The Purpose of Government-run Schools

[Shermana]

What is the purpose of schools? Replacement parenting for people who shouldn't be parents? Is school thus a social construct that serves to correct failures among those who are reproducing? What was wrong with the days of apprenticeship? Large families usually meant that learning and skills were taught by the Eldest, even reading.

To what degree is a public, tax-paid school helpful to society and how much cheaper would private and vocational schools be if there was not such a gargantuan competition as the tax-fed beast known as public education? What are the alternatives to produce a society of literate and work-capable people? Wouldn't it be better to train someone as an Electrician or Mechanic or Technician until they're 18 instead with some basic reading and math proficiency to do the job?

Is California's massive debt worth the "education" that it spent over half its budget on?

Should teachers be allowed to set their own rules and tenure standards or should the tax-payers who feed them their salary without a choice have some kind of power to regulate their performance and benefits and such?

What would happen if there was no public schools, but tax breaks and charities that helped reduce prices in addition to the lack of public-force-fed competition?

What perccentage of students actually care to learn what is being taught to them? What is the average cost per student per taxpayer and what class pays the heaviest burden?

Would the economy improve if the Public education system was replaced with a completely private system?

Now there is some sense to the idea of a mandatory policy of testing one's proficiency in a variety of fields to see where their best placement should be. Being able to write coherent sentences is important, but at what point does it become someone else's burden to make sure someone else's offspring can?

[East of Eden]

What is the purpose of schools? Replacement parenting for people who shouldn't be parents? Is school thus a social construct that serves to correct failures among those who are reproducing? What was wrong with the days of apprenticeship? Large families usually meant that learning and skills were taught by the Eldest, even reading.

To what degree is a public, tax-paid school helpful to society and how much cheaper would private and vocational schools be if there was not such a gargantuan competition as the tax-fed beast known as public education? What are the alternatives to produce a society of literate and work-capable people? Wouldn't it be better to train someone as an Electrician or Mechanic or Technician until they're 18 instead with some basic reading and math proficiency to do the job?

Is California's massive debt worth the "education" that it spent over half its budget on?

Should teachers be allowed to set their own rules and tenure standards or should the tax-payers who feed them their salary without a choice have some kind of power to regulate their performance and benefits and such?

What would happen if there was no public schools, but tax breaks and charities that helped reduce prices in addition to the lack of public-force-fed competition?

What perccentage of students actually care to learn what is being taught to them? What is the average cost per student per taxpayer and what class pays the heaviest burden?

Would the economy improve if the Public education system was replaced with a completely private system?

Now there is some sense to the idea of a mandatory policy of testing one's proficiency in a variety of fields to see where their best placement should be. Being able to write coherent sentences is important, but at what point does it become someone else's burden to make sure someone else's offspring can?

Many public school districts are in meltdown, with 50%+ dropout rates. Not surprising when you have a government run, teachers-union centric, monopoly. Any alternative would be better. The public school system could be shrunk by half by encouraging vouchers, charter schools, and to those so inclined, homeschooling. Competition is good, and would most likely improve education and reduce costs. In my town they spend $14K a student in the public schools, and the education ranks mediocre, at best. There has to be a better way.

[Wyvern]

Many public school districts are in meltdown, with 50%+ dropout rates. Not surprising when you have a government run, teachers-union centric, monopoly.

This doesn't explain the many districts that are performing well in the same system.

The public school system could be shrunk by half by encouraging vouchers, charter schools, and to those so inclined, homeschooling. Competition is good, and would most likely improve education and reduce costs. In my town they spend $14K a student in the public schools, and the education ranks mediocre, at best. There has to be a better way.

Just for the heck of it I did a compare between the schools in NM versus those in MN and strangely enough it isn't just the letters that are reversed. NM schools score below average in national testing while MN scores are all above average. Mind you this is talking about post secondary schools but NM has twice as many public institutions than private ones while MN has nearly twice as many private institutions than public ones. NM even has a better student/teacher ratio than MN and each spends roughly the same per student. The 14k per student spent in your district is nearly double that of your entire state. It seems pretty obvious that neither amount spent nor student teacher ratios are that good of indicators for performance. I would say look at those states and districts that have had a consistently high performing school system and emulate them. Much of what makes a school district perform well does not show up on tests or polls it is the attitudes towards education by the people in the district. If people don't want to learn you can throw all the money in the world at the problem and it isn't going to help much. NM schools have a better student to teacher ratio and spend nearly as much as their counterparts in MN so why is it that these two states performances are so different? There are already better ways you just have to find one that fits the people in your district before trying to pass national mandates to fix your local problem.

[East of Eden]

Many public school districts are in meltdown, with 50%+ dropout rates. Not surprising when you have a government run, teachers-union centric, monopoly.

This doesn't explain the many districts that are performing well in the same system.

The public school system could be shrunk by half by encouraging vouchers, charter schools, and to those so inclined, homeschooling. Competition is good, and would most likely improve education and reduce costs. In my town they spend $14K a student in the public schools, and the education ranks mediocre, at best. There has to be a better way.

Just for the heck of it I did a compare between the schools in NM versus those in MN and strangely enough it isn't just the letters that are reversed. NM schools score below average in national testing while MN scores are all above average. Mind you this is talking about post secondary schools but NM has twice as many public institutions than private ones while MN has nearly twice as many private institutions than public ones. NM even has a better student/teacher ratio than MN and each spends roughly the same per student. The 14k per student spent in your district is nearly double that of your entire state. It seems pretty obvious that neither amount spent nor student teacher ratios are that good of indicators for performance. I would say look at those states and districts that have had a consistently high performing school system and emulate them. Much of what makes a school district perform well does not show up on tests or polls it is the attitudes towards education by the people in the district. If people don't want to learn you can throw all the money in the world at the problem and it isn't going to help much. NM schools have a better student to teacher ratio and spend nearly as much as their counterparts in MN so why is it that these two states performances are so different? There are already better ways you just have to find one that fits the people in your district before trying to pass national mandates to fix your local problem.

Wyvern, PM me and I'll give you my un-PC theory.