picture of me, but you probably would accuse me of posting a fake picture of someone else, or photoshopping it or something.

I would not accuse you of that, but whether I believe you or not, your personal information is irrelevant to the topic (to any topic).

You just did accuse me 'of that.'
You have indicated in this post that there is pretty much nothing I could produce that you would believe, because you think I'm capable (why, THANK you...such involved conspiracies need a considerable amount of intelligence, experience and know-how to pull off; nice to think you think so highly of my IQ and geek qualities, if not my ethics) of doing this just to annoy you.

Given this, I've offered to produce evidence for my claim that any reasonable person would deem sufficient. Since you don't, you can take that evidence and go find more. Feel free to debunk my 'personal story' told here.

When you cannot, I expect an apology.

Before I get home.

You are certainly free to disagree with my beliefs and my opinions. You are certainly free to argue with those.

You are NOT free to call me a liar.

[dianaiad]

dianaiad, I'm sorry members are making this a personal attack thread.

Only one, but it would be nice if the thread went into the 'how would you do this differently?" track.

I guess you knew what was likely to happen when you posted your story on a forum so I suppose we can't claim to be surprised, but still, sheesh, what a bunch of pathetic gibberish is being added here.

Been around awhile. Mostly people are supportive, as they are here. There are always some idiots, but that's true in 'real' life too.

Luckily, ObamaCare offers full coverage on Internet induced insanity, so we all should be receiving the treatment we need soon.

(grin)

Well, Obamacare doesn't really cover anything; it dictates what private insurance companies must, and can, cover.

[johnmarc]

But the most telling information in all of this is the poll result which states roughly, " fund Obamacare and watch it fail" It has zero votes. I think that the reason for this is the often stated conclusion that the Republican party is most worried about the eventual success of a program that might shine a bright light on the single individual that they have spent five years attempting to destroy.

I think the reason for this is that with 5 possible answers and 10 votes (at the time I looked at it), we are at 28.5% statistical probability that one answer receives zero votes.


You can check me if you like:
P = [(10+4-1)!/(10!(4-1)!)]/[(10+5-1)!/(10!(5-1)!)]

This assumes, of course, that the replies are random which they are not. While cute, (and I recognize the humor in your post) your mathematics are irrelevant to this poll. I sincerely believe that the push to eliminate Obamacare comes directly from the fear that it will eventually be successful enough to edge out private insurance completely. The conservatives see this as a 'trick play' to take the country to a broader form of socialized healthcare. (and it is)

But as long as I have your on the 'phone'...

...your personal information is irrelevant to the topic (to any topic).

I don't believe that personal information is irrelevant at all. It becomes a personal (and often touching) example of a general truth. It has been heart wrenching personal stories of personal bankruptcies and denied care that have put healthcare on the front burner in the first place. Obamacare grew out of those personal stories.

However, to have relevance, the stories must resonate with the realities around us. We do not have to believe the stories, we, however, should believe the realities that produce the stories.

However, there are those here on this forum who use stories that are quite at odds with common sense and common understanding for the specific purpose of 'proving' specific points that run counter to the general experience of most individuals. Even if they were true (and there are times, I am convinced they are not) still the anomaly does not prove a more general point.

And I think that is a problem with most conservatives. They discover a specific that is, in fact, true----they can demonstrate its truth---and it becomes the truth. However, taken generally, this anomaly occurs one out of a hundred times and they neglect the other 99 examples which prove otherwise. This is the particular game plan of sensational media---and it is important not to stray too far from favorite sources of information as competing examples might find a way into the decision making process.

This is why personal stories are so compelling to conservatives and so entirely irrelevant to progressives---progressives what to know what is generally true---conservatives want to find a story---regardless of relevance---to prove their point.

The anomaly proves the rule is a truth in conservative circles.

And while I still have you on the 'phone'...

There was a previous example of a poster whom you admired (and shared his/her political/religious views) who put on this forum an even more preposterous story and you fell for it hook, line, and sinker.

[bluethread]

I am generally okay with the Affordable Care Act. If it is dismantled, I would suggest a new system that would get rid of private insurance companies altogether.

This does nothing to solve the limited supply/unlimited demand problem. Even if the treatments that dianaiad uses were to miraculously become available on an unlimited over the counter basis, a new procedure or product will be developed and everyone would then want that one. Who gets to decide who gets the limited procedure and on what basis does that person or those persons make that decision?

[johnmarc]

I am generally okay with the Affordable Care Act. If it is dismantled, I would suggest a new system that would get rid of private insurance companies altogether.

This does nothing to solve the limited supply/unlimited demand problem. Even if the treatments that dianaiad uses were to miraculously become available on an unlimited over the counter basis, a new procedure or product will be developed and everyone would then want that one. Who gets to decide who gets the limited procedure and on what basis does that person or those persons make that decision?

And that is the larger (and real) point. What happens when the average individual earns a million dollars over a lifetime and requires two million dollars in healthcare?

Neither side is addressing the elephant in the room.

[Goat]

Third...how about addressing the questions raised in the OP? You know, the ones regarding how you would fix the healthcare system if Obamacare gets scrapped?

I am generally okay with the Affordable Care Act. If it is dismantled, I would suggest a new system that would get rid of private insurance companies altogether.

The current system was initially proposed as an alternative to the single payer option that was proposed by Hillary Clinton in 1992, by the Heritage foundation, a highly conservative think tank. Nothing was done, till it was the ACA was passed by Obama. .. which of course was resisted by the very people that first proposed it. The single payer option, a much better solution, is vilified by the right as being 'socialism'.. Well, so is this, even though it was their idea to begin with.

The insurance industry must be better regulated. During the Bush years, the insurance company profits rose 500%. One thing that the ACA does is it puts a cap of 20% that an insurance company can use to profits and administration costs, and the rest has to go for paying back to the customers.