Muslims Block Streets in Paris

[East of Eden]

http://downloads.cbn.com/cbnnewsplayer/ ... ?aid=17933

Do these illegal street blockings violate France's commitment to a secular society, and why are they being allowed to continue?

[McCulloch]

So what would you say to a Muslim who is upset that in the West women have equal rights, gays are allowed to live openly, and the government doesn't care what religion you are?

I believe that all potential immigrants should have to agree to the principles stated in our Charter of Rights and Freedoms (or in the USA, the Bill of Rights) before being granted immigrant status. This commitment would be reaffirmed when citizenship is granted. If they cannot in good principle agree to the rights outlined in our constitutions, then they have no business coming here.

[100%atheist]

Why don't we set aside France for a minute and you tell me your opinion on the UK street blockages and the NYC problem, is this OK with you?

This is because this your OP is NOT about NYC. It is about Paris. So, do you admit that your statement about Paris in your OP is incorrect? If 'yes', we can continue, discuss NYC, Muslims, etc.. If 'no', there is nothing really to talk with you about.

Yes, now can you respond to similar acts in other parts of France, London and NYC?

I am against street blockages whatever the reasons might be.

[East of Eden]

So what would you say to a Muslim who is upset that in the West women have equal rights, gays are allowed to live openly, and the government doesn't care what religion you are?

I believe that all potential immigrants should have to agree to the principles stated in our Charter of Rights and Freedoms (or in the USA, the Bill of Rights) before being granted immigrant status. This commitment would be reaffirmed when citizenship is granted. If they cannot in good principle agree to the rights outlined in our constitutions, then they have no business coming here.

The policy of taqiyya allows Muslims to lie to us infidels. What do you do with the ones who say the oath and later preach violence and hate?

[keithprosser3]

Dropping the political correctness would be nice.... We don't need them.

As I see it, that is no solution to the problems posed by Islamism. It is just sweeping it under the carpet, putting it out of sight. The people who really suffer most from Islamism are Muslims themselves. I care about the problems faced by ordinary Muslisms - especially women - everywhere just as much as I care about the people on New York or San Francisco, or London. Just sending Muslims back where they came from is fine from a parochial point of view, but just because you put a problem faced by a quarter of humanity out of your personal view doesn't cure it.

[East of Eden]

Dropping the political correctness would be nice.... We don't need them.

As I see it, that is no solution to the problems posed by Islamism. It is just sweeping it under the carpet, putting it out of sight. The people who really suffer most from Islamism are Muslims themselves. I care about the problems faced by ordinary Muslisms - especially women

I agree completely, Sharia Law amounts to gender apartheid. Women are routinely subjected to forced marriages (often while underage, just like the 'prophet' did), beatings, genital mutilation, etc. And most of the victims of the Jihadists are fellow Muslims.

- everywhere just as much as I care about the people on New York or San Francisco, or London. Just sending Muslims back where they came from is fine from a parochial point of view, but just because you put a problem faced by a quarter of humanity out of your personal view doesn't cure it.

There may not be a cure, short of the second coming of Christ, but I see no reason to willingly allow this barbarism to infect the West. There may not be a cure for cancer, but I don't want it in my body. I have to agree with Winston Churchill on Islam:

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its
votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in
a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic
apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries, improvident
habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of
commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the
followers of the Prophet rule or live.

A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and
refinement, the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that
in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his
absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine,
must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of
Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.

Individual Muslims may show splendid qualities, but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of
those who follow it.

No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from
being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa,
raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that
Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the
science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization
of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient
Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill; (Source: The River War, first edition,
Vol. II, pages 248-50 London)

The opposing view of course is the multi-cultural, politically-correct one that all religions and cultures are the same. I disagree.

[keithprosser3]

I don't know if Islam is more harmful than Christianity - we in the west are lucky that Christianity is moderated by a healthy layer of secularism. Current debates in the US shows that if less secularly-minded Christians gained power women's rights would be rolled back and science education would be compromised. Perhaps in practice a Christian theocracy would not be very different from an Islamic one. Hopefully we will never find out.

I was married to a Muslim until I was widowered five years ago and I do not recognise the caricature of Muslims in those of my acquaintance. Most Muslims are not good Muslims, just as most Christians are not good Christians! Put another way, most Muslims are not Islamists.

Something is attracting Muslims to more extreme forms of Islam (ie Islamism).

There may be many reasons for that, but one factor is, well, imagine a young Muslim man in New York or London. He may want to integrate more with the western society, but he (quite rightly) does not want to abandon his entire heritage. but western society treats him with suspicion, even hostility. Getting a good job is hard. He faces name calling and sometimes even physical threats on a near daily basis. Papers such as the Daily Mail continually demonise him. On the other hand, the Islamists welcome him with open arms and flatter his ego. The surprise is not that Islamism is attractive, but that it is not more attractive.

We cannot simply export the problem of Islamism. The world is too inter-connected and inter-dependent. We can't build a wall to keep ourselves safe from Islamism, even if it was moral to let Islamism do its worst to ordinary Muslims out of our view. A solution - a real solution, not just a sticking head-in-the-sand solution - has to be found.

[East of Eden]

I don't know if Islam is more harmful than Christianity - we in the west are lucky that Christianity is moderated by a healthy layer of secularism. Current debates in the US shows that if less secularly-minded Christians gained power women's rights would be rolled back and science education would be compromised. Perhaps in practice a Christian theocracy would not be very different from an Islamic one. Hopefully we will never find out.

Nonsense, Christians who acted violently did so in spite of the teachings of Jesus, who harmed nobody. The Jihadists follow the word and deed of Muhammed.

I was married to a Muslim until I was widowered five years ago and I do not recognise the caricature of Muslims in those of my acquaintance. Most Muslims are not good Muslims, just as most Christians are not good Christians! Put another way, most Muslims are not Islamists.

It seems the more devout they get, the more dangerous they are. Devout Muslim = Bin Laden. Devout Christian = Mother Theresa.

Something is attracting Muslims to more extreme forms of Islam (ie Islamism).

The Koran?

There may be many reasons for that, but one factor is, well, imagine a young Muslim man in New York or London. He may want to integrate more with the western society, but he (quite rightly) does not want to abandon his entire heritage. but western society treats him with suspicion, even hostility. Getting a good job is hard. He faces name calling and sometimes even physical threats on a near daily basis. Papers such as the Daily Mail continually demonise him.

Cite where the Daily Mail demonizes peaceful Muslims or retract.

On the other hand, the Islamists welcome him with open arms and flatter his ego. The surprise is not that Islamism is attractive, but that it is not more attractive.

We cannot simply export the problem of Islamism. The world is too inter-connected and inter-dependent. We can't build a wall to keep ourselves safe from Islamism, even if it was moral to let Islamism do its worst to ordinary Muslims out of our view. A solution - a real solution, not just a sticking head-in-the-sand solution - has to be found.

Islam has been at war with non-Muslims since 611 AD, save for a brief 300 year interlude now ending. The fact the world is not more interconnected means we have to be even more diligent.

[micatala]

"Move away" is, in the final analysis, the argument of one incapable of showing their position holds it any merit, beyond hoping you'll end up out of shouting distance from his proclamations regarding just how danged contemptible you are.

Moderator Comment

Calling another member contemptible is not civil.

Please review the Rules.


______________

Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.

[keithprosser3]

Cite where the Daily Mail demonizes peaceful Muslims or retract.

I'll retract because I'm lazy.